Betsy DeVos: Deep cuts to Special Olympics, student programs are warranted

[*michaelsean*]

(03-29-2019, 12:21 PM)GMDino Wrote: Like I said if someone wants to give Trump credit for the doing a "good thing" by changing what he wanted to do in the first place the bar is REALLY low for "good things" in this administration.

If someone kills ten people but gets talked out of killing #11 that is a good thing (that #11 didn't get killed) but I still hold them responsible for the first 10 murders since they shouldn't have killed them in the first place.


Note: I am not comparing the budget to murder.  I'm making an analogy about how someone repeatedly doing bad things doesn't suddenly make it all better by doing one good thing.

That doesn't exactly hold unless you can bring the ten back to life.

[BmorePat87]

(03-29-2019, 12:55 PM)michaelsean Wrote: That doesn't exactly hold unless you can bring the ten back to life.

In this case the 10 dead are the other programs he is still proposing have funding slashed or completely removed. 

[Beaker]

(03-29-2019, 12:03 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I look at it differently.  I think it is very bad that we have a President who would appoint a person to a position of power who is so grossly out of touch with the will of the people.

There is no way you should spin incompetence into a good thing.

I agree that she is an idiot....and so is he. But there is hope if public pressure can persuade him to change some of his stupid decisions. That's a good thing.

[Beaker]

(03-29-2019, 12:21 PM)GMDino Wrote: Like I said if someone wants to give Trump credit for the doing a "good thing" by changing what he wanted to do in the first place the bar is REALLY low for "good things" in this administration.

I am giving the public credit for helping to change trumps stupid decision. He is still an idiot.

[*bfine32*]

(03-29-2019, 10:25 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Instead of just asking a question why not go on the record that you think this was a great thing.  And be sure to tell us the part you liked best.  This is a great chance for you to brag on your Donald.

I simply asked was it a good thing that POTUS rethought his stance on cutting Special Olympics; regardless of the reason. I didn't know asking questions was frowned upon (now answering a question with a question is). Personally I do think it's a good thing.

No need to get personal, but you're most likely allowed.

[fredtoast]

(03-29-2019, 05:35 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I simply asked was it a good thing that POTUS rethought his stance on cutting Special Olympics; regardless of the reason.

Actually you never asked that question at all

(03-29-2019, 05:35 PM)bfine32 Wrote:  I didn't know asking questions was frowned upon

Well here is a perfect example of why it is.  Generally if people want to make a point they say what they mean.  But if they want to weasel around and refuse to take a stand, or if they want to be vague and unclear so they can always deny what they said they ask a question instead.

We were talking about Trump being so ignorant of public opinion that he was shamed into changing his original position and DeVose lying about her original position.  You then asked a question that implied you thought it was great that our President is completely ignorant of what the citizens want, but when you got called on it you claimed you asked a totally different question.

And that is why asking questions is frowned upon as a way to make a point.

 

[*bfine32*]

(03-29-2019, 06:50 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Actually you never asked that question at all



Well here is a perfect example of why it is.  Generally if people want to make a point they say what they mean.  But if they want to weasel around and refuse to take a stand, or if they want to be vague and unclear so they can always deny what they said they ask a question instead.

We were talking about Trump being so ignorant of public opinion that he was shamed into changing his original position and DeVose lying about her original position.  You then asked a question that implied you thought it was great that our President is completely ignorant of what the citizens want, but when you got called on it you claimed you asked a totally different question.

And that is why asking questions is frowned upon as a way to make a point.

 

1. I sure did; it's back at post #26. I know it was a question because I ended with on of these thingys ?

2. Your assertion of my posts aside; which is not helping and personal, but ok. Dudes were slamming POTUS reversing his stance on the issue (sorta like you did here). I simple asked was his reversing his stance on the issue a good thing. I'm not exactly sure what I got "called on"; folks can clearly look at the question I posed. 

But you do you; as you are free to do so. Just don't get jovial. 

[*bfine32*]

This article on the matter asserts that DeVos was behind the defunding and when POTUS found out about it he balked:
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/betsy-devoss-efforts-defund-special-174936067.html

Unfortunately, that takes away from any narrative. Folks want to look in the mirror and come up with silly things like: "we shamed him into changing". There's a very good change that POTUS had 0 idea about the cuts until they were announced and he rightly balked; it's just unfortunate that we now reside in a society that to suggest that gets you slurred.

Seldom in my live have I ever felt bad for being a conservative, but thoughts in this thread and the investigation thread ,corollary with the national reaction of many, give me renewed solace in my choice. I am so glad to be an adult.

[Benton]

(03-29-2019, 09:58 PM)bfine32 Wrote: This article on the matter asserts that DeVos was behind the defunding and when POTUS found out about it he balked:
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/betsy-devoss-efforts-defund-special-174936067.html

Unfortunately, that takes away from any narrative. Folks want to look in the mirror and come up with silly things like: "we shamed him into changing". There's a very good change that POTUS had 0 idea about the cuts until they were announced and he rightly balked; it's just unfortunate that we now reside in a society that to suggest that gets you slurred.

Seldom in my live have I ever felt bad for being a conservative, but thoughts in this thread and the investigation thread ,corollary with the national reaction of many, give me renewed solace in my choice. I am so glad to be an adult.

1. Trump should've had a clue as devos had twice proposed reducing special Olympics funding. Maybe he wasn't involved in his presidency until 2019, I dunno.

2. Trump doesn't really make that decison, Congress does. 

3. Kudos to trump for calling out the bad decisions of his bad decisions. 

[GMDino]

(03-29-2019, 09:58 PM)bfine32 Wrote: This article on the matter asserts that DeVos was behind the defunding and when POTUS found out about it he balked:
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/betsy-devoss-efforts-defund-special-174936067.html

Unfortunately, that takes away from any narrative. Folks want to look in the mirror and come up with silly things like: "we shamed him into changing". There's a very good change that POTUS had 0 idea about the cuts until they were announced and he rightly balked; it's just unfortunate that we now reside in a society that to suggest that gets you slurred.

Seldom in my live have I ever felt bad for being a conservative, but thoughts in this thread and the investigation thread ,corollary with the national reaction of many, give me renewed solace in my choice. I am so glad to be an adult.

DeVos said she tried to get him to change "his stance" about defunding it.

Unfortunately that takes away from the folks looking in the mirror and coming up with silly things like defending DJT at....every...turn....and they denying they do it.

There's a great chance that DJT has zero idea about anything...but he signed off on it and claims to be complete control...and then he balked because he hates criticism...about him.

Luckily he has great defenders.  Like you.

[*bfine32*]

(03-29-2019, 10:28 PM)GMDino Wrote: DeVos said she tried to get him to change "his stance" about defunding it.

Unfortunately that takes away from the folks looking in the mirror and coming up with silly things like defending DJT at....every...turn....and they denying they do it.

There's a great chance that DJT has zero idea about anything...but he signed off on it and claims to be complete control...and then he balked because he hates criticism...about him.

Luckily he has great defenders.  Like you.

Just provided an article that asserted this was on DeVos, as food for thought; but I appreciate you helping me illustrate the point of the post

[GMDino]

(03-29-2019, 10:47 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Just provided an article that asserted this was on DeVos, as food for thought; but I appreciate you helping me illustrate the point of the post

Which ignored the article I posted that asserted this was on Trump.

Quote:After Trump made the announcement, DeVos thanked the president and said they see "eye to eye" on this, adding she pushed him to change his stance on funding the program. 

I'll return the "thanks" for proving my point. 

[*bfine32*]

(03-29-2019, 11:34 PM)GMDino Wrote: Which ignored the article I posted that asserted this was on Trump.



I'll return the "thanks" for proving my point. 

I don't think you'll ever have to worry about folks ignoring any article that blamed Trump in this forum. Nothing was ignored; perhaps why I said I posted a different link as food for thought.

Not sure where I have defended Trump in this thread. Do you want to show me where I have done so? 

Groupthink is a dangerous thing. 

[Dill]

(03-29-2019, 11:43 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Not sure where I have defended Trump in this thread. Do you want to show me where I have done so? 
Groupthink is a dangerous thing. 

(03-29-2019, 09:58 PM)bfine32 Wrote: This article on the matter asserts that DeVos was behind the defunding and when POTUS found out about it he balked:
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/betsy-devoss-efforts-defund-special-174936067.html

Unfortunately, that takes away from any narrative. Folks want to look in the mirror and come up with silly things like: "we shamed him into changing". There's a very good change that POTUS had 0 idea about the cuts until they were announced and he rightly balked; it's just unfortunate that we now reside in a society that to suggest that gets you slurred.

Seldom in my live have I ever felt bad for being a conservative, but thoughts in this thread and the investigation thread ,corollary with the national reaction of many, give me renewed solace in my choice. I am so glad to be an adult.

If people had just stopped to reflect a moment, they'd have easily seen how out of character these special Olympic cuts were with the actions of other Trump appointees--and with Trump policies in general.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/thousands-more-migrant-kids-separated-parents-under-trump-previously-reported-n959791
https://www.thenation.com/article/how-trump-plans-to-evict-poor-families-from-public-housing/
https://www.cbpp.org/research/federal-budget/trump-budget-deeply-cuts-health-housing-other-assistance-for-low-and
https://www.afge.org/article/trump-budget-cuts-veterans-disability-benefits-to-pay-for-va-privatization/
https://www.fool.com/retirement/2019/03/14/trump-outlines-a-significant-social-security-cut-i.aspx
https://usa.streetsblog.org/2019/03/11/trump-proposes-massive-cuts-to-transit-amtrak/
https://therevelator.org/budget-crunch-national-parks/
https://www.the74million.org/by-the-numbers-president-trumps-10-biggest-proposed-cuts-to-u-s-education-ranked/
https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/nation-politics/trump-budget-slashes-money-of-clean-air-and-water-programs/
https://trofire.com/2017/03/17/trump-admin-wants-cuts-school-meal-programs-food-doesnt-make-kids-smarter/


Not the only time Trump had 0 idea about his cuts--and then stepped in to save Americans from them.
http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/michigan-trump-brags-hes-saving-the-great-lakes-his-own-cuts

[BmorePat87]

(03-30-2019, 12:03 AM)Dill Wrote: If people had just stopped to reflect a moment, they'd have easily seen how out of character these special Olympic cuts were with the actions of other Trump appointees--and with Trump policies in general.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/thousands-more-migrant-kids-separated-parents-under-trump-previously-reported-n959791
https://www.thenation.com/article/how-trump-plans-to-evict-poor-families-from-public-housing/
https://www.cbpp.org/research/federal-budget/trump-budget-deeply-cuts-health-housing-other-assistance-for-low-and
https://www.afge.org/article/trump-budget-cuts-veterans-disability-benefits-to-pay-for-va-privatization/
https://www.fool.com/retirement/2019/03/14/trump-outlines-a-significant-social-security-cut-i.aspx
https://usa.streetsblog.org/2019/03/11/trump-proposes-massive-cuts-to-transit-amtrak/
https://therevelator.org/budget-crunch-national-parks/
https://www.the74million.org/by-the-numbers-president-trumps-10-biggest-proposed-cuts-to-u-s-education-ranked/
https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/nation-politics/trump-budget-slashes-money-of-clean-air-and-water-programs/
https://trofire.com/2017/03/17/trump-admin-wants-cuts-school-meal-programs-food-doesnt-make-kids-smarter/


Not the only time Trump had 0 idea about his cuts--and then stepped in to save Americans from them.
http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/michigan-trump-brags-hes-saving-the-great-lakes-his-own-cuts

DeVos' only contribution to public education has been donating money to Republicans to support unregulated charter schools (a business she has a financial interest in) and divert funding to Christian schools. 

The only explanation for hiring such an unqualified person to be the Secretary of Education, short of gross incompetence on the President's part, is that they support her agenda of slashing public funding of all education not related to charter schools and Christian schools. 

And as you have pointed out, the administration has been trying to slash programs that provide support to our most at risk students ever since their first budget. Whether it's special education funding, nutrition, or after school programs, they have all been identified as less worthy than private school funding. 

[BmorePat87]

A number of cabinet officials have left, especially when the negative press got to be too much, but DeVos survives, which tells you that she is 100% on board with Trump's agenda and he with her's.

She had one of the most embarrassing confirmation hearings, where she exposed herself to be ignorant of even the most basic education laws and concepts. Soon after, she came out and said Common Core no longer existed, even though over 70% of the states still had it. She called HBCU's pioneers of school choice. She suggested that states should decide if IDEA (what provides special education for students with disabilities) should be enforced.

I went back to read the first threads on her. A number of conservatives expressed concerns with her, but there was one person that was pushing back hard against any criticism of her, suggesting she was only being called unqualified because she was Trump's pick.

Dill, I'll let you guess who that was.

[GMDino]

(03-30-2019, 12:03 AM)Dill Wrote: If people had just stopped to reflect a moment, they'd have easily seen how out of character these special Olympic cuts were with the actions of other Trump appointees--and with Trump policies in general.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/immigration/thousands-more-migrant-kids-separated-parents-under-trump-previously-reported-n959791
https://www.thenation.com/article/how-trump-plans-to-evict-poor-families-from-public-housing/
https://www.cbpp.org/research/federal-budget/trump-budget-deeply-cuts-health-housing-other-assistance-for-low-and
https://www.afge.org/article/trump-budget-cuts-veterans-disability-benefits-to-pay-for-va-privatization/
https://www.fool.com/retirement/2019/03/14/trump-outlines-a-significant-social-security-cut-i.aspx
https://usa.streetsblog.org/2019/03/11/trump-proposes-massive-cuts-to-transit-amtrak/
https://therevelator.org/budget-crunch-national-parks/
https://www.the74million.org/by-the-numbers-president-trumps-10-biggest-proposed-cuts-to-u-s-education-ranked/
https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/nation-politics/trump-budget-slashes-money-of-clean-air-and-water-programs/
https://trofire.com/2017/03/17/trump-admin-wants-cuts-school-meal-programs-food-doesnt-make-kids-smarter/


Not the only time Trump had 0 idea about his cuts--and then stepped in to save Americans from them.
http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow-show/michigan-trump-brags-hes-saving-the-great-lakes-his-own-cuts

(04-01-2019, 08:58 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: DeVos' only contribution to public education has been donating money to Republicans to support unregulated charter schools (a business she has a financial interest in) and divert funding to Christian schools. 

The only explanation for hiring such an unqualified person to be the Secretary of Education, short of gross incompetence on the President's part, is that they support her agenda of slashing public funding of all education not related to charter schools and Christian schools. 

And as you have pointed out, the administration has been trying to slash programs that provide support to our most at risk students ever since their first budget. Whether it's special education funding, nutrition, or after school programs, they have all been identified as less worthy than private school funding. 

Yes, yes, yes...that's all well and good but Trump CHANGED HIS MIND!!!1!!111!!! So it's a "good thing". 

All seriousness aside he's a sad, unqualified man who brings in rich people becuase he doesn't understand what it means to be qualified for a job.

[fredtoast]

(03-29-2019, 09:42 PM)bfine32 Wrote: 1. I sure did; it's back at post #26. I know it was a question because I ended with on of these thingys ?

In post #26 you asked wasn't it a good thing that DeVose lied about her original position and Trump flip flopped.

Why6 did you think it was a good thing that DeVose had lied?

[Nebuchadnezzar]

Just because Donald Jr. and Eric wasn't good enough to make the team is no reason to make every Special Olympian suffer.

[Benton]

(04-01-2019, 02:43 PM)Nebuchadnezzar Wrote: Just because Donald Jr. and Eric wasn't good enough to make the team is no reason to make every Special Olympian suffer.