Anthem Protest Bengals

[rezolve11]

Doesn't bother me either way. I'm just sick of hearing about it.

[*Nately120*]

I've been pretty fascinated by people's reaction to this more than anything. It's just my personal belief, but I feel like we spend too much time worrying about respecting "the flag" and not enough time respecting the actual land, air, water, and people that make up this country. You never see someone tell a guy who just threw his Bic Mac wrapper or a cigarette butt on the ground to pick it up because veterans fought for this country and that's disrespectful. Did people fight for this country or fight for the flag? Is that why it's a slap in the face to veterans if you burn the flag but no one worries about the veterans' feelings when we poison the water or air? I know, hippie stuff. Save the earth and all that crap.

I also find the social barriers that accompany the anthem to be interesting. I worked at a stadium and you could hear the anthem inside and out when it was played. People in the stands were expected to remove their hats, stand, and shut up. People outside or in the concourse who could still hear the anthem kept walking and talking and drinking and kept their hats on, etc. I assume there is a rule that you aren't expected to observe the anthem if you can't see the flag at the time? It just seemed odd. Additionally, in some of the pics of the protesters you see photographers walking around and taking pictures and doing their jobs. Is that ok because they're doing something? What are the actual rules here?

It also seemed to be in poor taste to me, or at least annoyingly pandering when JJ Watt runs around with the flag throwing up citizen salutes like he's a GI Joe come to life...but people seem to eat that stuff up.

Anyways, more teams and more players and more races of players are supporting this sort of protest so you'd better brace yourselves in case someone on the Bengals joins ranks. The Steelers have a legit veteran on their team, so they'd probably be the last team to do it. Great, we can all just jump on that bandwagon lest we make the troops mad. Eep.

[Essex Johnson]

(08-22-2017, 06:03 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: A couple of things in regard to the Anthem protests.  As far as I can tell, there are rules and procedure for observance of the flag and National Anthem.  However, there is no punishment for failure to observe the flag code.  So, if a player or fan in attendance wishes to make a statement by not observing flag code, that is basically their choice.  Who are we to attempt to know what's going on in the hearts and minds of people that we don't even know?  If any Bengals chose that route, I would be disappointed, but they may have good reason.  Not for me to judge.  Personally, I choose to observe the flag code. (unless of course I've pregamed a little too hard, and forget what I'm doing)  


http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/02/national-anthem-etiquette-what-to-do-at-a-sporting-event-or-political-rally/


The actual flag code, if anyone wishes to observe proper procedure.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/36/301


Notice how the official flag code always says "should", and not "must".  Meaning to me, that they left room for just this sort of situation.

I believe people are missing the issue it's not about them kneeling or sitting it's about the decision of the owners deciding not to enforce them kneeling or sitting my point is when they enter the field they are under the owners supervision , they work for the owner. For example let's say I was working on Martin Luther King day and they said they were going to take a moment of silence and I would not do it I could lose my job. I believe the owner has the right to allow them to stay behind in the locker room if they are not going to honor the flag due to it being an embarrassment to the owner and hurting their business

[Brimey]

Half the guys here are probably buying beer and nachos as the anthem is played in stadium, and scratching themselves on the couch while it's played on TV. I don't agree with their stance, but hey, it's harmless. Seriously.

[SunsetBengal]

(08-22-2017, 07:24 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I've been pretty fascinated by people's reaction to this more than anything.  It's just my personal belief, but I feel like we spend too much time worrying about respecting "the flag" and not enough time respecting the actual land, air, water, and people that make up this country.  You never see someone tell a guy who just threw his Bic Mac wrapper or a cigarette butt on the ground to pick it up because veterans fought for this country and that's disrespectful.  Did people fight for this country or fight for the flag?  Is that why it's a slap in the face to veterans if you burn the flag but no one worries about the veterans' feelings when we poison the water or air?  I know, hippie stuff.  Save the earth and all that crap.

I also find the social barriers that accompany the anthem to be interesting.  I worked at a stadium and you could hear the anthem inside and out when it was played.  People in the stands were expected to remove their hats, stand, and shut up.  People outside or in the concourse who could still hear the anthem kept walking and talking and drinking and kept their hats on, etc.  I assume there is a rule that you aren't expected to observe the anthem if you can't see the flag at the time?  It just seemed odd.  Additionally, in some of the pics of the protesters you see photographers walking around and taking pictures and doing their jobs.  Is that ok because they're doing something?  What are the actual rules here?  

It also seemed to be in poor taste to me, or at least annoyingly pandering when JJ Watt runs around with the flag throwing up citizen salutes like he's a GI Joe come to life...but people seem to eat that stuff up.    

Anyways, more teams and more players and more races of players are supporting this sort of protest so you'd better brace yourselves in case someone on the Bengals joins ranks.  The Steelers have a legit veteran on their team, so they'd probably be the last team to do it.  Great, we can all just jump on that bandwagon lest we make the troops mad.  Eep.

I copied the actual flag code, in post #61.

[BritishBengal]

History will look favourably upon those players taking a stand. It's baffling to me that those opposing these protests can't see the more important, bigger picture.

[*Nately120*]

(08-22-2017, 07:38 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I copied the actual flag code, in post #61.

Interesting.  I was unaware the hand on the heart thing was a "rule" outside of grade school's morning salute.  I'm thinking that is something we've let go over the years, though.

[*pally*]

Why do we even play the anthem before a sporting event? The NFL isn't some national level team or anything. I love our country but where else in American society besides the military do we play the anthem before going to work? Shoot we don't even play it at the beginning of the school day, a government meeting, or a court proceeding.

I would not choose to protest the way some players have...but I understand why some of chosen this method.

[SunsetBengal]

(08-22-2017, 08:20 PM)pally Wrote: Why do we even play the anthem before a sporting event?  The NFL isn't some national level team or anything. I love our country but where else in American society besides the military do we play the anthem before going to work?  Shoot we don't even play it at the beginning of the school day, a government meeting, or a court proceeding.

I would not choose to protest the way some players have...but I understand why some of chosen this method.

History of National Anthem at sporting events

Fairly interesting article.  ESPN not my favorite source, but they do a good job telling this story.

[Bengalholic]

(08-22-2017, 07:28 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: I believe people are missing the issue it's not about them kneeling or sitting it's about the decision of the owners deciding not to enforce them kneeling or sitting my point is when they enter the field they are under the owners supervision , they work for the owner. For example let's say I was working on Martin Luther King day and they said they were going to take a moment of silence and I would not do it I could lose my job. I believe the owner has the right to allow them to stay behind in the locker room if they are not going to honor the flag due to it being an embarrassment to the owner and hurting their business

I just think it would be an incredible case of hypocrisy for NFL owners to not allow protesting players on the field during the anthem (for the excuse that it brings embarrassment to the owner/franchise)...when they have no problem allowing players who have had myriads of different issues, including things like drunk driving, domestic violence, drug and weapons charges, etc, etc. 

[Steve]

I want football....
not anyones political statement....
imo, if you want to do that go into politics....
but i'll watch my bengals regardless.....
I love them.....I have but little choice....

[*bfine32*]

(08-22-2017, 08:20 PM)pally Wrote: Why do we even play the anthem before a sporting event?  The NFL isn't some national level team or anything. I love our country but where else in American society besides the military do we play the anthem before going to work?  Shoot we don't even play it at the beginning of the school day, a government meeting, or a court proceeding.

I would not choose to protest the way some players have...but I understand why some of chosen this method.

The Military does not play the National Anthem before they go to work. 

[*jason*]

(08-22-2017, 08:57 PM)bfine32 Wrote: The Military does not play the National Anthem before they go to work. 

Outside of pro athletes, who does? I can't think of any off the top of my head.

[fullonbehavior]

(08-22-2017, 01:27 PM)McC Wrote: This right here.

This! And it not disrespectful in any way. It's actually very patriotic to protest


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[BleedNOrange]

Can we please stop making Kaepernick out to be some great civil rights activist?  He lost all credibility when he wore socks depicting cops as pigs (and defended Castro).  He resulted to childish name calling but is looked upon as some grand moral figure.

Now, we can argue all day about race relations in this country.  We can argue if they are protesting a false narrative perpetuated from the fringes on each side.  Are we perfect?  No, of course not.  However, this is the best country on the planet for so many reasons.  One of them being that we can all go watch a football game once a week in the fall.

These players absolutely have the right to do this if they want.  No one is really arguing that aspect of it.  Coach Dungy said it best though.  He said the players must ask themselves what exactly are they trying to accomplish by doing it.  Will kneeling make the world a better place after?  Most responses to "why" are that they want to bring awareness and start discussion.  Ok, but the "discussion" has been more divisive than anything.  Groups on each side just screaming at each other.  Do you really think anything has improved because of these protests?

The focus should be on where do we go from here?  What is the next step to improve society?  Or are we just going to more and more players kneeling, more arguing, and more and more people getting PO'ed at each other.

[*bfine32*]

(08-22-2017, 09:27 PM)jason Wrote: Outside of pro athletes, who does? I can't think of any off the top of my head.

I don't think it's the occupation; I think it has/had more to do with a mass gathering of Americans paying honor to the freedoms they enjoy. For instance it the Military it is played at all (most) gatherings. 

[*jason*]

(08-22-2017, 09:50 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I don't think it's the occupation; I think it has/had more to do with a mass gathering of Americans paying honor to the freedoms they enjoy. For instance it the Military it is played at all (most) gatherings. 

I went to a Bears/ Bengals game at Soldier Field 4-5 years ago. The entire place sings along with this baritone firefighter. It'll send chills down your spine... I don't know how anyone can knee, and not join in on that. I respect their right to though.

[TKUHL]

Freedom to kneel should be reason enough to stand.

[*bfine32*]

(08-22-2017, 10:15 PM)TKUHL Wrote: Freedom to kneel should be reason enough to stand.

Rep:

If I could, I would. 

[*jason*]

(08-22-2017, 10:15 PM)TKUHL Wrote: Freedom to kneel should be reason enough to stand.

Concise.