1st Debate Scorecard

[BmorePat87]

(06-27-2019, 02:47 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Forgive me for saying this, but that's a rather narrow minded perspective and, IMO, completely ignores the ability of a human being to grow and change as they experience life.

I do not discredit her growth and I appreciate it, though she has carefully worded herself as merely believing it is not the governments place to be involved. As far as I know she has not explicitly said that she no longer holds her views about it being a sin or wrong.

I think anyone who spouted that much hate speech from this generation has no business leading the nation. Standards should increase. 

Quote:Buttigieg is an intelligent man with apparently zero policy ideas or positions.  I also don't appreciate his reaction to the police shooting in his city recently.  However, that's a minor, and obviously recent, concern for me.  Quite honestly the Democratic party is moving increasingly left and I strongly disagree with many of their policy positions such as healthcare for all with no private insurance, near unfettered immigration (legal or illegal), repaying student loans en masse for those who made poor decisions (for clarification I repaid all my student loans.  I also got myself into over $60k worth of credit card debt by the time I was 23.  It took a long time and a severe curtailing of my spending but I paid it off totally by my early thirties).  Lastly, their position on the criminal justice system is complete anathema to me.  The consequences of these policies is having severe effects in CA, WA and OR.  Not that they'll admit this in public though, ever.

Buttigieg actually went on the record months ago being in support of a version of medicare for all (who want it) where private insurance is still available to all who want that. There are numerous democrats who are not championing Bernie and Warren's ideas. 

[Dill]

(06-27-2019, 03:04 PM)Aquapod770 Wrote: She takes it to the level we should be at. 

America shouldn't be the world police. 

Yeah.  Should be China. Or a China-Russia alliance.

[Dill]

(06-27-2019, 11:55 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: She takes Anti-imperialism to a whole new level. Let's not forget that she said Syrian Leader Bashar Al-Assad is not America's enemy.

I think may she is thinking ahead, getting "visibility" for future, more serious runs at the office.  Right now, though, she simply does not know enough to be president or vice president or even, I think, to lead a House Committee. 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(06-27-2019, 04:41 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I do not discredit her growth and I appreciate it, though she has carefully worded herself as merely believing it is not the governments place to be involved. As far as I know she has not explicitly said that she no longer holds her views about it being a sin or wrong.

I don't care if she thinks it's a sin or is wrong, I care that she doesn't try and enact legislation that treats homosexuals as second class citizens.  Tolerance doesn't mean acceptance.  How many friends do you have that agree with you on every single issue?  We shouldn't expect more than that from our politicians.

Quote:I think anyone who spouted that much hate speech from this generation has no business leading the nation. Standards should increase. 

You'll have to cite some examples, not from her distant past, that would qualify as "hate speech".  That label gets bandied about far too easily in today's world for me to credit it without specific examples.

Quote:Buttigieg actually went on the record months ago being in support of a version of medicare for all (who want it) where private insurance is still available to all who want that. There are numerous democrats who are not championing Bernie and Warren's ideas. 

Yes, he has stated one policy position that I agree is a huge improvement over Warren and Sander's position.  He still doesn't have a lot of specifics to give.

[BmorePat87]

(06-27-2019, 05:22 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I don't care if she thinks it's a sin or is wrong, I care that she doesn't try and enact legislation that treats homosexuals as second class citizens.  Tolerance doesn't mean acceptance.  How many friends do you have that agree with you on every single issue?  We shouldn't expect more than that from our politicians.

I do care. None of my friends believe it is a sin or wrong and that's important to me. I absolutely expect that my leaders do not believe a human being is "wrong" for being gay or trans. Hence, my statement. 

Quote:You'll have to cite some examples, not from her distant past, that would qualify as "hate speech".  That label gets bandied about far too easily in today's world for me to credit it without specific examples.

I think her being in her 20's as a state legislator, calling people trying to legalize civil unions "homosexual extremists" who "force their values down the throats of the children in our schools" and then saying Hawaii didn't need laws to curb bullying against gay students because it would teach kids that being gay is "normal and natural". 

For me that's absolutely disgusting and qualifies. Any speech that dehumanizes people who are victims of discrimination or seeking equal rights is going to be called "hate speech" by me. This is likely something we may disagree on and that's ok.

Quote:Yes, he has stated one policy position that I agree is a huge improvement over Warren and Sander's position.  He still doesn't have a lot of specifics to give.

Fair and I think that his hesitation to roll out larger policy proposals in a field this large with so many throwing lots of plans out is a legitimate argument against him. It could also play to his favor once the dust settles. 

[Dill]

(06-27-2019, 06:52 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I think her being in her 20's as a state legislator, calling people trying to legalize civil unions "homosexual extremists" who "force their values down the throats of the children in our schools" and then saying Hawaii didn't need laws to curb bullying against gay students because it would teach kids that being gay is "normal and natural".

If she said that, that is VERY worrisome. Those statements embed her (though she is Hindi) in an evangelical right-wing world view.  Family first? Focus on the family? https://www.focusonthefamily.com/socialissues/sexuality/how-to-talk-to-your-children-about-homosexuality/how-to-talk-to-your-children-about-homosexuality

On top of that I just heard her interview on Fox News, where characterized the Mueller Report as a "search for collusion that found no collusion."

So time for the American people to move on.  As in no hearings, no more investigation into obstruction.

Fox audience loves her. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APzaspYbnLg

Assad is neither enemy nor adversary?
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/02/06/morning_joe_panel_vs_rep_tulsi_gabbard_is_assad_an_enemy_of_the_united_states.html

[BakertheBeast]

I like Julian Castro. Great name recognition.

I mistakenly voted for the Conman. I normally vote Republican. Now however, being how the Republicans in congress showed how cowardly and scared they are, putting party over country, I couldn't stomach voting for a Republican again.

[BmorePat87]

(06-28-2019, 02:03 AM)Dill Wrote: If she said that, that is VERY worrisome. Those statements embed her (though she is Hindi) in an evangelical right-wing world view.  Family first? Focus on the family? https://www.focusonthefamily.com/socialissues/sexuality/how-to-talk-to-your-children-about-homosexuality/how-to-talk-to-your-children-about-homosexuality

On top of that I just heard her interview on Fox News, where characterized the Mueller Report as a "search for collusion that found no collusion."

So time for the American people to move on.  As in no hearings, no more investigation into obstruction.

Fox audience loves her. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=APzaspYbnLg

Assad is neither enemy nor adversary?
https://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2019/02/06/morning_joe_panel_vs_rep_tulsi_gabbard_is_assad_an_enemy_of_the_united_states.html

Those were indeed her words when she was in the Hawaii legislature.