Biden vs. Trump debate

[HarleyDog]

(06-21-2024, 11:16 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I don't think it's in Trump's personal nature to change who he is, furthermore a lot of his supporters are convinced he won two landslide elections in a row so conservatives wanting him to dial things back are likely is disagreement with their fellow conservatives regarding how smart of a move changing things up would be.  Trump has, with no pushback as far as I've seen, claimed that he likely won states like CA and NY and Illinois in 2020.  Why change what has led to what millions of voters believe was two massive landslide wins?

This is one of the best posts you've made in a while. Although, I don't think you give people enough credit. The average Joe (not Biden) I speak to who supports Trump is not a radical conservative. I don't think I've ever met one of those like many claim on this board. I agree. It's gonna be tough for Trump to change who he is on the inside. His drive and arrogance will always get the best of him.

Quote:And I've admitted before that the main reason I want to see Trump lose in 2024 is because I want to see how it goes over if/when he again says that he won in a massive landslide for a 3rd time in a row but it was stollen again.

Seriously, I get the humor or the self-gratification it would bring you to see someone you dislike fail. But, it's a lot bigger than us.

Quote:But yes, Biden in 2024 should be the biggest layup there is but instead of moving on from a candidate who lost it's a requirement to say he didn't lose.  As I've said before, it'd be like if instead of going to Reagan in 1980 the GOP just said that Jimmy Carter cheated in 1976 and they should just roll with Gerald "didn't lose" Ford again, or if democrats didn't move on to Bill Clinton because they were convinced they needed to roll with Michael Dukakis into the 90s.

Michael Dukakis? Not there's a name I haven't heard in a long time. 

Quote:Side note, in AZ Kari Lake is looking like she's going to hand democrats yet another victory so she will be 0-2 and likely claim both were stolen from her.  How long can that go on?  I guess she can lose the governor race, then the senate, and then go find a safe house seat in some R+75 disctrict and finally win something, though.

Honestly, I have no damn clue who Kari Lake is. So why did I quote this part? Just so I could say she needs to call Ricki. She misses her. 

[*pally*]

Republicans spent a lot of time telling people how old and senile Joe was and then he came out and blew everyone away at the State of the Union speech. So much that all Republicans could do was ridiculously claim Joe was on speed in order to perform so well.

They have spent so much time hyping up Biden’s “infirmities” that all he had to do is walk and talk to look good especially if Trump is his usual incoherent incomprehensible self

[masonbengals fan]

(06-22-2024, 07:48 AM)pally Wrote: Republicans spent a lot of time telling people how old and senile Joe was and then he came out and blew everyone away at the State of the Union speech.  So much that all Republicans could do was ridiculously claim Joe was on speed in order to perform so well.

They have spent so much time hyping up Biden’s “infirmities” that all he had to do is walk and talk to look good especially if Trump is his usual incoherent incomprehensible self

Blew everyone away? Surpassed a very low expectation would be significantly closer to the truth. 

If you can watch that performance and compare it to his daily geriatric routine & demeanor, then tell us there was no medication involved then hopefully you aren't in the medical field. 

I'm all for drug testing both of them.

[*Nately120*]

(06-22-2024, 12:47 AM)HarleyDog Wrote: This is one of the best posts you've made in a while. Although, I don't think you give people enough credit. The average Joe (not Biden) I speak to who supports Trump is not a radical conservative. I don't think I've ever met one of those like many claim on this board. I agree. It's gonna be tough for Trump to change who he is on the inside. His drive and arrogance will always get the best of him.

I get what you are saying, but the thing about Trump and MAGA is that the fringe folks and the fringe ideas are front and center, rather than you know, fringe.  I've voted D, I've voted libertarian, and I've at least defended or agreed with certain republican politicians over the years.  I realize when I vote D that the party depends on people who are uncomfortably left, when I vote libertarian I realize I'm voting along with some people who want heroin sold in vending machines and every road privatized.  I get all that, but the idea has usually been that we need these fringe folks who vote with us because "we are closer than the other side to what they want, at least."

You point out that most Trump supporters aren't in the camp where they truly believe he had the election stolen from him, or that he needs to be a dictator, or that the USA and God himself will die if he doesn't win.  The issue is that Trump's rhetoric puts those fringe things that his reasonable supporters "know he doesn't mean" right up front and at the center of his campaign.

Each major party has to get the nuts out to vote or they'll have a really hard time winning but Trump is the first presidential candidate I can think of who specifically says what the fringe wants and then hopes/expects the non fringe to defend him and just say that he's spouting a bunch of nonsense he doesn't mean.  I get that, since having voted libertarian for over a decade I had to explain that I didn't want total anarchy, but it helped that Jo Jorgensen's campaign praised the policies to those in Switzerland and not like...some 3rd world anarchist or something decidedly less mainstream.

I'm not wild about Biden but I'm likely voting for him.  With that being said, it helps him keep my shaky vote since he isn't saying he is going to be a Communist on day 1 when he's reelected or that if Jesus came down from heaven to count the votes you'd find he won Kentucky and Oklahoma by "a lot."


tl'dr - All parties need fringe voters, but Trump and the MAGA stuff puts the fringe stuff front and center and expects people to openly agree with it, but also know that he doesn't mean it.  It'd be interesting to see a reasonable Trump supporter talk to the Trump supporters I know, because they are of the "He won in a landslide, he saved us, god picked him" variety.  I don't think that's ALL Trump supporters, but I'm not arguing with them...it'd be interesting to see you do so.

(06-22-2024, 09:44 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: Blew everyone away? Surpassed a very low expectation would be significantly closer to the truth. 

Agreed, though I'll admit Biden showing some fire and having a sense of humor helps his shaky support.  The state of the union and his willingness to actually show up at the correspondence dinner helps calm his ulcer-ridden supporters. 

(06-22-2024, 09:44 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: If you can watch that performance and compare it to his daily geriatric routine & demeanor, then tell us there was no medication involved then hopefully you aren't in the medical field. 

I'm all for drug testing both of them.

I'm not saying it doesn't exist, but if there is a magic potion out there that can even temporarily cure whatever Biden has, the American public should demand it be made available.  But even if medication is involved, what's the big deal?  Why is this considered cheating?  Trump has access to the same stuff, and I'd wager a lot of Trump voters are ingesting a daily cocktail of chemicals and drugs to keep them alive every day before they cast their super informed just as good as mine even though I'm not on medication vote, so meh...what's the rub even if it's true?  We are looking at a choice between two men who will be in their 80s in the white house, so wanting them to be free of medication when many Americans can't make it to 40 without big pharma propping them up on a daily basis seems a bit silly.

And the drug test is pointless because Trump is going to tell us what the results really are, and I already know what he will say.  Of course you already seem to know Biden is on drugs, so what's the point?  The people who believe an entire election was rigged are going to accept that a simple drug test wasn't?  I'm not holding my breath.

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(06-22-2024, 09:44 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: Blew everyone away? Surpassed a very low expectation would be significantly closer to the truth. 

If you can watch that performance and compare it to his daily geriatric routine & demeanor, then tell us there was no medication involved then hopefully you aren't in the medical field. 

I'm all for drug testing both of them.

The world is blown away when Joe Biden can get off stage without guidance, crapping himself, freezing, and/or interacting with figments of his imagination. They are blown away when he can make it up the Big Boy steps on Air Force One without being sandbagged or get in a car properly.

The expectations of Joe Biden are so low, it's embarrassing.

I agree he was on some cocktail od drugs for the SOTU. It is plain to anyone, except those so blind they cannot see Joe's massive cognitive and physical decline.

[*Nately120*]

(06-22-2024, 11:28 AM)FormerlyBengalRugby Wrote: The world is blown away when Joe Biden can get off stage without guidance, crapping himself, freezing, and/or interacting with figments of his imagination. They are blown away when he can make it up the Big Boy steps on Air Force One without being sandbagged or get in a car properly.

The expectations of Joe Biden are so low, it's embarrassing.

I agree he was on some cocktail od drugs for the SOTU. It is plain to anyone, except those so blind they cannot see Joe's massive cognitive and physical decline.

Im no doctor but I find it a bit hard to believe assertions that Biden and/or Trump are abusing stimulants. These guys are really old and it seems like the amount of uppers it would take to make a brain dead 80 year old dude functional would lead to a heart attack ack ack ack ack ack. 

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(06-22-2024, 02:23 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Im no doctor but I find it a bit hard to believe assertions that Biden and/or Trump are abusing stimulants. These guys are really old and it seems like the amount of uppers it would take to make a brain dead 80 year old dude functional would lead to a heart attack ack ack ack ack ack. 

I never said DJT did or did not.

Just that the different between Joe Biden everyday and Biden at the State of the Union was night and day.

[*Nately120*]

(06-22-2024, 02:32 PM)FormerlyBengalRugby Wrote: I never said DJT did or did not.

Just that the different between Joe Biden everyday and Biden at the State of the Union was night and day.

There are rumblings that Trump is a long term Adderall user if not abuser. Anyways if it just takes drugs to make Biden or Trump function what is the issue?  Commercials have shown me we are a drug addled society, so fair play to our supposed representatives for being chemically altered as well. 

But mainly there is no reason to drug test either because it'll be rigged and blah blah.

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(06-22-2024, 02:35 PM)Nately120 Wrote: There are rumblings that Trump is a long term Adderall user if not abuser. Anyways if it just takes drugs to make Biden or Trump function what is the issue?  Commercials have shown me we are a drug addled society, so fair play to our supposed representatives for being chemically altered as well. 

But mainly there is no reason to drug test either because it'll be rigged and blah blah.

I am not saying he is or is not on Adderall, just commenting on Biden and the extreme differences in everyday Joe versus cranked up Joe and how obvious it is.

[Luvnit2]

(06-22-2024, 07:48 AM)pally Wrote: Republicans spent a lot of time telling people how old and senile Joe was and then he came out and blew everyone away at the State of the Union speech.  So much that all Republicans could do was ridiculously claim Joe was on speed in order to perform so well.

They have spent so much time hyping up Biden’s “infirmities” that all he had to do is walk and talk to look good especially if Trump is his usual incoherent incomprehensible self

Hur told the voters Joe is an old man and is not able to stand trial.

Is Hur a Democrat?

How many press conferences have you seen Biden do lasting 30 minutes or later without a teleprompter or given a heads up on who to call on as he knows the questions ahead of time and can refer to a cheat sheet.

My guess is CNN already gave him every question just as they did in 2016 for HRC debate.

So, we will have a 3 on 1 debate, Joe should win easily f Trump is incoherent and incomprehensible as you and liberals think he is.

I can't recall last time Joe has spoken without notes or teleprompter since the last debate where he lied repeatedly about Hunter's laptop being fake and about knowing any of Hunter's business partners and the whopper of them all, Hunter never did anything wrong. My guess is Joe will get a chance to own up or deflect from the lies he told in 2020.

My daughter and her family are coming into Florida foe a visit, so I will miss the debate. May the best candidate win.

[Luvnit2]

(06-22-2024, 02:42 PM)FormerlyBengalRugby Wrote: I am not saying he is or is not on Adderall, just commenting on Biden and the extreme differences in everyday Joe versus cranked up Joe and how obvious it is.

It is obvious the energy level he had at the SOTU was over the top different from everyday Joe. I heard rumors he needed 7 days to practice as they needed to confirm he can stand up for 1.5 hours. 

I see a policy debate from Trump. I am not sure other than calling Biden a felon Joe can debate and win. What is the over/under on Biden lies or words spoken not in the dictionary?

Joe has the chance to show voters his policies are working, and he has the mind and stamina of a 50-year-old. Trump has the same opportunity to show voters he had better policies than Biden and has the mind and stamina of a 50-year-old.

[*pally*]

(06-22-2024, 11:28 AM)FormerlyBengalRugby Wrote: The world is blown away when Joe Biden can get off stage without guidance, crapping himself, freezing, and/or interacting with figments of his imagination. They are blown away when he can make it up the Big Boy steps on Air Force One without being sandbagged or get in a car properly.

The expectations of Joe Biden are so low, it's embarrassing.

I agree he was on some cocktail od drugs for the SOTU. It is plain to anyone, except those so blind they cannot see Joe's massive cognitive and physical decline.

The bar is low because that's where the loudest voices place it.  Blame right-wing media and the lunatic fringe of the Republican Party for screaming abut Biden's potential problems since he started running and highlighting everything negative since.  

it is so much a part of the campaigns from the right that you all have people expecting Biden to be pushed out on stage in a wheelchair with AI providing his voice.  Thus when he overperforms, you all have to change the narrative to being drugged.

[FormerlyBengalRugby]

(06-22-2024, 03:08 PM)pally Wrote: The bar is low because that's where the loudest voices place it.  Blame right-wing media and the lunatic fringe of the Republican Party for screaming abut Biden's potential problems since he started running and highlighting everything negative since.  

it is so much a part of the campaigns from the right that you all have people expecting Biden to be pushed out on stage in a wheelchair with AI providing his voice.  Thus when he overperforms, you all have to change the narrative to being drugged.

The blind sheep is blind.

You do not see how compromised and enfeebled Biden is, but the rest of the world does.

The lunacy of the left continues...

[hollodero]

(06-22-2024, 02:56 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Hur told the voters Joe is an old man and is not able to stand trial.

Yeah he did not say that.

[*Nately120*]

(06-22-2024, 03:02 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I see a policy debate from Trump.

I can't see the future, but I don't foresee Trump actually focusing on policy outside of "things were the best when I was in charge and things are the worst with Biden in charge."  Trump is a table-pounder and it got him this far, the idea of him deciding to set emotion, hyperbole and grievance aside this late in the game to have a frank exchange of factual views and plans is...well...he wouldn't be dancin' with who brung him so to speak.

Maybe Trump has learned from 2020, though I assume he and anyone who speaks to him would say he kicked Biden's ass in those scream-ey debates, so my mind is open to what happens but I expect more of the same and I think a lot of Trump supporters want more of the same.

(06-22-2024, 03:29 PM)FormerlyBengalRugby Wrote: The blind sheep is blind.

You do not see how compromised and enfeebled Biden is, but the rest of the world does.

The lunacy of the left continues...

The office of president isn't supposed to be one single man with one single mind and one single viewpoint, rather you vote for the people he will surround himself with.  At least that's what conservatives told me when they justified voting for George W Bush over various candidates on both sides of the aisle who clearly had 50+ IQ points more than him.  I know a lot of Trump supporters want him to be the only man making decisions, but people who support Biden hopefully see the endorsement as one that goes beyond voting for a single person.  I mean, they're both going to be stone dead soon anyways.  It's supposed to be an office bigger than any one man, which is why Trump's "only I can fix it" mantra seems so un American and short sighted in a sense.

[Luvnit2]

(06-22-2024, 02:35 PM)Nately120 Wrote: There are rumblings that Trump is a long term Adderall user if not abuser. Anyways if it just takes drugs to make Biden or Trump function what is the issue?  Commercials have shown me we are a drug addled society, so fair play to our supposed representatives for being chemically altered as well. 

But mainly there is no reason to drug test either because it'll be rigged and blah blah.

Let me guess, you got this from the Hillary Clinton funded Russian Dossier.

I can play too, there are rumblings Joe has had sex with a goat, thousands of times.

[*Nately120*]

(06-22-2024, 07:33 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Let me guess, you got this from the Hillary Clinton funded Russian Dossier.

I can play too, there are rumblings Joe has had sex with a goat, thousands of times.

I don't know where people "got it" and I just said I heard the allegations and that I find them to be less believable than believable.  If you read my post you'd see I said that I find it hard to believe assertions that Biden and Trump are abusing uppers since they're both so damn old.  Ye gods man, even when I defend Trump you jump on me like it's time to symmetrically white knight for our geriatric boyfriends.

[Luvnit2]

(06-22-2024, 07:40 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I don't know where people "got it" and I just said I heard the allegations and that I find them to be less believable than believable.  If you read my post you'd see I said that I find it hard to believe assertions that Biden and Trump are abusing uppers since they're both so damn old.  Ye gods man, even when I defend Trump you jump on me like it's time to symmetrically white knight for our geriatric boyfriends.

Yes, when you post liberal propaganda like a schoolgirl, I will call you out.

I guess you also missed my attempt at humor.

[*Nately120*]

(06-22-2024, 09:40 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Yes, when you post liberal propaganda like a schoolgirl, I will call you out.

So mentioning liberal propaganda for the express purpose of pointing out that I disagree with it gets an antagonistic response from you?

(06-22-2024, 09:40 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: I guess you also missed my attempt at humor.

Longest book in the world? A la recherche du temps perdu by Marcel Proust.

Shortest book in the world? Conservative Humor and Jokes.

[samhain]

(06-22-2024, 09:40 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Yes, when you post liberal propaganda like a schoolgirl, I will call you out.

I guess you also missed my attempt at humor.

Oh no, he's calling you out.  That sounds really scary.  

Man I hope our fellow board member recovers.  

That's some Chuck Norris shit, there, guy.