Goodell calls Trump's comments "divisive"

[Belsnickel]

(09-23-2017, 08:40 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Apart from the whole never ending protest/kneeling/CK back and forth...am I the only one who wishes that both Trump and Goodell would just STFU and go the hell away? 

I've been wanting that for a long time. Hell, I've been wanting that before Trump announced his candidacy. At least 7 years, now.

[BmorePat87]

The Falcons' owner had a good response.

Quote:We are at our very best when we are working together, building unity and including everyone’s voice in a constructive dialogue. Creating division or demonizing viewpoints that are different than our own accomplishes nothing positive and undermines our collective ability to achieve the ideals of our democracy.

The NFL has historically been a strong catalyst for positive change and I’m proud of the way our players, coaches and staff use that platform to give back to our community and strive to be good citizens making a positive impact on this and future generations.

[hollodero]

(09-23-2017, 08:28 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I actually agree that he says stuff like this to rally support from his base.

I just found it pathetic that ol' Rog is so fearful of backlash from the left that he called Trump's comment "divisive" when his players kneeling and throwing up black power signs is what's causing all of this talk in the first place. And none of the talk is productive. It's just causing people to hate each other.

Well, this is one interpretation amongst others. But why isn't the one and only issue here that Kaepernick et al. exercise their constitutional rights - while your president advocates for them not having the possibility or allowance to do so. That, I feel, is the important thing, not so much if one agrees with Kaep or not.

[*bfine32*]

(09-23-2017, 08:40 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Apart from the whole never ending protest/kneeling/CK back and forth...am I the only one who wishes that both Trump and Goodell would just STFU and go the hell away?  

I think Trump is the only man in the world that would lead many to emphasize with Goodell.

As to Trump's remarks: They are beneath the office. 

[*bfine32*]

(09-23-2017, 07:28 PM)Matt_Crimson Wrote: LOL. Yep it's official, Trump hates black people.

Don't think Kaep and Curry are black, so that can't be it. Must be something we're missing. Perhaps he hates folks with two-syllable first names.  

[Johnny Cupcakes]

(09-23-2017, 08:28 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I actually agree that he says stuff like this to rally support from his base.

I just found it pathetic that ol' Rog is so fearful of backlash from the left that he called Trump's comment "divisive" when his players kneeling and throwing up black power signs is what's causing all of this talk in the first place. And none of the talk is productive. It's just causing people to hate each other.

Can anyone tell me how all these protests are making the US better? It seems to me that all the division came from BLM and the protests, and is now conveniently being blamed on Trump. This stuff was just as bad when Obama was still in office.

These players protesting is definitely not what's causing people to hate each other. If anyone hates these players for doing it, they likely didn't like them for one particular reason or another to begin with.

As for how it's making the US better, I'd argue that anytime someone peacefully protests to bring light to injustice, it's making the country better. The division comes from the people whose nationalist idolatry is so strong that they've thrown a missive fit over some insignificant player starting a "movement" that they disagree with. The attention and butthurt has kept this all alive. Actually, it's what made it what it is.

And you're right...this stuff was just as bad when Obama was in office. It was the worst I've ever seen, I believe. Good ol' boys simply couldn't stand to see a black man rise to be the leader of the country, and it hurt their feelings even more when they saw that he was incredibly good, competent, and successful with the position.

BLM is important and history will shine well on the movement, as well as with the protesting players.

[Bengalholic]

(09-23-2017, 08:50 PM)hollodero Wrote: Well, this is one interpretation amongst others. But why isn't the one and only issue here that Kaepernick et al. exercise their constitutional rights - while your president advocates for them not having the possibility or allowance to do so. That, I feel, is the important thing, not so much if one agrees with Kaep or not.

Yeah, regardless of whether someone agrees or disagrees with what they're protesting against...they should support their 'right' to protest. 

[Shake n Blake]

(09-23-2017, 09:59 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Yeah, regardless of whether someone agrees or disagrees with what they're protesting against...they should support their 'right' to protest. 

Who said they don't have a right to protest? Trump said they should be fired. While I agree with bfine that it's beneath the office, he didn't say that they should be jailed. He said they should be fired. 

[Shake n Blake]

(09-23-2017, 09:31 PM)Johnny Cupcakes Wrote: These players protesting is definitely not what's causing people to hate each other. If anyone hates these players for doing it, they likely didn't like them for one particular reason or another to begin with.

As for how it's making the US better, I'd argue  that anytime someone peacefully protests to bring light to injustice, it's making the country better.  The division comes from the people whose nationalist idolatry is so strong that they've thrown a missive fit over some insignificant player starting a "movement" that they disagree with. The attention and butthurt has kept this all alive. Actually, it's what made it what it is.

And you're right...this stuff was just as bad when Obama was in office. It was the worst I've ever seen, I believe.  Good ol' boys simply couldn't stand to see a black man rise to be the leader of the country, and it hurt their feelings even more when they saw that he was incredibly good, competent, and successful with the position.

BLM is important and history will shine well on the movement, as well as with the protesting players.

Be specific. How are the protests helping? Are the protesters working with police more than they're alienating them? 

[Millhouse]

Kaepernick is a radicalized idiot that wore pro-Castro shirts and pig cop socks. I could give two squirts about his 'ordeal' because he is an idiot.

Trump is an idiot for even getting involved in this way. The only thing a President should say is to try to figure out ways to have all police out there give fair justice to all people. Not just point out those that kneel or revoking Curry from the NBA from coming to the White House.

Both are clueless on how to help bring society together, and both are idiots.

One last thing. Goodell is an idiot just because.

[Bengalholic]

(09-23-2017, 10:14 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Who said they don't have a right to protest? Trump said they should be fired. While I agree with bfine that it's beneath the office, he didn't say that they should be jailed. He said they should be fired. 

I was speaking more in general, and not so much about Trump specifically. 

Going back to Trump's statement though - how can someone 'disrespect the flag' by exercising their constitutional right to peacefully protest? Isn't that very flag the symbolic representation of that right, along with all the other freedoms we enjoy?

BTW brother, I'm not on any political side either. I'm fed up with the left and the right.  

[Shake n Blake]

(09-23-2017, 10:32 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I was speaking more in general, and not so much about Trump specifically. 

Going back to Trump's statement though - how can someone 'disrespect the flag' by exercising their constitutional right to peacefully protest? Isn't that very flag the symbolic representation of that right, along with all the other freedoms we enjoy?

BTW brother, I'm not on any political side either. I'm fed up with the left and the right.  

I get what you're trying to say. Kinda. That said, if we don't view kneeling for the anthem as disrespectful, how about burning the flag? Turning your backs on soldiers? Seems like a slippery slope to me. Why bother honoring anything anymore if nothing is sacred? I don't think there should be laws against such protests. That would be un-American. Should employers stand for it? Or allow employees to use their jobs as a platform for such protests? That's a different story, and it wouldn't violate any rights if employers decided not to stand for such behavior.

[StLucieBengal]

We need to stop thinking of this as just them speaking out in public. They are on the job and this is a workplace decorum issue.

If the employer is ok with them acting like a bunch of fools then that's on them.

[Bengalholic]

(09-23-2017, 10:44 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I get what you're trying to say. Kinda. That said, if we don't view kneeling for the anthem as disrespectful, how about burning the flag? Turning your backs on soldiers? Seems like a slippery slope to me. Why bother honoring anything anymore if nothing is sacred?

Speaking specifically about the anthem, what are the acceptable perimeters of respect? If I have my hand over my heart, but leave my hat on, is that OK or am I an SOB who should be escorted from the stadium? What if I have the squirts and don't feel like standing? Have I trampled on a sacred tradition?  And yes, I'm being a bit sarcastic - a bit.

Standing for the anthem is a purely symbolic gesture, as is kneeling in protest. One gesture is showing respect for the freedoms we have, while the other is exercising one of those very freedoms. I support both.

BTW, how the hell did we end up in PnR?

[Bengalholic]

(09-23-2017, 10:44 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Should employers stand for it? Or allow employees to use their jobs as a platform for such protests? That's a different story, and it wouldn't violate any rights if employers decided not to stand for such behavior.

Agreed. While I support the players right to protest/kneel and don't necessarily find anything disrespectful about it...because an NFL field is their workplace...the owner(s) would be within their rights to not permit it, if they chose.

[Belsnickel]

(09-23-2017, 10:44 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I get what you're trying to say. Kinda. That said, if we don't view kneeling for the anthem as disrespectful, how about burning the flag? Turning your backs on soldiers? Seems like a slippery slope to me. Why bother honoring anything anymore if nothing is sacred? I don't think there should be laws against such protests. That would be un-American. Should employers stand for it? Or allow employees to use their jobs as a platform for such protests? That's a different story, and it wouldn't violate any rights if employers decided not to stand for such behavior.

Did you know that printing flag paper plates, napkins, and cups is disrespectful per US law? How about embroidering the flag on something, or using the flag in a design for clothing of any sort? Carrying it horizontally, like they do at some opening ceremonies is disrespectful, and so is using it in advertising.

These are things that are against the US Flag Code, and IIRC, specifically in the section for respect for the flag. The line is a subjective one drawn wherever each individual takes offense. Each person is going to have their own opinions on these things. Hell, I could make arguments that the way the flag is respected by many in this country would be idolatry. This includes the pledge made to it that makes use of God's name in vain.

[*bfine32*]

(09-23-2017, 11:05 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Speaking specifically about the anthem, what are the acceptable perimeters of respect? If I have my hand over my heart, but leave my hat on, is that OK or am I an SOB who should be escorted from the stadium? What if I have the squirts and don't feel like standing? Have I trampled on a sacred tradition?  And yes, I'm being a bit sarcastic - a bit.

Standing for the anthem is a purely symbolic gesture, as is kneeling in protest. One gesture is showing respect for the freedoms we have, while the other is exercising one of those very freedoms. I support both.

BTW, how the hell did we end up in PnR?

If you do any of the things you mention with the intention of going against decorum then yes you are disrespecting the flag. But yes, you have the right to disrespect the flag if you so choose and many men have died fighting for that flag to give you the right to disrespect it. 

[Shake n Blake]

(09-23-2017, 11:05 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Speaking specifically about the anthem, what are the acceptable perimeters of respect? If I have my hand over my heart, but leave my hat on, is that OK or am I an SOB who should be escorted from the stadium? What if I have the squirts and don't feel like standing? Have I trampled on a sacred tradition?  And yes, I'm being a bit sarcastic - a bit.

Standing for the anthem is a purely symbolic gesture, as is kneeling in protest. One gesture is showing respect for the freedoms we have, while the other is exercising one of those very freedoms. I support both.

BTW, how the hell did we end up in PnR?

While I may not like the guy in aisle 57 eating nachos during the Anthem, I feel players have a greater responsibility to do the right thing and set an example for everyone (which includes millions of kids). They're in the public eye. Not Joe Six Pack.

And I got lost on the way to Jungle Noise. Figured it'd be a good time to make my bi-yearly PnR cameo. 

(09-23-2017, 11:12 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Agreed. While I support the players right to protest/kneel and don't necessarily find anything disrespectful about it...because an NFL field is their workplace...the owner(s) would be within their rights to not permit it, if they chose.

We only disagree on whether or not it's disrespectful. If the majority didn't view it as such, Kaepernick would've never kneeled in the first place. He needed a platform that would elicit the desired reaction. He found it. Now many folks (not saying you) are redefining whether or not his actions were disrespectful because they want to focus on his cause.

If they want to talk about the cause, fine. Lets talk. Don't pretend his actions weren't disrespectful though. An apology for his actions and a willingness to work with people (particularly police) would be a good start towards mending the division in this country.

Instead, Kaep remains silent and the worthless protests continue. Nothing is being accomplished.

[*jason*]

(09-23-2017, 08:28 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: I actually agree that he says stuff like this to rally support from his base.

I just found it pathetic that ol' Rog is so fearful of backlash from the left that he called Trump's comment "divisive" when his players kneeling and throwing up black power signs is what's causing all of this talk in the first place. And none of the talk is productive. It's just causing people to hate each other.

Can anyone tell me how all these protests are making the US better? It seems to me that all the division came from BLM and the protests, and is now conveniently being blamed on Trump. This stuff was just as bad when Obama was still in office.

I can't explain how these protests are making America better. They aren't making it worse either. Not everything has to be argument. If people don't like what they're saying they should do themselves a favor and move on. Colin Kaepernick, Michael Bennett, and Marshawn Lynch aren't really that important. I wish I had enough leisure time that I could worry about what they think about issues, or how they express it. Can they entertain me for a few hours or score some points for my fantasy team? That's all I care about.

[samhain]

I'd be fairly surprised if the president's comments about Kaepernick don't cause a significant increase in protesting players tomorrow.