8 homicides in 1 day.

[CKwi88]

(09-11-2015, 03:54 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yes I do.

This argument makes no sense.  I don't believe a law against murder will end all murder, but I honestly believe that if murder were legal there would be a huge increase in the number of people killing each other.

Same with things like heroine.  If it were legal a lot more people would use it.

If unregistered guns are illegal to possess then a lot fewer people will possess them.  And remember that I am not "outlawing" guns.  I am just requiring that all owners must be licensed and that all guns must be registered to an owner.  That would make it much easier to keep guns out of the hands of every punk on the street, but at the same time it would not prevent a single law-abiding, sane person from owning a gun.

Not to mention that it would all drive up the cost of illegal guns. 

[jakefromstatefarm]

(09-11-2015, 03:54 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yes I do.

This argument makes no sense.  I don't believe a law against murder will end all murder, but I honestly believe that if murder were legal there would be a huge increase in the number of people killing each other.

Same with things like heroine.  If it were legal a lot more people would use it.

If unregistered guns are illegal to possess then a lot fewer people will possess them.  And remember that I am not "outlawing" guns.  I am just requiring that all owners must be licensed and that all guns must be registered to an owner.  That would make it much easier to keep guns out of the hands of every punk on the street, but at the same time it would not prevent a single law-abiding, sane person from owning a gun.

We already have laws about owning unregistered weapons.  We already have laws against violent felons owning guns.  We already have laws against using a gun in the commission of a crime.

These laws already exist, and bad guys do not obey them.  What makes you think that if you expand these laws that they will suddenly turn in their guns?

[jakefromstatefarm]

(09-11-2015, 03:58 PM)CKwi88 Wrote: Not to mention that it would all drive up the cost of illegal guns. 

How?

According to Fred, all of the bad guys will obey the law and turn in their guns.  They would have no interest in buying a gun, because if they're not a licensed gun owner, it would be against the law for them to own a gun.  Based on his opinion, that would suggest the price of illegal guns would actually go down.

[fredtoast]

(09-11-2015, 04:00 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: We already have laws about owning unregistered weapons. 

Really?

What is that law?

[fredtoast]

(09-11-2015, 04:00 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: These laws already exist, and bad guys do not obey them.  What makes you think that if you expand these laws that they will suddenly turn in their guns?

Okay, I don't think you have been getting my argument because you think there is already a law requiring all guns be registered.  

As far as I know in most places there is no law requiring all guns be registered to an owner.  

[*bfine32*]

(09-11-2015, 03:54 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I don't believe a law against murder will end all murder

Pretty sure we've already given it a shot.

[CKwi88]

(09-11-2015, 04:04 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: How?

According to Fred, all of the bad guys will obey the law and turn in their guns.  They would have no interest in buying a gun, because if they're not a licensed gun owner, it would be against the law for them to own a gun.  Based on his opinion, that would suggest the price of illegal guns would actually go down.

I don't think Fred has said any of that nonsense.

 Just because no law or combination of laws will ever prevent 100% of the crimes doesn't invalidate them. 

[jakefromstatefarm]

(09-11-2015, 05:01 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Really?

What is that law?

http://definitions.uslegal.com/p/possession-of-unregistered-firearm/


26 USCS § 5861 (d) makes it a Federal crime or offense to receive or possess a firearm which is not registered to him in the National Firearms Registration and Transfer Record.

In order for a person to be guilty of the offense, it should be proved beyond reasonable doubt that the person possessed a "firearm; and the "firearm" was not at that time registered to the person in the National Firearms Registration and Transfer Record.

[jakefromstatefarm]

(09-11-2015, 05:05 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Okay, I don't think you have been getting my argument because you think there is already a law requiring all guns be registered.  

As far as I know in most places there is no law requiring all guns be registered to an owner.  

Then you don't know what gun laws exist.

Maybe you should read up on them before discussing this further. 

[*bfine32*]

(09-11-2015, 05:19 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Then you don't know what gun laws exist.

Maybe you should read up on them before discussing this further. 

Well to be fair; he didn't even know we had a law against Murder.

[jakefromstatefarm]

(09-11-2015, 05:29 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Well to be fair; he didn't even know we had a law against Murder.

He also suggested that if heroin were legal, he'd do it. 

Thank God he's got mother government around to protect him from himself. 

[fredtoast]

(09-11-2015, 05:19 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Then you don't know what gun laws exist.

Maybe you should read up on them before discussing this further. 

I looked and couldn't find any.  What am I missing?  


I own a gun right now, and I can not find any law requiring me to register it anywhere.

[jakefromstatefarm]

(09-11-2015, 08:14 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I looked and couldn't find any.  What am I missing?  


I own a gun right now, and I can not find any law requiring me to register it anywhere.

Look up a few posts. 

[Rotobeast]

(09-11-2015, 05:18 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: http://definitions.uslegal.com/p/possession-of-unregistered-firearm/


26 USCS § 5861 (d) makes it a Federal crime or offense to receive or possess a firearm which is not registered to him in the National Firearms Registration and Transfer Record.

In order for a person to be guilty of the offense, it should be proved beyond reasonable doubt that the person possessed a "firearm; and the "firearm" was not at that time registered to the person in the National Firearms Registration and Transfer Record.

That is under the Machine Gun, Destructive Device code that involves firearms which need to be registered with the BATF.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/subtitle-E/chapter-53

[jakefromstatefarm]

(09-11-2015, 09:20 PM)Rotobeast Wrote: That is under the Machine Gun, Destructive Device code that involves firearms which need to be registered with the BATF.

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/26/subtitle-E/chapter-53

Yeah, that's my mistake. 

I assumed when I filled out paperwork for background checks for my two handguns, it was registering. 

[Belsnickel]

(09-11-2015, 09:54 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Yeah, that's my mistake. 

I assumed when I filled out paperwork for background checks for my two handguns, it was registering. 

Yeah, for most firearms there is no federal registry. Some states have a system. Here in Virginia, they don't know anything. They know a background check was performed and you purchased a firearm. They don't know anything else.

[Rotobeast]

(09-11-2015, 09:54 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Yeah, that's my mistake. 

I assumed when I filled out paperwork for background checks for my two handguns, it was registering. 

They were registered.
But person to person sales are not and do not require any FFL involvement, unless being purchased from someone in another state.