$20 Minimum Wage will leave many unemployed and business closures!

[Luvnit2]

It is sad for a business to have to close its doors, it is worse when they have to do it 30 years after opening. Newsome got his $20 starting minimum wage, whether your 15 or 70, you get $20 minimum to work at a fast food restaurant. Here is an example why it is crazy in California: They are also a committee who can raise the average wage each year. My argument for years has been separate adult fast food workers from minors. The adults can work all hours, perform all duties and some do live off employment at a fast food restaurant. As for minors, it will hurt their employment opportunities. Why hire teens 15 to 18 when you can get a more mature worker? This is one crazy law and Newsome thinks it is a great idea?????????

https://www.hoover.org/research/california-loses-nearly-10000-fast-food-jobs-after-20-minimum-wage-signed-last-fall

It is nothing short of bizarre that California would choose to specify a substantially higher minimum wage for its fast-food industry, which tends to hire workers who are much younger than other industries, which have a minimum wage of about $16 per hour. About 30 percent of fast-food workers are teens, and another 30 percent are between twenty and twenty-four years old. With 60 percent of its workforce twenty-four or younger, the fast-food industry stands in sharp contrast to the other industries, in which only about 13 percent of workers are that young.

Young workers have less experience than older workers and are still in the process of building skills, both of which tend to limit the amount of value that young workers can create for an employer. Young workers are also expensive from a human resources standpoint, because they require significant training and because they tend to move in and out of employment frequently, reflecting school schedules. Annual worker turnover in the fast-food industry exceeds 100 percent, which raises employer recruiting and training costs significantly.

Fast-food employers have few alternatives to a $20 minimum wage other than cutting  their workforces or raising prices, as fast-food profit margins are slim, averaging 5‒8 percent. Labor advocates typically argue for the need of a “living wage” when it comes to the pay of less-skilled workers. But this ignores the fact that many of those workers are part time, and it also ignores the fact that fast-food owners and their investors must receive adequate compensation for their time and capital. Living wages can mean no wages, which is what has happened for over 9,500 California fast-food workers since last September.



https://www.hoover.org/research/california-loses-nearly-10000-fast-food-jobs-after-20-minimum-wage-signed-last-fall

Outspoken California McDonald's franchisee becomes latest victim of 'gut-wrenching' closures
Scott Rodrick’s Stonestown Galleria restaurant announced it’s closing on June 23 after 30 years in business

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(06-24-2024, 02:53 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: It is sad for a business to have to close its doors, it is worse when they have to do it 30 years after opening. Newsome got his $20 starting minimum wage, whether your 15 or 70, you get $20 minimum to work at a fast food restaurant. Here is an example why it is crazy in California: They are also a committee who can raise the average wage each year. My argument for years has been separate adult fast food workers from minors. The adults can work all hours, perform all duties and some do live off employment at a fast food restaurant. As for minors, it will hurt their employment opportunities. Why hire teens 15 to 18 when you can get a more mature worker? This is one crazy law and Newsome thinks it is a great idea?????????

https://www.hoover.org/research/california-loses-nearly-10000-fast-food-jobs-after-20-minimum-wage-signed-last-fall

It is nothing short of bizarre that California would choose to specify a substantially higher minimum wage for its fast-food industry, which tends to hire workers who are much younger than other industries, which have a minimum wage of about $16 per hour. About 30 percent of fast-food workers are teens, and another 30 percent are between twenty and twenty-four years old. With 60 percent of its workforce twenty-four or younger, the fast-food industry stands in sharp contrast to the other industries, in which only about 13 percent of workers are that young.

Young workers have less experience than older workers and are still in the process of building skills, both of which tend to limit the amount of value that young workers can create for an employer. Young workers are also expensive from a human resources standpoint, because they require significant training and because they tend to move in and out of employment frequently, reflecting school schedules. Annual worker turnover in the fast-food industry exceeds 100 percent, which raises employer recruiting and training costs significantly.

Fast-food employers have few alternatives to a $20 minimum wage other than cutting  their workforces or raising prices, as fast-food profit margins are slim, averaging 5‒8 percent. Labor advocates typically argue for the need of a “living wage” when it comes to the pay of less-skilled workers. But this ignores the fact that many of those workers are part time, and it also ignores the fact that fast-food owners and their investors must receive adequate compensation for their time and capital. Living wages can mean no wages, which is what has happened for over 9,500 California fast-food workers since last September.



https://www.hoover.org/research/california-loses-nearly-10000-fast-food-jobs-after-20-minimum-wage-signed-last-fall

Outspoken California McDonald's franchisee becomes latest victim of 'gut-wrenching' closures
Scott Rodrick’s Stonestown Galleria restaurant announced it’s closing on June 23 after 30 years in business

Indeed.

The writing is on the wall and they do not even see it.

Self check out at grocery stores eliminate the need for clerks and baggers. Ordering kiosks are arriving in more and more restaurants, along with drone delivery services.
Some convince stores even have self pay to eliminate the need for a check-out person.

The tech was coming in, but upping the minimum wage artificially is really speeding up the process.

[Arturo Bandini]

If raising the salaries and taxing the billionnaires is bad for the economy.

Change the economy ffs !!!

[*michaelsean*]

(06-24-2024, 05:19 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: If raising the salaries and taxing the billionnaires is bad for the economy.

Change the economy ffs !!!

Well then let’s make it $50 an hour.

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(06-24-2024, 07:06 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Well then let’s make it $50 an hour.

Take it easy on the kid.

He doesn't get it.

[Luvnit2]

(06-24-2024, 05:19 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: If raising the salaries and taxing the billionnaires is bad for the economy.

Change the economy ffs !!!

I am curious, are you a US citizen?

As for taxing billionaires, within reason I have no issue doing it. But billionaires are a small percentage of business owners. Most business owners are happy to make $150K a year. Most fast food restaurant owners make around $60K to 100K per location. People think they are rich, they are not.

Anyone who feels $20 minimum wage for fast food workers has a screw loose. This will decimate an entire industry and make the people who use it the most the lower and middle class lose an economical breakfast or lunch. Only the upper classes can afford to pay $16 for a Big Mac or $18 for a Wendy's salad.

As I mentioned, jobs will be lost. People making $20 an hour will have to work for 2 people and be extremely fast or risk being fired. One thing it should do is give fast food the upper hand on great employees.

The minimum wage is like abortion, it is state controlled and not federal. This is the correct method, but again each state needs to look at a different minimum wage for a minor versus and adult. Think of this way, your babysitter now can be paid $20 an hour and get free meals. Can you compete and pay your baby sitter $20 an hour, if not many will lose their babysitter.

[SunsetBengal]

(06-24-2024, 05:19 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: If raising the salaries and taxing the billionnaires is bad for the economy.

Change the economy ffs !!!

The problem, as it seems to me, is that too many grown adults are content to work minimum wage jobs hoping to make a career of it. Minimum wage jobs are just that, jobs that most anyone can perform.  While many minimum wage jobs are stressful and high paced, the skill level at which to perform the basic duties is... minimum.  A lot of those people should consider expanding their skill sets to include a marketable skill that is worth substantially more than minimum wage.

Now, that State Governments are artificially raising the minimum wage, companies are forced to raise prices in order to maintain the same profit margins. Guess what? The offset in the cost differential makes an already slim profit margin go into the red. Now many companies are closing locations, or resorting to technology to replace human workers. (pay once and simply maintain, rather than deal with costly and unreliable humans)

I'm not saying that it's right, it's just how it is. Many of those same people that I spoke of acquiring marketable skills also came from disadvantaged backgrounds that might make learning those new skills difficult. However, the rule has always been that the easiest jobs pay less, the better paying jobs either require a lot more physical or mental effort, or a skill set that is rare.  

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(06-24-2024, 07:24 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I am curious, are you a US citizen?

As for taxing billionaires, within reason I have no issue doing it. But billionaires are a small percentage of business owners. Most business owners are happy to make $150K a year. Most fast food restaurant owners make around $60K to 100K per location. People think they are rich, they are not.

Anyone who feels $20 minimum wage for fast food workers has a screw loose. This will decimate an entire industry and make the people who use it the most the lower and middle class lose an economical breakfast or lunch. Only the upper classes can afford to pay $16 for a Big Mac or $18 for a Wendy's salad.

As I mentioned, jobs will be lost. People making $20 an hour will have to work for 2 people and be extremely fast or risk being fired. One thing it should do is give fast food the upper hand on great employees.

The minimum wage is like abortion, it is state controlled and not federal. This is the correct method, but again each state needs to look at a different minimum wage for a minor versus and adult. Think of this way, your babysitter now can be paid $20 an hour and get free meals. Can you compete and pay your baby sitter $20 an hour, if not many will lose their babysitter.

Currently it is eliminating the cheap, fast food industry because their prices are approaching those of places like Longhorn, Applebee's, Outback, etc... thus driving down the demand for their product.

They reduced the pool of workers, via  artificially increasing the minimum wage, and then reduced their demand via price increases.

Genius!

[Luvnit2]

(06-24-2024, 07:56 PM)FormerlyBengalRugby Wrote: Currently it is eliminating the cheap, fast food industry because their prices are approaching those of places like Longhorn, Applebee's, Outback, etc... thus driving down the demand for their product.

They reduced the pool of workers, via  artificially increasing the minimum wage, and then reduced their demand via price increases.

Genius!

My experience is when an industry like fast food is forced to pay workers more money, the other casual dining and fine dining will also be forced to pay more causing a spike in their prices. Fast food is at the bottom of the paid eat out category, anything impacting them with wages, will impact others in the industry as well.

The other issue is health insurance. Employers will be forced to reduce family coverage by paying less of the monthly premium or raising the deductible or both.

Get ready as predictions for health insurance are in the 8 to 10% increase range in 2025. People are dropping health insurance coverage now, many under 30 who came off Mom and Dad's plan at age 26. They are gambling they will pass less than their expensive premium if they get sick. They are banking on not being hospitalized. The other big driver of increased health insurance premiums is illegal immigrants using hospitals and they have no insurance. Guess who will pay for them, yes, the people with insurance and companies' premiums will spike.

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(06-24-2024, 08:11 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: My experience is when an industry like fast food is forced to pay workers more money, the other casual dining and fine dining will also be forced to pay more causing a spike in their prices. Fast food is at the bottom of the paid eat out category, anything impacting them with wages, will impact others in the industry as well.

The other issue is health insurance. Employers will be forced to reduce family coverage by paying less of the monthly premium or raising the deductible or both.

Get ready as predictions for health insurance are in the 8 to 10% increase range in 2025. People are dropping health insurance coverage now, many under 30 who came off Mom and Dad's plan at age 26. They are gambling they will pass less than their expensive premium if they get sick. They are banking on not being hospitalized. The other big driver of increased health insurance premiums is illegal immigrants using hospitals and they have no insurance. Guess who will pay for them, yes, the people with insurance and companies' premiums will spike.

I agree and am not arguing. Just stating the first wave impact.

That an facilities reducing hours so employees do not hit hourly markers to gain benefits.

Brutal machine.

[Arturo Bandini]

(06-24-2024, 07:06 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Well then let’s make it $50 an hour.

Why not ? My opinion is that every people who is decently contributing to the society, honestly should have a place to live, food on their table and school for their kids and a place to be healed if needed.

When everyone has that, we can discuss other things. 

[*michaelsean*]

(06-24-2024, 09:21 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: Why not ? My opinion is that every people who is decently contributing to the society, honestly should have a place to live, food on their table and school for their kids and a place to be healed if needed.

When everyone has that, we can discuss other things. 

Can’t argue with that logic, but let’s make it $100 an hour. $200,000 minimum income sounds nice. $400,000 for a two income household.

[Arturo Bandini]

(06-24-2024, 09:31 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Can’t argue with that logic, but let’s  make it $100 an hour. $200,000 minimum income sounds nice. $400,000 for a two income household.

When everyone has the necessary minimum ... You don't need 200 000$ to live decently right ? 

And we are not all mandatory to earn the same amount. A heart surgeon deserves more money than a senator if you ask me. 

You know, we are more acoutumate to strikes  ( I'm french and that's our thing ) and when people are striking you notice how useful they are in a society.

When you are that useful you need respect and respect starts with a decent life. 

[*pally*]

When the lowest rung in the pay scale is underpaid everyone up the line is too

[CKwi88]

Maybe the business owners just need to pull themselves up by the bootstraps.

Stop looking for handouts in the form of underpaid labor.

Time to tighten that belt. No more avocado toast, Starbucks runs or movie nights out.

[Millhouse]

I read a CNN article (link below) not too long ago citing a report of the most "impossibly unaffordable" cities in the world in regards to buying a home. Five U.S. cities made the top 10, four of which are in California to no surprise (San Jose, Los Angeles, San Francisco and San Diego). The fifth city is Honolulu.

I bring this up for this topic because the ability to buy a home is the one thing all hard working Americans used to be able to do, and has always been a solid barometer on the health of the economy.

California is extremely unhealthy as an economy for the working class out there. Instead of them passing laws and policies as band-aids to cover a gashing wound, like a $20 fast food wage, they should be re-thinking on how to reverse and prevent those gashing wounds that landed them in this spot in the first place. But I think most know this won't happen with the current political leaders out there.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/14/business/house-prices-impossibly-unaffordable-intl-hnk/index.html#:~:text=Perhaps%20unsurprisingly%2C%20the%20most%20expensive,markets%20surveyed%20in%20eight%20countries.

[*Nately120*]

(06-25-2024, 01:44 AM)CKwi88 Wrote: Maybe the business owners just need to pull themselves up by the bootstraps.

Stop looking for handouts in the form of underpaid labor.

Time to tighten that belt. No more avocado toast, Starbucks runs or movie nights out.

Or maybe people who run businesses that employ minimum wage workers need to see those as starter businesses to owning businesses where everyone makes $100k+ and not a permanent thing. 

[HarleyDog]

(06-25-2024, 10:27 AM)Millhouse Wrote: I read a CNN article (link below) not too long ago citing a report of the most "impossibly unaffordable" cities in the world in regards to buying a home. Five U.S. cities made the top 10, four of which are in California to no surprise (San Jose, Los Angeles, San Francisco and San Diego). The fifth city is Honolulu.

I bring this up for this topic because the ability to buy a home is the one thing all hard working Americans used to be able to do, and has always been a solid barometer on the health of the economy.

California is extremely unhealthy as an economy for the working class out there. Instead of them passing laws and policies as band-aids to cover a gashing wound, like a $20 fast food wage, they should be re-thinking on how to reverse and prevent those gashing wounds that landed them in this spot in the first place. But I think most know this won't happen with the current political leaders out there.

https://www.cnn.com/2024/06/14/business/house-prices-impossibly-unaffordable-intl-hnk/index.html#:~:text=Perhaps%20unsurprisingly%2C%20the%20most%20expensive,markets%20surveyed%20in%20eight%20countries.

People need to be honest with themselves. One reason the left is pushing for higher wages is to get more taxes. They don't care about a living wage. But, you know, that "tax the rich" thing.

[Arturo Bandini]

(06-25-2024, 11:39 AM)HarleyDog Wrote: People need to be honest with themselves. One reason the left is pushing for higher wages is to get more taxes. They don't care about a living wage. But, you know, that "tax the rich" thing.

If the raise less the taxes is superior to 0, it's still a step in the good direction right ?

[HarleyDog]

(06-25-2024, 12:09 PM)Arturo Bandini Wrote: If the raise less the taxes is superior to 0, it's still a step in the good direction right ?

Not that easy. If mass raises causes inflation which surpass your raise, what have you gained? Only the government gained. Take McDonalds for instance. Let's say your wages went from $12hr to $15hr, but the costs raise anywhere from 35% to, in some cases 100%, and this same inflation effects other businesses and prices are much higher, the government is the only one who benefits in more ways than one. Not only do you pay more in taxes, but also qualify for less assistance if you require it.