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(07-18-2015, 07:49 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: None of these are valid excuses to allow special interest groups to manipulate data, which is what would happen.
EPA regulations should be based on scientific findings that are peer reviewed. And most of them are. The problem is that some people that don't necessarily understand the scientific method or how to interpret the data don't like the findings and so rely on a minority of people that do have credentials in a vaguely related field (or one that just sounds similar) to present some contrary evidence for a straw man attack.
Yes but the hysteria on this issue is the pro enviornment side. Which I don't mind but it's the government boon doggle that exploits money to their donors.
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(07-18-2015, 07:56 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: All they're looking for here, is transparency. You know, one of the items that B.H. Obama ran his campaign on...
No their not. Their looking for a way to help their corporate masters. 
Which members of congress will be looking at the studies? What is there background in the field? Who is paying them?
Its politics to them. Not science. They don't give a hairy rats hiney about the data...all they care about is getting re-elected.
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(07-18-2015, 07:59 PM)GMDino Wrote: No their not. Their looking for a way to help their corporate masters.
Which members of congress will be looking at the studies? What is there background in the field? Who is paying them?
Its politics to them. Not science. They don't give a hairy rats hiney about the data...all they care about is getting re-elected.
Exactly why everything should be transparent, it allows for question. Wasn't the entire premise of the US to get away from rule without question? Why do you have a problem with it, today?
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(07-18-2015, 08:07 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Exactly why everything should be transparent, it allows for question. Wasn't the entire premise of the US to get away from rule without question? Why do you have a problem with it, today?
Because it will be business as usual with non-scientists deciding was is "right". That has nothing to do with "transparency" and everything to do with politics.
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(07-18-2015, 08:17 PM)GMDino Wrote: Because it will be business as usual with non-scientists deciding was is "right". That has nothing to do with "transparency" and everything to do with politics.
So, simple transparency means that non-scientists will be making the decisions??
Do explain, I'm not sure that I understand why the American People shouldn't be allowed to read the "science" behind the EPA's findings.
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(07-18-2015, 08:26 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: So, simple transparency means that non-scientists will be making the decisions??
Do explain, I'm not sure that I understand why the American People shouldn't be allowed to read the "science" behind the EPA's findings.
Because most of the America people wouldn't understand any of it...just the spin from the politician.
Heck there's a large percentage of American people who just believe God will take care of everything. And only a few of them are on the Science Committee in congress.
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(07-18-2015, 08:29 PM)GMDino Wrote: Because most of the America people wouldn't understand any of it...just the spin from the politician.
Heck there's a large percentage of American people who just believe God will take care of everything. And only a few of them are on the Science Committee in congress.
Lol! You want to deny the public to information, because, according to you, they wouldn't understand what they read??
Glad that you aren't running for office...
Edit: And then there is this...
http://dailycaller.com/2015/07/17/satellites-earth-is-nearly-in-its-21st-year-without-global-warming/
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(07-18-2015, 08:32 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Lol! You want to deny the public to information, because, according to you, they wouldn't understand what they read??
Glad that you aren't running for office...
Typical progresssive move right there.... They know better than you.
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(07-18-2015, 08:32 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Lol! You want to deny the public to information, because, according to you, they wouldn't understand what they read??
Glad that you aren't running for office...
Edit: And then there is this...
http://dailycaller.com/2015/07/17/satellites-earth-is-nearly-in-its-21st-year-without-global-warming/
Scientific data and information? Yep. The average (or above average) citizen would have no idea what the numbers mean. Period.
Let the scientists do it and present their findings. You MIGHT understand that. Except they have been doing that and the same people who now want to "see the numbers" have been denying the results too. Without seeing the numbers. 
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(07-18-2015, 09:21 PM)GMDino Wrote: Scientific data and information? Yep. The average (or above average) citizen would have no idea what the numbers mean. Period.
Let the scientists do it and present their findings. You MIGHT understand that. Except they have been doing that and the same people who now want to "see the numbers" have been denying the results too. Without seeing the numbers.
They have been manipulating the temperatures to make their models look a certain way . They claim one thing and when it does the opposite they change to continue their boon doggle.
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(07-18-2015, 09:21 PM)GMDino Wrote: Scientific data and information? Yep. The average (or above average) citizen would have no idea what the numbers mean. Period.
Let the scientists do it and present their findings. You MIGHT understand that. Except they have been doing that and the same people who now want to "see the numbers" have been denying the results too. Without seeing the numbers.
(07-18-2015, 09:29 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: They have been manipulating the temperatures to make their models look a certain way . They claim one thing and when it does the opposite they change to continue their boon doggle.
See! 
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(07-18-2015, 09:35 PM)GMDino Wrote: See!
So it's ok to manipulate the base of the whole model to fit the ending they want? Idc if they are right or wrong. Just leave the models alone, the base factors alone and see what comes out. None of this Monday morning qb to fix it
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(07-18-2015, 12:23 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: The problem I have with this is who decides on what is the best available science? I think that is the problem at the heart of this bill, because it sounds like the lawmakers want to be the ones making that call. Quite frankly, that is frightening.
I didn't really get that at all from reading. It was vague at "deciding" who it would be, but it seems that since most of congress are lawyers, they wouldn't be stupid enough (lulz, i really just typed that) to stick their noses where it doesn't belong.
But seriously, i would think they're just trying to make sure that all decisions are open to anyone qualified to question or confirm the findings. Simply, transparent so that no one has an opportunity to get sketchy. If it's available, it's available to be questioned. If it's true, it will stand up to testing and peer review.
I agree that lawmakers making these decisions would be frightening.
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http://news.discovery.com/earth/global-warming/earth-broke-multiple-warming-records-in-2014-150718.htm
![[Image: dnews-files-2015-07-temps-150717-jpg.jpg]](http://static.ddmcdn.com/gif/blogs/dnews-files-2015-07-temps-150717-jpg.jpg)
Quote:As has been seen year after year, the warming of the Earth is causing major changes in many aspects of the planet’s climate, and 2014 was yet another year that showed this trend in stark relief, a report released Thursday says.
Numerous records were broken last year, according to the State of the Climate report, an annual checkup of the global climate published in a special issue of the journal Bulletin of the American Meteorological Society.
...
Earth’s temperature is rising: A direct consequence of the build-up of greenhouse gases is a steady rise in Earth’s average temperature from all the excess heat those gases trap and prevent from escaping out into space. Arndt called this temperature rise “one of the most obvious connections to a changing climate.”
Four datasets of global temperatures ranked 2014 as the warmest year on record (or tied for warmest) going back to 1880. A Climate Central analysis showed that 13 of the hottest 15 years on record have all occurred since 2000 and that the odds of that happening randomly without the boost of global warming is 1 in 27 million.
The year was also the warmest on record for particular regions, from California to Europe. A separate Climate Central analysis showed that warming made that record for Europe 35 to 80 times more likely.
Another aspect of the warming trend is the increase in the hottest days and the decrease in the coldest nights, which the new report showed was a trend that continued in 2014.
...
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(07-18-2015, 07:59 PM)GMDino Wrote: No their not. Their looking for a way to help their corporate masters.
Which members of congress will be looking at the studies? What is there background in the field? Who is paying them?
Its politics to them. Not science. They don't give a hairy rats hiney about the data...all they care about is getting re-elected.
I just don't get where some of you are coming up with the extreme thoughts on 'the worst that could happen'. If it's open, it's open for anyone to review. If someone were to try and manipulate it...they couldn't because whether the data was wrong from the beginning, or whether it was "tampered" with or changed...not having it 'behind closed doors' allows for less corruption.
No?
What am i missing here?
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(07-18-2015, 08:26 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: So, simple transparency means that non-scientists will be making the decisions??
Do explain, I'm not sure that I understand why the American People shouldn't be allowed to read the "science" behind the EPA's findings.
Or, like...other independent scientists.
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(07-18-2015, 09:59 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Ha! But, you seemed to ignore this..
http://dailycaller.com/2015/07/17/satellites-earth-is-nearly-in-its-21st-year-without-global-warming/
Quote:ABOUT US
Founded in 2010 by Tucker Carlson, a 20-year veteran journalist, and Neil Patel, former chief policy advisor to Vice President Cheney
Read more: http://dailycaller.com/about-us/#ixzz3gIMw6t4z
[url=http://dailycaller.com/about-us/#ixzz3gIMw6t4z][/url]
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(07-18-2015, 10:09 PM)GMDino Wrote: [url=http://dailycaller.com/about-us/#ixzz3gIMw6t4z][/url]
My apologies, that was most definitely not the article that I wanted to post..
Try this one.
http://dailycaller.com/2015/07/17/satellites-earth-is-nearly-in-its-21st-year-without-global-warming/
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