You hear of rape trials where the defense suggests that the way the victim was dressed implied she was "asking for it'. That logic has largely been ridiculed and dismissed. But my wife recently left her purse on the front seat of her car. The passenger window was smashed and $40 that was sitting basically exposed in her open purse was taken. Thankfully, everything else was left. The cop told her she was asking for it by leaving her purse where it could be seen.....that it was tempting to a criminal. That got me to thinking....if you leave something out that would be considered tempting to take, are you not asking for it? My wife left money where it could be seen, she was asking for it. If you leave a nice bike out on your lawn overnight and someone takes it, were you not asking for it? So if a woman dresses in an overly sexy outfit....one that partially exposes things that every guy wants....is she not asking for it?
PS. I don't think she is obviously, but exploring why the logic works for other things is interesting.
(11-26-2015, 12:43 AM)Beaker Wrote: You hear of rape trials where the defense suggests that the way the victim was dressed implied she was "asking for it'. That logic has largely been ridiculed and dismissed. But my wife recently left her purse on the front seat of her car. The passenger window was smashed and $40 that was sitting basically exposed in her open purse was taken. Thankfully, everything else was left. The cop told her she was asking for it by leaving her purse where it could be seen.....that it was tempting to a criminal. That got me to thinking....if you leave something out that would be considered tempting to take, are you not asking for it? My wife left money where it could be seen, she was asking for it. If you leave a nice bike out on your lawn overnight and someone takes it, were you not asking for it? So if a woman dresses in an overly sexy outfit....one that partially exposes things that every guy wants....is she not asking for it?
PS. I don't think she is obviously, but exploring why the logic works for other things is interesting.
Nope.
If a woman is dressed to look good all she is asking for is look good.
If I leave my wallet on my car seat all I am asking for is to not carry my wallet.
People who rape and steal are acting on their own and taking want they want...not asking if the other person would like to give it to them.
Your anger and ego will always reveal your true self.
In high school I walked out the door, started through the parking lot and BAM got hit by a car.
Was I asking for it because I was in a parking lot? No.
A few years ago I was sitting in my car at a red light. A guy plowed into the back of my truck.
Was I asking for it because I was waiting at the intersection? No.
Was your wife at fault because she left her purse in a locked car and some guy broke out the window? No.
Side note, the same people that think a woman in a skirt is "asking for it" also seem to be the ones who deny America is "asking for it" by imposing a jingoistic and overarching foreign policy.
(11-26-2015, 01:16 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Side note, the same people that think a woman in a skirt is "asking for it" also seem to be the ones who deny America is "asking for it" by imposing a jingoistic and overarching foreign policy.
Shhh you are about to insult every progressive presidential campaign lol
(11-26-2015, 01:15 AM)Benton Wrote: In high school I walked out the door, started through the parking lot and BAM got hit by a car.
Was I asking for it because I was in a parking lot? No.
A few years ago I was sitting in my car at a red light. A guy plowed into the back of my truck.
Was I asking for it because I was waiting at the intersection? No.
Was your wife at fault because she left her purse in a locked car and some guy broke out the window? No.
But in neither case did you leave something exposed to tempt not so nice people. If you leave money or a purse exposed you do. So if a woman leaves her goods exposed in a tempting way, is she asking for it also? This question came to me because the cop told her she was asking for it by leaving her purse in view.
(11-26-2015, 12:51 PM)Beaker Wrote: But in neither case did you leave something exposed to tempt not so nice people. If you leave money or a purse exposed you do. So if a woman leaves her goods exposed in a tempting way, is she asking for it also? This question came to me because the cop told her she was asking for it by leaving her purse in view.
Are you a homeowner? I bet you keep your stuff in your house. Well, you're just asking to be robbed.
(11-26-2015, 12:51 PM)Beaker Wrote: But in neither case did you leave something exposed to tempt not so nice people. If you leave money or a purse exposed you do. So if a woman leaves her goods exposed in a tempting way, is she asking for it also? This question came to me because the cop told her she was asking for it by leaving her purse in view.
Even if a woman is bent over a park bench, no underwear on, skirt flipped up, and a tube of KY balanced perfectly on her round buttocks; she still isn't "asking for it". (not in this society, anyway)
Now, if there is also a legal document signed and taped to the back of her head awaiting your signature, I'd call that a green light.
(11-26-2015, 12:43 AM)Beaker Wrote: You hear of rape trials where the defense suggests that the way the victim was dressed implied she was "asking for it'. That logic has largely been ridiculed and dismissed. But my wife recently left her purse on the front seat of her car. The passenger window was smashed and $40 that was sitting basically exposed in her open purse was taken. Thankfully, everything else was left. The cop told her she was asking for it by leaving her purse where it could be seen.....that it was tempting to a criminal. That got me to thinking....if you leave something out that would be considered tempting to take, are you not asking for it? My wife left money where it could be seen, she was asking for it. If you leave a nice bike out on your lawn overnight and someone takes it, were you not asking for it? So if a woman dresses in an overly sexy outfit....one that partially exposes things that every guy wants....is she not asking for it?
PS. I don't think she is obviously, but exploring why the logic works for other things is interesting.
I agree with those who have said those allegedly "asking for it" are not, but I also agree the logic is interesting and yes the cops (and others) make such allegations all the time as: if you leave property in plain view in your car you are asking for it to be taken, if you leave your bike unlocked you are asking for it to be taken, etc. This thread reminded me of a guy I knew once who was by all accounts a great guy - volunteered at his church and at a homeless shelter on a regular basis, but if he drove down the street and saw a bike unattended he would pick it up and toss it in his truck and drop it off for one of his grandkids. His logic was the kid who left it unattended "didn't value it/ didn't want it/ didn't care about it." It is kind of interesting how often this "logic" as the OP called it is the prevailing "logic" in our culture. No one here seems to defend it, but it is pervasive.
JOHN ROBERTS: From time to time in the years to come, I hope you will be treated unfairly so that you will come to know the value of justice... I wish you bad luck, again, from time to time so that you will be conscious of the role of chance in life and understand that your success is not completely deserved and that the failure of others is not completely deserved either.
Another side note, I recall Axe Body Spray commercials from a decade or so ago pretty much being about spraying this stuff on yourself and every woman within nose-range primally attempting to rape you. Seriously, there was one where a guy in a store just tried it out and women were slam tackling him and just piling on him (they were attractive, of course). I remember watching that with my girlfriend at the time and thinking "Gee, how odd is it that the apparent ultimate male fantasy is pretty much hell on earth and traumatic for a woman."
No one is ever asking for it, but there are people that have no problems taking something from others that is where you have to try to keep the odds in your favor. Of course there will be times where it doesn't matter. Ie someome was going to break into her car and take what they could.
In the case of your wife, the person that did it will probably look for her car again.
(11-26-2015, 12:51 PM)Beaker Wrote: But in neither case did you leave something exposed to tempt not so nice people. If you leave money or a purse exposed you do. So if a woman leaves her goods exposed in a tempting way, is she asking for it also? This question came to me because the cop told her she was asking for it by leaving her purse in view.
I see a major flaw in the comparison.
There is no fashion statement or personal satisfaction gained by leaving money in sight or a bike out by your house.
The way a person dresses is major a personality statement. In fact you get an impression from a persons appearance before you even get a chance to speak to them.
So while no one loses anything from covering up their money or putting their bike in at night, a woman who is told she is not allowed to dress in a certain way is losing a lot. A woman should be able to advertise the fact that she wants to have sex without getting raped. Wanting to have sex is not the same as wanting to get raped.
I don't blame victims for crimes, but at the same time I know I can reduce my chances of being the victim by taking certain simple steps. So i always make sure there is nothing of value in sight that could be tempting to take. And I don't leave my property unattended in public. In fact, if I left something out and it got taken I would chastise myself for being more careful. But I am not going to make any serious sacrifices just because I am afraid of crime.
(11-26-2015, 12:51 PM)Beaker Wrote: But in neither case did you leave something exposed to tempt not so nice people. If you leave money or a purse exposed you do. So if a woman leaves her goods exposed in a tempting way, is she asking for it also? This question came to me because the cop told her she was asking for it by leaving her purse in view.
If a woman is breastfeeding her child and doesn't cover up...is she asking to sexually assaulted because someone gets turned on by boobs?
Your anger and ego will always reveal your true self.
(11-27-2015, 06:21 PM)fredtoast Wrote: So while no one loses anything from covering up their money or putting their bike in at night, a woman who is told she is not allowed to dress in a certain way is losing a lot. A woman should be able to advertise the fact that she wants to have sex without getting raped. Wanting to have sex is not the same as wanting to get raped.
The fashion as a personality thing is a good point. Although I believe a woman can dress very sexy without having things hanging out all over the place. I told my wife she had no one but herself to blame after the incident. Leaving money in plain view is just asking for trouble. But I can definitely say I would not tell her the same thing if she had been sexually assaulted after wearing revealing clothes. I think for the most part, as a society the "she was asking for it" defense has been thrown out the window. But I also think there may still be people who say it is ridiculous out loud, but think to themselves she was asking for it. The cop using those exact words worries me about what he thinks privately. Although he is free to think whatever he wants privately as long as he competently does his job.
(11-28-2015, 02:15 PM)Bengalzona Wrote: If I walk around with my genitals exposed and Fred comes by, kneels down and starts s***ing, was I asking for it?
![[Image: giphy.gif]](https://media0.giphy.com/media/1kwsTjL8BNqlszNtnCE/giphy.gif)
![[Image: 4CV0TeR.png]](https://i.imgur.com/4CV0TeR.png)
![[Image: 416686247_404249095282684_84217049823664...e=659A7198]](https://scontent.fphx1-2.fna.fbcdn.net/v/t39.30808-6/416686247_404249095282684_8421704982366424390_n.jpg?_nc_cat=102&ccb=1-7&_nc_sid=3635dc&_nc_ohc=p8hMrwwk1IoAX8mnFLJ&_nc_ht=scontent.fphx1-2.fna&oh=00_AfBXs4gKHr4knFejO874dfV3zzLd_bq4GiUqHxGWFlwbug&oe=659A7198)
