5/30 ruling against Trump

[Arturo Bandini]

(06-01-2024, 04:06 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Nah, I can admit they are both crappy choices, but you probably can't.

Biden is a ghost right ? Still better than the Antichrist if you ask me. 

Why do you guys are keeping the worst possible choice ? 

You just can blame yourselves, it's not everytime anyone else's fault.

[Belsnickel]

(05-31-2024, 07:50 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Well considering you guys are throwing a hissy over who a SCOTUS is politically aligned with....

Let's take a look at this little ethics code violation, maybe Bels can clear it up for us on how this applies to the Judge involved in this case:

Model Code of Judicial Conduct: Canon 4
Specifically Rule 4:1
(4)    solicit funds for, pay an assessment to, or make a contribution* to a political organization or a candidate for public office;




Wouldn't his $ donation be a major violation as he's not showing impartiality?

So, I looked into this a little further because I was smoking brisket and chicken for my Grand Master's Official Visit, yesterday, and got home late after the event. So I couldn't dig into this last night to learn more.

What I learned was that Merchan donated $15 to the Biden campaign and made two $10 donations to other progressive groups in 2020. Based on the language of New York's code of judicial conduct, that was a violation. After reading some of the reporting about this from folks at the time this news came out and reading more of the New York court's judicial conduct information, this would not have received any sort of disciplinary action because of the trivial amount involved. He would have likely received a notice of the violation with a reminder of the rules. It would not be seen as a "major violation" and would not rise to the level of recusal or dismissal for the case.

Because this information was known before trial began in the criminal trial there was every opportunity for Trump's defense team to take that up in a motion for Merchan's removal, which if Merchan dismissed could be appealed up the chain. I am not aware of any such motion which means Trump's team either didn't see it as important or missed the opportunity to use it in this case.

[Belsnickel]

(06-01-2024, 01:07 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Really?
Mitch who doesn't like Trump is now backing Trump after the verdict was announced.

He was already supporting Trump. When McConnell announced he would not be seeking the top party spot in the Senate after this Congress there was a lot of speculation about his support of Trump, but he announced his endorsement back then. This isn't anything new.

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(05-31-2024, 08:41 PM)pally Wrote: They are laughing because of Trump.

But more realistically the world is frightened, an unstable USA leads to chaos thoughout the world

That's your TDS showing again.

Biden is as bad, if not worse than DJT on the world stage. If you calculate by how much media they put out, flubs per hour of media, Biden is hands down the biggest village idiot of the two.

[*pally*]

(06-01-2024, 07:26 AM)FormerlyBengalRugby Wrote: That's your TDS showing again.

Biden is as bad, if not worse than DJT on the world stage. If you calculate by how much media they put out, flubs per hour of media, Biden is hands down the biggest village idiot of the two.

that is your right wing media brain speaking.  If you are judging international support for Trump  by the governments Russia, North Korea, and Hungary then I suppose you are right.  But, I'd rather stick with our traditional allies who have far more respect for Joe Biden than your guy

[*pally*]

(06-01-2024, 02:52 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: It is, but right now even Charles Manson would get the vote over Biden, so what does that say about your candidate?

It tells me that you are delusional

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(05-31-2024, 11:16 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: It's only an insult because you want it to be. The word itself is not inherently insulting.


Total voter block.


That would be illogical. Democrat voters aren't going to change their vote based on Trump being found guilty of a felony because they already weren't voting for him. Also, when broken down, roughly 25% of Trump voters said they would reconsider their vote if he were found guilty of a felony. The percentage was higher among independents. Of course, again, Democrats wouldn't really be changing because they already weren't voting for him.


Out of everything you listed, only the Stormy Daniels testimony would be something I would see as a leverage point. Though Trump's team opened the door for it and did not object in the moment, which makes it difficult to appeal on it down the road.

There wasn't actually anything off about the jury instructions, as much as some in the media are making it seem. The law wasn't changed so he could be charged and up-charging is a part of the law he was charged with.

When opening and calling someone naive, it is belittling. If I did that in my professional life, it would result in numerous complaints, and rightly so.

Could you post the source of your numbers so I could see the poll, so I am not guessing at numbers and methodology? I could easily see democrats answers that yes to the poll, pending how it was done, and thus be that 20-25%. The verdict did not hurt DJT's voter base, and an appeal will follow in due time, and we will see how it plays out.

[*pally*]

(05-31-2024, 11:36 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I have. not read entire thread, but couple of reasons why Trump wins on appeal.
1. Judge is conflicted,against NY law for a judge to donate to Biden.
2. Crimes were not identified by prosecution upfront and judge allowed it (see #1)
3. Judge our nit allow defense to present expert witnesss on election fraud with no limitations. (See #1)
4. Judge failed to give fair jury instructions (see #1)

CNN legal experts are saying bogus conviction.

My last point, 2 things to know after conviction, Trump raised 49 million dollars in less than 24 hours and WAIT FOR IT,TRUMP WENT UP 6 points in 1sr poll after conviction.

1)  Both Justice's Alito and Thomas have told the world that a judge cannot be conflcited due to family members politics.
2) the charges were explained to him at the preliminary hearing.  He said he understood them.  If he didn't he had an opportunity to ask then and there/  He also has a very expensive legal team that could have broken down the charges.
3) That's not true at all.  Where their "expert" was restricted from talking about FEDERAL law which had no bearing on the state case and from explaining specific points o the law which is the job of the judge 
4) that will be a matter of opinion.  The jury was able to ask questions and did so.  

(06-01-2024, 01:07 AM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Says the guy who supports a brain dead POTUS who has ruined our country. Americans believe in fairness, it is obvious to most the same thing Trump did, HRC did and got. Fine.

NY took at misdemeanor and turned into. Federal felony. But because it is the guy Biden can’t beat on November 5, they attempt to jail him.

Please spare us your holy BS, no conservative or independent is buying it.

You know that is the kind of absolute BS that is ridiculous and proves you are letting yourself be led by lies and propaganda.  How has this country been "ruined"  And if this time and place are ruined, I feel for you if times really got tough.  Are things perfect heck no. but they weren't during the previous administration either.   

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(06-01-2024, 07:34 AM)pally Wrote: that is your right wing media brain speaking.  If you are judging international support for Trump  by the governments Russia, North Korea, and Hungary then I suppose you are right.  But, I'd rather stick with our traditional allies who have far more respect for Joe Biden than your guy

I said nothing of support, only of how big of an idiot they look like to the rest of the world, but your left wing brain only lets to read what your emotions let you see. I do lean to the right in this case, as DJT is the better choice for the direction I hope the country goes. You are all in on the left, for a similar reason.

I can admit they are both bad choices, am not offended by pointing out DJT's flaws and faults, and am not lockstep with the republican party, or most of the right leaning posters on here on major issues.

The left, such as yourself, are pretty much the opposite.

Plus look at the vitriolic crazy the left is posting in this thread...

wow

[Belsnickel]

(06-01-2024, 07:37 AM)FormerlyBengalRugby Wrote: When opening and calling someone naive, it is belittling. If I did that in my professional life, it would result in numerous complaints, and rightly so.

Could you post the source of your numbers so I could see the poll, so I am not guessing at numbers and methodology? I could easily see democrats answers that yes to the poll, pending how it was done, and thus be that 20-25%. The verdict did not hurt DJT's voter base, and an appeal will follow in due time, and we will see how it plays out.

I called the take naive, not you individually. There is a difference. I focus on the action or statement and not the individual when I make statements like that for a reason. Someone making a naive statement does not make them inherently naive, just that particular statement.

Here is the Marist poll those numbers come from (which I didn't remember exactly correct because I was just basing it on recall memory from a summary article on the polling): https://maristpoll.marist.edu/wp-content/uploads/2024/05/NPR_PBS-NewsHour_Marist-Poll_USA-NOS-and-Tables_202405301406.pdf

Here is also a poll that Reuters/Ipsos did over the past couple of days on the topic: https://www.reuters.com/world/us/one-10-republicans-less-likely-vote-trump-after-guilty-verdict-reutersipsos-poll-2024-05-31/

[Mike M (the other one)]

(06-01-2024, 07:36 AM)pally Wrote: It tells me that you are delusional

Take a look in the mirror and look at the rants you post on here before you even attempt to call someone else delusional.

I am not a fan of the R candidate, but it's who they want. OTOH, Biden is turning us into a 3rd world country with all these immigrants fleeing into the US. We can't handle another 4 years of well he was gonna do something, or Yaaa he did something, but experts agree it really amounts to nothing. And I know you are gonna blame the R's that's your natural stance. He had several years he could have done something when it was spiraling out of control. 

[StoneTheCrow]

(06-01-2024, 01:08 AM)samhain Wrote: I think you would feel better if you went out and shot some liberals.  If you really love Trump and want to save the country, you'll do it.  If not, you are a traitor.

WTF is this?

[samhain]

I hope people who do not support Trump are paying attention here.

You might think that there is some iota of reason left in the people who remain as his supporters. That they are your next door neighbors, friends and family members and will not pick the worship of a celebrity over your life.

You are likely wrong.

What we will likely find out after this verdict is that things are going to get violent. it will probably be sporadic terrorism and seemingly random. His followers have desired political violence since Jan 6. Some more extreme followers have wanted it long before. The old "we have a lot of guns so you better do what we say" narrative looms large.

My suggestion is that anyone, even conservative (lol) that do not view themselves as unquestioning Trump lickspittles had better pay attention to their surroundings. Mind work conversations and discussions at family gatherings. Watch what you say to your neighbors.

What they are telling you right now is that even a small degree of accountability on Trump's behalf is unacceptable. How do you think they feel about the election? If DJT wins, he will be much too busy punishing his enemies to govern at any real level. If he authorizes police or military to deal with immigrants and gangs, how far off do you think we are from you being next on the list as political enemies?

If Biden wins, the violence might be even worse. They are making it known that there is only one acceptable outcome for them, or else. It will be them shirtless with buffalo horns screaming at the top of their lungs at various federal buildings about QAnon, only this time many more will be willing to kill.

In short, get ready for the followers to do his bidding. They are no longer the GOP as we have known it. They were given a chance to replace him against a very weak Democrat incumbent and overwhelmingly declined. They are his to command, unquestioned, and without regard to their previous moral code or religious beliefs.

Listen to them when they tell you what they are going to do to us. We're getting very close.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(06-01-2024, 11:14 AM)StoneTheCrow Wrote: WTF is this?

Looks like to me some people's True Colors are shining thru.

[StoneTheCrow]

(06-01-2024, 11:22 AM)samhain Wrote: I hope people who do not support Trump are paying attention here.

You might think that there is some iota of reason left in the people who remain as his supporters. That they are your next door neighbors, friends and family members and will not pick the worship of a celebrity over your life.

You are likely wrong.

What we will likely find out after this verdict is that things are going to get violent. it will probably be sporadic terrorism and seemingly random. His followers have desired political violence since Jan 6. Some more extreme followers have wanted it long before. The old "we have a lot of guns so you better do what we say" narrative looms large.

My suggestion is that anyone, even conservative (lol) that do not view themselves as unquestioning Trump lickspittles had better pay attention to their surroundings. Mind work conversations and discussions at family gatherings. Watch what you say to your neighbors.

What they are telling you right now is that even a small degree of accountability on Trump's behalf is unacceptable. How do you think they feel about the election? If DJT wins, he will be much too busy punishing his enemies to govern at any real level. If he authorizes police or military to deal with immigrants and gangs, how far off do you think we are from you being next on the list as political enemies?

If Biden wins, the violence might be even worse. They are making it known that there is only one acceptable outcome for them, or else. It will be them shirtless with buffalo horns screaming at the top of their lungs at various federal buildings about QAnon, only this time many more will be willing to kill.

In short, get ready for the followers to do his bidding. They are no longer the GOP as we have known it. They were given a chance to replace him against a very weak Democrat incumbent and overwhelmingly declined. They are his to command, unquestioned, and without regard to their previous moral code or religious beliefs.

Listen to them when they tell you what they are going to do to us. We're getting very close.

[Luvnit2]

(06-01-2024, 11:22 AM)samhain Wrote: I hope people who do not support Trump are paying attention here.

You might think that there is some iota of reason left in the people who remain as his supporters. That they are your next door neighbors, friends and family members and will not pick the worship of a celebrity over your life.

You are likely wrong.

What we will likely find out after this verdict is that things are going to get violent. it will probably be sporadic terrorism and seemingly random. His followers have desired political violence since Jan 6. Some more extreme followers have wanted it long before. The old "we have a lot of guns so you better do what we say" narrative looms large.

My suggestion is that anyone, even conservative (lol) that do not view themselves as unquestioning Trump lickspittles had better pay attention to their surroundings. Mind work conversations and discussions at family gatherings. Watch what you say to your neighbors.

What they are telling you right now is that even a small degree of accountability on Trump's behalf is unacceptable. How do you think they feel about the election? If DJT wins, he will be much too busy punishing his enemies to govern at any real level. If he authorizes police or military to deal with immigrants and gangs, how far off do you think we are from you being next on the list as political enemies?

If Biden wins, the violence might be even worse. They are making it known that there is only one acceptable outcome for them, or else. It will be them shirtless with buffalo horns screaming at the top of their lungs at various federal buildings about QAnon, only this time many more will be willing to kill.

In short, get ready for the followers to do his bidding. They are no longer the GOP as we have known it. They were given a chance to replace him against a very weak Democrat incumbent and overwhelmingly declined. They are his to command, unquestioned, and without regard to their previous moral code or religious beliefs.

Listen to them when they tell you what they are going to do to us. We're getting very close.

You should spew a whole bunch of propaganda. It appears you just pull out your BS. Please show us where conservatives have said they were going do anything other than vote on Nov 5.

You seem to be the one trying and hoping Trump supporters start shooting people. You are on record. I have seen liberal Stephen Smith speculate violence is coming, I could see it happening also. Huge difference from saying it may happen and wanting it to happen.

I hate. violence.I hated it when BLM protesters (Antifa and liberals) were violently protesting and urning hinges to the ground in liberal cities also.

Yet, I have never seen you denounce those protests.

[Luvnit2]

(06-01-2024, 07:46 AM)pally Wrote: 1)  Both Justice's Alito and Thomas have told the world that a judge cannot be conflcited due to family members politics.
2) the charges were explained to him at the preliminary hearing.  He said he understood them.  If he didn't he had an opportunity to ask then and there/  He also has a very expensive legal team that could have broken down the charges.
3) That's not true at all.  Where their "expert" was restricted from talking about FEDERAL law which had no bearing on the state case and from explaining specific points o the law which is the job of the judge 
4) that will be a matter of opinion.  The jury was able to ask questions and did so.  

You know that is the kind of absolute BS that is ridiculous and proves you are letting yourself be led by lies and propaganda.  How has this country been "ruined"  And if this time and place are ruined, I feel for you if times really got tough.  Are things perfect heck no. but they weren't during the previous administration either.   

As I said, I am not a scholar, but many are saying this trial had numerous reversible errors.

Trump was the first person convicted in NY,first in long history of NY to be convicted on these charges. I understand you hate Trump, but think about the boomerang effect long term.

Harry Reid in 2014 changed the rule for judicial nominees from 60 votes to 50 votes to approve them. McConnell gave a speech and said it was a huge mistake and would cost Democrats later.

The result is we now have a 6-3 conservative (constitutional) SupremeCourt. I don’t know what the fallout will be in the future. But,there will be one.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(06-01-2024, 11:22 AM)samhain Wrote: I hope people who do not support Trump are paying attention here.

You might think that there is some iota of reason left in the people who remain as his supporters.  That they are your next door neighbors, friends and family members and will not pick the worship of a celebrity over your life.  

You are likely wrong.  

What we will likely find out after this verdict is that things are going to get violent.  it will probably be sporadic terrorism and seemingly random.  His followers have desired political violence since Jan 6.  Some more extreme followers have wanted it long before.  The old "we have a lot of guns so you better do what we say" narrative looms large.  

My suggestion is that anyone, even conservative (lol) that do not view themselves as unquestioning Trump lickspittles had better pay attention to their surroundings.  Mind work conversations and discussions at family gatherings.  Watch what you say to your neighbors.  

What they are telling you right now is that even a small degree of accountability on Trump's behalf is unacceptable.  How do you think they feel about the election?  If DJT wins, he will be much too busy punishing his enemies to govern at any real level.  If he authorizes police or military to deal with immigrants and gangs, how far off do you think we are from you being next on the list as political enemies?  

If Biden wins, the violence might be even worse.  They are making it known that there is only one acceptable outcome for them, or else.  It will be them shirtless with buffalo horns screaming at the top of their lungs at various federal buildings about QAnon, only this time many more will be willing to kill.    

In short, get ready for the followers to do his bidding.  They are no longer the GOP as we have known it.  They were given a chance to replace him against a very weak Democrat incumbent and overwhelmingly declined.  They are his to command, unquestioned, and without regard to their previous moral code or religious beliefs.  

Listen to them when they tell you what they are going to do to us.  We're getting very close.

Lack of faith in the Political, Justice and the hate spewed from the Left for so many years has been building up?

[hollodero]

(06-01-2024, 07:26 AM)FormerlyBengalRugby Wrote: That's your TDS showing again.

Biden is as bad, if not worse than DJT on the world stage. If you calculate by how much media they put out, flubs per hour of media, Biden is hands down the biggest village idiot of the two.

No he is not. This starts with Biden not rage-tweeting every other day about all kinds of personal enemies, that really goes a long way. That was embarrassing beyond belief, how the leader of the most powerful nation called people dogs, dumb as rocks and all that on an almost daily basis. Also, Trump said so much flat-out ignorant, uneducated and dumb stuff that even Mr. Cannibal does not quite match it. Please cast doubt on that, I could easily make a list lasting several cilometers, or miles as you metric system-denying folks would say, of mind-boggingly moronic stuff Mr. Trump has said. For many people, it's the most incomprehensible thing of all, how someone so demonstrably unintelligent could ever persuade anyone of anything.

Biden also is not making lewd comments about other leader's wives, does not shake their hand until they are visibly shaken, doesn't push them out of the way to be in photos, the formal things. He did an ok job in uniting the western front against Putin and was instrumental in getting Sweden into NATO. Sure, some other stuff, not so great. And also sure, quite many people including me are taken aback by the democrats having nothing better to offer than a visibly aging man that can't quite be defended against allegations of a mental decline any more. But Trump, he was something else and his apparently inevitable return is much feared, not welcomed.

(06-01-2024, 04:06 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Nah, I can admit they are both crappy choices, but you probably can't.

? I have yet to come across one person who seriously claims that Biden is a great choice. It seems to me that no one thinks so.
If only the country could actually unite behind the notion that actually has a clear majority: These two people are crappy choices. Almost everyone on this board apparently thinks so, barring the very few actual Trump fans. Biden fans, no such thing.

But that's Americans: We have two crappy choices - again.
And also Americans: Let' not do anything about that, instead let me put in all my energy to demonstrate how your guy is crappier than mine.

[Arturo Bandini]

(06-01-2024, 04:06 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Nah, I can admit they are both crappy choices, but you probably can't.

Mate, every country in the world only have crappy choices. Do not think it's an american thing especially in 2024.