Current GOP Tax Plan

[Belsnickel]

I'm looking forward to seeing more polling on this as time goes on, but this recent poll doesn't look good for the GOP. So far, this is looking to be their only legislative victory in the making. If they don't pass it, then they look inept. If they do pass it, then it will be hung around their necks all next year for the election cycle. This is a lose-lose situation for the GOP, which means to me they will work hard to pass it so their big money donors will be happy.

[GMDino]

(12-11-2017, 12:52 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'm looking forward to seeing more polling on this as time goes on, but this recent poll doesn't look good for the GOP. So far, this is looking to be their only legislative victory in the making. If they don't pass it, then they look inept. If they do pass it, then it will be hung around their necks all next year for the election cycle. This is a lose-lose situation for the GOP, which means to me they will work hard to pass it so their big money donors will be happy.

And that's all the need.

The big money will put out false facts for the rubes and thanks to the districting they will almost all be re-elected.  Only to blame the other side when things start to tank.

[GMDino]

https://thinkprogress.org/treasury-tax-analysis-released-bec23d09b08d/

Quote:The Trump administration’s long-awaited analysis of the GOP tax plan has bad news for Republicans

Turns out previous analyses were right all along.

On Monday, the U.S. Treasury Department finally released its analysis of the GOP tax plan: a single page report that essentially concedes the analysis by the Joint Committee on Taxation is correct.



According to the Treasury analysis, the tax plan will cost an estimated $1.5 trillion dollars, while raising only $408 billion in revenue, leaving the country $1 trillion in the hole. This eviscerates any notion that the GOP plan will pay for itself, as previously suggested by administration officials like chief economic adviser Gary Cohn and Treasury Secretary Steven Mnuchin.

The Treasury Department also took its analysis one step too far, assuming 2.9 percent economic growth over the next decade, without providing any actual analysis for it. A Treasury memo released on Monday “modeled the revenue impact of higher growth effects, using the Administration projections of approximately a 2.9% real GDP growth rate over 10 years contained in the Administration’s Fiscal Year 2018 budget.”


The 3 percent growth projected by the Trump administration’s 2018 fiscal year budget has been debunked and labeled a “fantasy” numerous times.


SCREENGRAB OF THE TREASURY DEPARTMENT TAX ANALYSIS MEMO.

The Treasury Department memo further confirms what a number of institutions, such as the non-partisan Tax Policy Center, the Penn Wharton Budget Model, and the conservative Tax Foundation, have said in recent weeks: that the GOP tax plan will not pay for itself. According to a University of Chicago survey, 37 out of 38 economists don’t believe the plan will spur enough growth to pay for itself either.
So what’s the point in releasing a document that doesn’t even support what the administration has been promising? Considering the Treasury Department’s inspector general opened an inquiry into why the department had not yet released its analysis to the public — as it had promised it would — officials had to release something, even if it was difficult to explain the numbers they came up with.


Mnuchin spent months talking about a formal Treasury analysis, only to have The New York Times report in November that no such analysis actually existed,according to an economist in the Treasury department.


“Either the Treasury Department has used extensive taxpayer funds to conduct economic analyses that it refuses to release because those analyses would contradict the Treasury Secretary’s claims, or Secretary Mnuchin has grossly misled the public about the extent of the Treasury Department’s analysis,” Sen. Elizabeth Warren (D-MA) wrote in a letter to the Treasury’s inspector general. “I am deeply concerned about either possibility.”


With the GOP tax bill passed in the House and Senate, and now in conference committee, Republicans will have to reconcile their differences and hash out a final plan that will have to be passed again by the House and Senate. There are a number of disputes that have yet to be resolved in order for Republicans to snag a solid 51 votes, the most important of which being the deficit.


For every tax analysis published, support for the bill from deficit hawks like Sens. Bob Corker (R-TN) and Jeff Flake (R-AZ) wanes. Sen. Susan Collins (R-ME), who was instrumental in voting against the GOP’s failed attempts at dismantling the Affordable Care Act, has also expressed a hesitancy to vote for the bill if it includes a repeal of the individual mandate.

[GMDino]

Luckily he's never very busy so he had time for Show and Tell.  

In 1960, there were approximately 20,000 pages in the Code of Federal Regulations. Today there are over 185,000 pages, as seen in the Roosevelt Room.

Today, we CUT THE RED TAPE! It is time to SET FREE OUR DREAMS and MAKE AMERICA GREAT AGAIN! pic.twitter.com/teAVNzjvcx

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 14, 2017

[Aquapod770]

I'm so mad the government is going to let me keep more of my own money! Don't they know they're way more responsible with it than I am.

[Belsnickel]

(12-15-2017, 11:30 AM)Aquapod770 Wrote: I'm so mad the government is going to let me keep more of my own money! Don't they know they're way more responsible with it than I am.

Well, my taxes are going to go up, so yeah. At least based on the latest news I've been getting from lobbyists with interest groups I belong to. And no, they aren't telling me my taxes will go up, I just know the provisions that will affect me.

[*Nately120*]

(12-15-2017, 11:30 AM)Aquapod770 Wrote: I'm so mad the government is going to let me keep more of my own money! Don't they know they're way more responsible with it than I am.

That's a nice sentiment, but it goes against the logic of electing a guy because he's going to build a giant wall and/or invade/bomb any country that gives us a dirty look.  

[ballsofsteel]

(12-15-2017, 11:30 AM)Aquapod770 Wrote: I'm so mad the government is going to let me keep more of my own money! Don't they know they're way more responsible with it than I am.

For a few years. Then they are going to jack your taxes and give all back to the super rich.
Why is the "middle class" tax cut temporary while the corporate tax cut is permanent ?
The Repubs have to hurry up and pass it before anyone really reads it and finds out its a scam.

[Aquapod770]

(12-15-2017, 11:33 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Well, my taxes are going to go up, so yeah. At least based on the latest news I've been getting from lobbyists with interest groups I belong to. And no, they aren't telling me my taxes will go up, I just know the provisions that will affect me.

Snarky comments aside, I'd legitimately like to hear those provisions that will affect you. Everything I've seen looks like a straight up cut across the board. With some groups getting bigger cuts than others. I know they've gotten rid of some deductions (and increased others). If you don't want to tell me that's fine. I understand not wanting to divulge personal info on a message board. Just trying to be more educated. 

[Au165]

My issue is pretty simple, you can give everyone back more of their money but if we haven't reduced our expenditures the deficit continues to climb. It appears this is the case, we are going to give everyone a break with no real way to recover what we are not collecting now. It's a PR win, but a short sighted approach and further kicking the can down the road for someone else to figure out.

[GMDino]

Looks like the GOP is getting everything they want:

Massive cuts for the top "earners" that are permanent.
Small cuts offset by eliminating deductions the middle class uses more that will expire.
Triggers to cut social programs when the economy doesn't grow at the incredible rate that only those voting for the bill believe will happen.
The deficit will grow by a trillion dollars plus...but that's down the road and they can blame the next party to have control when the nation starts to crash again.

It's almost as if they don't care about the voters as much as care about getting votes from people who don't understand much.

I really hoped America would be better off after Trump got elected.  That maybe we could have tax reform for everyone that was sensible and included actual savings without going solely after programs that help the least among us and worked on reducing wasteful spending from the massive military budget.

Sadly we got exactly what was voted for:  A political party that refuses to admit that their economic plan never works on any level.  And a situation where the adults will have to come in and clean up another GOP created economic mess and then get blamed for "not caring" about people when they do the right thing to get us going again.

Sad.

[ballsofsteel]

(12-19-2017, 12:58 PM)GMDino Wrote: Looks like the GOP is getting everything they want:

Massive cuts for the top "earners" that are permanent.
Small cuts offset by eliminating deductions the middle class uses more that will expire.
Triggers to cut social programs when the economy doesn't grow at the incredible rate that only those voting for the bill believe will happen.
The deficit will grow by a trillion dollars plus...but that's down the road and they can blame the next party to have control when the nation starts to crash again.

It's almost as if they don't care about the voters as much as care about getting votes from people who don't understand much.

I really hoped America would be better off after Trump got elected.  That maybe we could have tax reform for everyone that was sensible and included actual savings without going solely after programs that help the least among us and worked on reducing wasteful spending from the massive military budget.

Sadly we got exactly what was voted for:  A political party that refuses to admit that their economic plan never works on any level.  And a situation where the adults will have to come in and clean up another GOP created economic mess and then get blamed for "not caring" about people when they do the right thing to get us going again.

Sad.

Do you know the answer to this question?
Why is the "middle class" tax cut temporary while the corporate tax cut is permanent ?

[GMDino]

(12-19-2017, 06:39 PM)ballsofsteel Wrote: Do you know the answer to this question?
Why is the "middle class" tax cut temporary while the corporate tax cut is permanent ?

To pay for the inevitable shortfall from making the corporate tax cut permanent.

That's the real answer.

The answer we are given is because "businesses need stability so they can plan for future".  

Just like the stock market will never go down/crash and everything will always stay the same forever. 

[ballsofsteel]

The answer we are given is because "businesses need stability so they can plan for future".
What a bunch of crap.
The Rubes fall for this crap.
Why won't Trump release his tax returns? Just kidding. I know why.

[Belsnickel]

(12-19-2017, 11:02 AM)Aquapod770 Wrote: Snarky comments aside, I'd legitimately like to hear those provisions that will affect you. Everything I've seen looks like a straight up cut across the board. With some groups getting bigger cuts than others. I know they've gotten rid of some deductions (and increased others). If you don't want to tell me that's fine. I understand not wanting to divulge personal info on a message board. Just trying to be more educated.

I can actually refer you to this:

(11-07-2017, 12:41 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: In my area, the proposed bill has the opportunity to really damage higher education across the country: http://www.chronicle.com/article/Republican-Tax-Proposal-Gets/241662

tl;dr: The proposal eliminates a lot of credits and programs that will make college less affordable and will reduce investment revenue and charitable receipts.

On a personal note, this also results in me having to stop my education if this passes as is. Eliminating the tax exemption under IRC section 117 (d) means that my tuition waivers become taxable income, which isn't something I would be able to afford since I work for a state that does a shitty job compensating its employees.

Now, since I made my comment the bill has been changed. http://insidehighered.com/news/2017/12/18/large-endowments-would-be-taxed-under-final-gop-tax-plan?utm_content=buffer8f221&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter&utm_campaign=IHEbuffer

Both the 117(d) issue and student loan interest would have raised my taxes. Since then, the loan interest issue has been removed and (I believe) the 117(d) issue as well.

[hollodero]

(12-19-2017, 07:06 PM)ballsofsteel Wrote: Why won't Trump release his tax returns? Just kidding. I know why.

Because they still are under audit. Not that Trump complains, but it's possibly because he's so religious and therefore there's a bias.

Yeah well. I thought this one happy congressman (I don't know who) was cool who actually said something among the lines of well of course the rich will reinvest the additional money, because what else, there's only so many yachts and cars and houses you can buy.

Have to give it to US politicians, they really are more bold. Anti-Religious bias, only so many yachts, they say with a straight face. Admirable.

[GMDino]

http://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/house-passes-tax-bill-with-massive-overhaul-of-tax-code

(All emphasis mine)

Quote:BREAKING: House Passes $1.4 Trillion Tax Bill, Nukes Obamacare Mandate




After a long year of legislative face-plants, the House of Representatives voted Tuesday to approve a massive overhaul of the nation’s tax system and knock out a key pillar of the Affordable Care Act: the individual mandate.

As the House conducted just one hour of debate on the bill Tuesday afternoon, several protesters disrupted, chanting “kill the bill, don’t kill us,” “liars” and “shame” as they were removed from the House gallery overlooking the chamber. Undeterred, lawmakers proceeded to vote 227 to 203 on the bill.

“God made Republicans to cut taxes,” said Rep. Tom Cole (R-OK) with a chuckle, just before the vote. “This is in our DNA. Most people came here to try to do a number of things, but one of them is to lower the tax burden on the American people and to make American businesses more competitive. This is a very uniting theme for us.”

The bill, hammered out in negotiations behind closed doors over the past month, consists of a massive reduction in the corporate tax from 35 percent to 21 percent, a cut for people in the top tax bracket, the doubling of the standard deduction, and an increase in the child tax credit that will tend to favor higher earners.

The bill’s corporate tax cuts are permanent, but the individual tax cuts will expire, and a future Congress will have to decide whether or not to renew them.

The non-partisan Congressional Budget Office has reported that the elimination of Obamacare’s individual mandate will increase the number of uninsured people by 13 million by 2027, and drive up insurance premiums for those who remain in the market by at least 10 percent.

Because millions of people will no longer be insured and receiving government subsidies, the mandate’s repeal is expected to save the government more than $300 billion dollars over 10 years, though government and independent analysts say the bill will still increase the federal deficit by more than $1 trillion even when factoring in economic growth. Many Republican lawmakers have insisted without evidence that these reports are incorrect and that the tax bill will fully pay for itself and then some.

Taxpayers in high-tax, generally Democratic-leaning states will also take a major hit, as the bill reduces the amount of state and local taxes people can deduct down to $10,000. For that reason, a dozen New York, New Jersey and California Republicans who face difficult reelection races next year decided to vote no—far short of the number needed to derail the passage of the bill.

Speaking to TPM before the vote, Rep. Chris Collins (R-NY) derided his fellow New Yorkers for breaking with the Republican majority and voting against the package, saying they’ve bought into a narrative pushed by “liberal liars” and will be proven wrong when the bill goes into effect.

“In February, when the new brackets are out, and people get the $100 to $150, they’ll see,”insisted Collins, a multi-millionaire who is one of the wealthiest members of Congress. “I will stake my reelection on it. I will ask every New Yorker who gets a tax cut next year to vote for me, and I understand why those who will pay more won’t.”

We're all getting hosed.  Congrats rubes.

[GMDino]

Under #TaxCutsandJobsAct a married couple earning $100,000 per year ($60,000 from wages, $25,000 from their non-corporate business, and $15,000 in business income) will receive a tax cut of $2,603.50, a reduction of nearly 24 percent.

— Senator John Cornyn (@JohnCornyn) December 19, 2017

Dang!  If only I had wages from my non-corporate business!

What joke.

These guys wouldn't know what to do with out the corporate shills feeding them cash.

[GMDino]

Morons don't even know how to vote correctly.  

http://nbc4i.com/2017/12/19/house-to-revote-on-tax-plan-due-to-senate-rules-issue/

Quote:House to revote on tax plan due to Senate rules issue


WASHINGTON (AP) — Democrats say three provisions in the Republican $1.5 trillion tax bill violate Senate rules and will likely be removed before that chamber votes on the measure.

The House approved the legislation Tuesday. But this means the House will have to vote again on the legislation once it’s been amended and approved by the Senate.

Senate passage was expected Tuesday night or early Wednesday. GOP House Majority Leader Kevin McCarthy’s office says the House would reconsider the bill Wednesday morning and send it to President Donald Trump for his signature.

Democrats said the Senate parliamentarian had found three items that violated Senate rules.

These included one provision that would let families use tax-advantaged 529 accounts for home-schooling expenses.

The problem was revealed by Vermont independent Sen. Bernie Sanders and Oregon Democrat Ron Wyden.

According to a statement released by the ranking member of the Senate budget committee:

Quote:WASHINGTON, Dec. 19 – The Senate parliamentarian advised Tuesday that three provisions in the Republican tax bill violate the Byrd rule, including a provision allowing for the use of 529 savings accounts for home-schooling expenses, the short title: “The Tax Cuts and Jobs Act,” and part of the criteria used to determine whether the endowments of private universities are subject to the legislation’s new excise tax. These provisions may be struck from the conference report absent 60 votes.

Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.), ranking member of the Budget Committee, and Sen. Ron Wyden (D-Ore.), ranking member of the Finance Committee, issued a joint statement in response to the decision:

“In the mad dash to provide tax breaks for their billionaire campaign contributors, our Republican colleagues forgot to comply with the rules of the Senate.
We applaud the parliamentarian for determining that three provisions in this disastrous bill are in violation of the Byrd rule. It is our intention to raise a point of order to remove these provisions from the conference report and require the House to vote on this bill again. Instead of providing tax breaks to the wealthiest people and most profitable corporations, we need to rebuild the disappearing middle class.”

[ballsofsteel]

The majority of Trump's base, the one's he scared to death with his MAGA bullcrap, will get screwed along with the rest of the middle class but are too stupid to realize it or too embarrassed to admit that they were scammed. Rubes.