63% of recent IRS audits directed at $200,000 or less earners?

[Luvnit2]

Biden and the Democrats promised in their multi trillion reduce (direct link to adding to inflation) inflation act bill they needed 87,000 new IRS agents to go after the large companies and promised the middle class would not be audited more.

Fast forward to 2024 and now we know 63% of audits in 2023 were directed at the middle class.

One more lie from Biden and Democrats. Republicans rightly predicted the IRS would go after the middle class. Why the middle class? Simple, they can't afford accountants and lawyers to fight them.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/irs-tax-collectors-audit-middle-class-tigta-5071d622

IRS’s Most Wanted: The $200,000 Man
Sixty-three percent of new audits last year were aimed at middle-class filers.

[*pally*]

Ok...so put that number in perspective...is it higher or lower than the previous years?

The Inflation Reduction Act called for an increase in the staffing of the IRS over a series of years until 2031. The 87,000 included clerks, processors, IT folks, as well as replacement and new auditors. It never was just auditors despite the talking points from Trump and Fox

[JustWinBaby]

(04-13-2024, 01:56 PM)pally Wrote: Ok...so put that number in perspective...is it higher or lower than the previous years?

So which is it?

[*pally*]

(04-14-2024, 11:59 PM)JustWinBaby Wrote: So which is it?

Ask Luvnit

[Mike M (the other one)]

hard to tell, IRS stopped a long time ago putting out their annual report, that transparency thing we all like.
Seems them and Syracuse University had problems. Syracuse accused them of targeting the poor and showing rates of audits for the 1% went from 8% to ~2%.

that's about all i could find, but i didn't spend much time on it.

[JustWinBaby]

(04-15-2024, 12:15 AM)pally Wrote: Ask Luvnit

I mean, if you're going to challenge or disagree with someone's numbers then I assume you have a source for what the actual numbers are.

[*pally*]

(04-15-2024, 12:33 AM)JustWinBaby Wrote: I mean, if you're going to challenge or disagree with someone's numbers then I assume you have a source for what the actual numbers are.

I wasn’t challenging or disagreeing with the number provided. I suspect 63% is accurate. But without context, which he failed to provide, there is no way of knowing whether 63% was good or bad. For all we know, in previous years, the rate was say 90% in which case 63% was a dramatic improvement.

It is like complaining about how bad crime is under Biden without pointing out that the worst year for crime in recent history was 2020 thus current numbers are improving from the Trump administration

[Luvnit2]

Is Yahoo Fox news? I included a Wall Street journal article on the OP Pally, yet as always you deflect with the source. 

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/middle-class-earners-most-targeted-101000528.html

Middle-class earners are the most targeted group for IRS audits

If you thought President Joe Biden’s mandate that the Internal Revenue Service audit more ultra wealthy and fewer middle-class filers is in full swing, guess again.

In fact, 63% of new audits as of Summer 2023 targeted taxpayers with income of less than $200,000, according to figures compiled by The Wall Street Journal’s editorial board, which then dubbed the $200,000 man the “IRS’s most wanted.”

[Luvnit2]

(04-15-2024, 12:33 AM)JustWinBaby Wrote: I mean, if you're going to challenge or disagree with someone's numbers then I assume you have a source for what the actual numbers are.

I provide sources all the time, provided them in the OP and not from Fox.
Pally is laser focused on defending Joe Biden, so much so she never herself does research, just attacks mine. 

[SunsetBengal]

(04-13-2024, 01:56 PM)pally Wrote: Ok...so put that number in perspective...is it higher or lower than the previous years?

The Inflation Reduction Act called for an increase in the staffing of the IRS over a series of years until 2031.  The 87,000 included clerks, processors, IT folks, as well as replacement and new auditors.  It never was just auditors despite the talking points from Trump and Fox

Does it really matter?  Seems like targeting the middle class is targeting the middle class, weather they're going after the $150K earner or the $200K earner.

[*pally*]

(04-15-2024, 12:59 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I provide sources all the time, provided them in the OP and not from Fox.
Pally is laser focused on defending Joe Biden, so much so she never herself does research, just attacks mine. 

Your research apparently means using a different Murdoch organization.

The question remains...Is 63% an improvement over previous years, the same, or worse?  Is the number trending the right direction or not?

[Mike M (the other one)]

(04-15-2024, 01:24 PM)pally Wrote: Your research apparently means using a different Murdoch organization.

The question remains...Is 63% an improvement over previous years, the same, or worse?  Is the number trending the right direction or not?

not so sure that matters. Everyone and their mothers claim they are not targeting the middle/lower class, but that's BS. 

It's much cheaper and easier to target those classes because the lack the necessary funds to fight the audits and has been their targets for along time. 


those numbers need to be flipped, they should have at least a 50% audit rate on top earners. I'd prefer even more 60-40 or as high as you can. If they know they have a good shot at being audited, they will start filing correctly. 

The top earners is where the money is, who cares if John Doe screwed them out of $500 when  Mr Bigwig is screwing them out of $1.5 million. 

They recently got $480m off of 1600 millionaires... Think they are going to get that much off of 1600 Middle/Lower Class people? I doubt they even make $100k from going after them. 

[*pally*]

(04-15-2024, 04:12 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: not so sure that matters. Everyone and their mothers claim they are not targeting the middle/lower class, but that's BS. 

It's much cheaper and easier to target those classes because the lack the necessary funds to fight the audits and has been their targets for along time. 


those numbers need to be flipped, they should have at least a 50% audit rate on top earners. I'd prefer even more 60-40 or as high as you can. If they know they have a good shot at being audited, they will start filing correctly. 

The top earners is where the money is, who cares if John Doe screwed them out of $500 when  Mr Bigwig is screwing them out of $1.5 million. 

They recently got $480m off of 1600 millionaires... Think they are going to get that much off of 1600 Middle/Lower Class people? I doubt they even make $100k from going after them. 

I'm not arguing that 63% is the desired result.  What I asked is for that 63% to put into perspective previous years. 

[Mike M (the other one)]

(04-15-2024, 04:41 PM)pally Wrote: I'm not arguing that 63% is the desired result.  What I asked is for that 63% to put into perspective previous years. 

That is a hard number to find for a YOY but in 19 it was higher (70%)
And that was about the last active data i could find. 

Most seem to talk about how the IRS attacks Blacks at a rate of 4x compared to non-blacks and usually the audit rate is in the 50% range for lower class. 

So I can't imagine it's moved alot. 

[NATI BENGALS]

Am I supposed to be shocked and appalled that the majority of audits happen to the segment that has the majority of the filings?

[SunsetBengal]

(04-15-2024, 07:46 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Am I supposed to be shocked and appalled that the majority of audits happen to the segment that has the majority of the filings?

That depends upon if that segment of the population actually drew enough red flags to merit that high of a percentage of audits, or if these were just randomly conducted to scare the general public into submission.

[NATI BENGALS]

(04-15-2024, 07:53 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That depends upon if that segment of the population actually drew enough red flags to merit that high of a percentage of audits, or if these were just randomly conducted to scare the general public into submission.

I mean a quick search results tells me $200,000 and below covers about 88% of US households.

So that would mean the other 37% of audits going to the other 12% of households that are earning over $200,000.

Unless you are a publication looking to give your audience the outrage and fear they came looking for, these seem like reasonable numbers to me.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(04-15-2024, 07:46 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Am I supposed to be shocked and appalled that the majority of audits happen to the segment that has the majority of the filings?

LOL now it matters? 
sorry buddy but we are using %'s not total numbers. Each group should be 50% random audits unless there's an anomaly happening. Did you even see my post how they got 1600 millionaires for $480m? to me that says we need more audits for that group.

I mean god effing dam, you harp about how the rich don't pay their fair share but you're willing to let them skip on their fair share of audits?

absolutely Bogglling

[NATI BENGALS]

(04-15-2024, 09:37 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: LOL now it matters? 
sorry buddy but we are using %'s not total numbers. Each group should be 50% random audits unless there's an anomaly happening. Did you even see my post how they got 1600 millionaires for $480m? to me that says we need more audits for that group.

I mean god effing dam, you harp about how the rich don't pay their fair share but you're willing to let them skip on their fair share of audits?

absolutely Bogglling

Now what matters? Math? And this is funny. I’m pretty sure you support the GOP. The ones who were totally against giving more funding to the IRS, and the ones who had a budget proposal last year that would have cut IRS funding so much so that it actually increased the deficit because it would have hindered our ability to collect.

https://www.budget.senate.gov/chairman/newsroom/press/memorandum-cuts-to-irs-tax-enforcement-would-increase-the-deficit#:~:text=January%209%2C%202023%20%2D%20CBO%20estimated,%24114%20billion%20over%20ten%20years

Didn’t see anything about random audits.

37% of audits going to the top 12% sounds reasonable to me.

If it was entirely random. Sure 50/50 would be ok, maybe even more skewed toward the rich.

But from what I’ve seen this is saying 63% of total audits are households making $200,000 or less. And like I said. That is roughly 88% of the country.

I’d be fine with everybody making over idk let’s say 10 million to be automatically audited.

[HarleyDog]

(04-16-2024, 12:19 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: But from what I’ve seen this is saying 63% of total audits are households making $200,000 or less. And like I said. That is roughly 88% of the country.

It sounds reasonable, but the middle class is not the ones that are supposed to be targeted. Or,  so that's what we've been told.