House fails to override veto of Obamacare repeal

[Belsnickel]

(02-04-2016, 02:10 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Without repeal there is zero incentive for the democrats to actually participate in Good faith.

Sure there is. As Fred has pointed out, and it is true, many Democrats don't like the ACA for a number of reasons. If there was a negotiating table brought together they would be more than willing to talk things out. The GOP is obviously close to having the votes for a repeal of the whole thing, so if they said 'let's get a bipartisan group together to transform the ACA into something better' then they could have enough votes (if they don't lose the hardliners that just don't like the federal government doing things in general) to override a veto even if it came down.

There is plenty of incentive there is the table is just brought together.

[Aquapod770]

(02-04-2016, 02:07 PM)GMDino Wrote: Six years have passed and the GOP ha not proposed anything other than to get rid of the ACA.

That tells me all I need to know about any kind of "compromise agreement" that you think could have happened.

http://www.senate.gov/legislative/active_leg_page.htm



That's just the senate. And that was just Feburary 1st. Obviously not all of those bills were proposed by the GOP or a republican, but I think a better statement would be...

"Six years have passed and the only thing that gets reported on is the GOP trying to get rid of the ACA." 

[StLucieBengal]

(02-04-2016, 02:40 PM)Benton Wrote: That was/is lip service. The Dems had a majority, they asked the GOP to participate. They did by saying they wanted no HCR. If you have a seat at the table and decline the invitation, you don't have any room to complain about getting left out of the talks.

As far as majority of Americans hate, that's probably more personal belief than polling. Even after six years of spin by the GOP, there's usually a 5-6% polling difference in those who support and those who oppose. And some of those who oppose do so because they think it didn't go far enough. That's not hate.

There is no seat at the table if they say here is how it's gonna go. Either get on or beat it.

I have yet to meet 1 person who either doesn't pay more for their healthcare. I am sure there are some but not around anyone that I have come across and spoken about healthcare. When healthcare comes up most just roll their eyes and complain about Obamacare and the IRS.

[fredtoast]

(02-04-2016, 03:06 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: I have yet to meet 1 person who either doesn't pay more for their healthcare.   I am sure there are some but not around anyone that I have come across and spoken about healthcare.   When healthcare comes up most just roll their eyes and complain about Obamacare and the IRS.

Health care costs were going up beforew the ACA also.

(02-04-2016, 03:06 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: There is no seat at the table if they say here is how it's gonna go.   Either get on or beat it.  

They did not do that.  If they had it would not have taken a year to pass the bill.

[StLucieBengal]

(02-04-2016, 02:40 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Sure there is. As Fred has pointed out, and it is true, many Democrats don't like the ACA for a number of reasons. If there was a negotiating table brought together they would be more than willing to talk things out. The GOP is obviously close to having the votes for a repeal of the whole thing, so if they said 'let's get a bipartisan group together to transform the ACA into something better' then they could have enough votes (if they don't lose the hardliners that just don't like the federal government doing things in general) to override a veto even if it came down.

There is plenty of incentive there is the table is just brought together.

There is no incentive to move towards anything a conservative would promote.

This is the type issue that should have to be voted on every 10 years. We have a lot of these types.

[GMDino]

(02-04-2016, 03:05 PM)Aquapod770 Wrote: http://www.senate.gov/legislative/active_leg_page.htm



That's just the senate. And that was just Feburary 1st. Obviously not all of those bills were proposed by the GOP or a republican, but I think a better statement would be...

"Six years have passed and the only thing that gets reported on is the GOP trying to get rid of the ACA." 

I was quoting what was in the OP...that they promised to have a proposal some time THIS YEAR.

As to your link I'm not sure what I am to be looking for?  I saw three "health care" related items: two were the same and I think those were the ones the tried to use to defund parts of the ACA, and one to repeal the ACA.

Edit:

http://freebeacon.com/issues/republican-congressmen-introduce-new-health-care-reform-proposal/

February 9, 2015 2:00 pm

Several Republican leaders of Congress released a new health-care reform plan late last week, a move which is the first substantive policy volley of the new Congress in the ongoing battle over Obamacare.

The plan proposes to do what Republicans promised in the lead-up to the mid-term elections: repeal the Affordable Care Act, the president’s signature domestic policy achievement. The proposal—put forward by Sen. Richard Burr (R, N.C.), Sen. Orrin Hatch (R, Utah), and Rep. Fred Upton (R, Mich.)—indicates that the GOP has the broad outlines for a market-based reform but is still far from settling the details.

Here are four points to note about the law:

1. Republicans do not want to go back to the pre-Obamacare system
2. Republicans want to expand access while also containing costs, and they want to use the market to do it
3. To reform Medicaid, the GOP wants to harness federalism and integrate the poor into the broader private market
4. Republicans are not tackling Medicare, and are only minimally changing tax-free employer-sponsored insurance

[Belsnickel]

(02-04-2016, 03:14 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: There is no incentive to move towards anything a conservative would promote.

This is the type issue that should have to be voted on every 10 years. We have a lot of these types.

Sure there is. With the divisiveness of the country no one can sit around and just wish that one party won't get a super majority that can override a veto or get control of both elected branches of government. By going to the table and negotiating a bipartisan deal they can help insure that there will not be a cluster **** after the elections.

I guess my problem is that I see the incentive as being doing what is best for the people of this country. It's the whole idealist attitude I have as a civil servant, serving the people and all. It's apparently not seen as an incentive for some, and it's not enough of an incentive for the people that is really should be the biggest incentive for.

[Benton]

(02-04-2016, 03:06 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: There is no seat at the table if they say here is how it's gonna go.   Either get on or beat it.  

I have yet to meet 1 person who either doesn't pay more for their healthcare.   I am sure there are some but not around anyone that I have come across and spoken about healthcare.   When healthcare comes up most just roll their eyes and complain about Obamacare and the IRS.

Same company for 15 years. My insurance went up every year until five years ago. It's gone up once since then (about 3%). And my deductible went down once in that same time. Gotta say, I'm pretty happy. I'm paying almost double what I was 15 years ago, but I'm not paying any more than I was 10 years ago. That's a vast improvement. I can't imagine what I would've been paying if it continued increasing at the rate it had been. I probably would have had to drop insurance coverage in a few years at that rate.

I think most people complain and roll their eyes because they're grossly uninformed. Healthcare costs for the first time in a long time are stabilizing and getting more manageable. 

http://www.cnbc.com/2015/04/15/obamacare-has-modest-effect-on-job-insurance-costs-study.html

Quote:And since last year, premiums have risen by 2.6 percent, which ADP noted is lower than the rates seen in the past decade.

I don't do HR for my company. But the people in HR the last couple years have been a lot happier because they haven't killed themselves trying to find or negotiate insurance packages that were 5-10% more expensive than the previous year. They're finding packages that are either flat or 3% increase for that one year.


To the bold, we'll never know — they didn't go. Which is why a lot of people got fed up with them. They had the opportunity to a- submit a plan and have it go ignored or b- submit a plan and have it incorporated. They chose c- stomp their feet and complain a lot.

Now they're stomping their feet again 60 times and costing taxpayers millions.

[StLucieBengal]

(02-04-2016, 03:24 PM)Benton Wrote: Same company for 15 years. My insurance went up every year until five years ago. It's gone up once since then (about 3%). And my deductible went down once in that same time. Gotta say, I'm pretty happy. I'm paying almost double what I was 15 years ago, but I'm not paying any more than I was 10 years ago. That's a vast improvement. I can't imagine what I would've been paying if it continued increasing at the rate it had been. I probably would have had to drop insurance coverage in a few years at that rate.

I think most people complain and roll their eyes because they're grossly uninformed. Healthcare costs for the first time in a long time are stabilizing and getting more manageable. 

http://www.cnbc.com/2015/04/15/obamacare-has-modest-effect-on-job-insurance-costs-study.html


I don't do HR for my company. But the people in HR the last couple years have been a lot happier because they haven't killed themselves trying to find or negotiate insurance packages that were 5-10% more expensive than the previous year. They're finding packages that are either flat or 3% increase for that one year.


To the bold, we'll never know — they didn't go. Which is why a lot of people got fed up with them. They had the opportunity to a- submit a plan and have it go ignored or b- submit a plan and have it incorporated. They chose c- stomp their feet and complain a lot.

Now they're stomping their feet again 60 times and costing taxpayers millions.

Was your company or plan under one of the many who were let out of the Obamacare law? The fact that we allow some our and not others is an issue . Unions were against it until they got their payoff and exempted.

[fredtoast]

(02-04-2016, 05:01 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote:   Unions were against it until they got their payoff and exempted.

What?  Companies with unionized work forces are exempted from the ACA?  Do you have a link to back that up?

[Benton]

(02-04-2016, 05:01 PM)StLucieBengal Wrote: Was your company or plan under one of the many who were let out of the Obamacare law?    The fact that we allow some our and not others is an issue .   Unions were against it until they got their payoff and exempted.

no.

[StLucieBengal]

(02-04-2016, 05:14 PM)fredtoast Wrote: What?  Companies with unionized work forces are exempted from the ACA?  Do you have a link to back that up?

http://www.forbes.com/forbes/welcome/#5a1aa41dbaa0

Just search unions exempt from Obamacare
Loads pop up.

Quote:The White House Earns Its Union Label

In addition to delaying and rewriting key ACA provisions and carving out a special subsidy for members of Congress, Obama’s latest constitutional violation will exempt unions from a fee the law imposes upon all large group health plans. That provision which appears in Section 1341 (b)(1)(A)  establishes a reinsurance program to compensate insurers on exchanges in the individual market if they are hit with higher than expected costs to cover those with pre-existing conditions. This will come from insurers and self-insured employers who pay in proportion to the number of people they cover. The target is to raise $25 billion during 2014, amounting to $63 per covered employee. The union exemption would kick in for 2015 and 2016.

As reported in a Wall Street Journal editorial, “The unions hate this reinsurance transfer because it takes from their members in the form of higher premiums and gives to people on the exchanges.”