How can you justify NOT starting AJ McCarron the rest of the season?

[Goalpost]

No need to beat up McCarron on this. In limited play, his regular season stats and playoff stats are actually slightly better than Andy's. I'm not going to post them, but look them up.

[The Caped Crusader]

(11-06-2017, 11:57 AM)Goalpost Wrote: No need to beat up McCarron on this.  In limited play, his regular season stats and playoff stats are actually slightly better than Andy's.  I'm not going to post them, but look them up.

The same team Dalton was having an MVP caliber year, McCarron scooted by with 'okay' numbers...they weren't 'slightly' better than Andy's. Andy was in the running for MVP before his injury.

[Devils Advocate]

(11-06-2017, 11:24 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: I dont really care at this point. I'de rather evaluate AJ and see if hes the guy.
 

I’d guess he gets plenty of evaluation during practice & preseason, as well as game time two years ago.

[firstand10]

The natives are already getting restless on this team. Why not give AJ a shot? True,even M1Abrams tanks probably wouldn't help the O line but it's obvious something has to done to give this team a spark!

[BMK]

(11-06-2017, 11:34 AM)Big Boss Wrote:  How did he look in the three regular season starts he made?  How did he look this preseason?  For the life of me, I don't know what people have seen from the guy that perpetuates this idea that we're just sitting on some secret juggernaut waiting to be unleashed.    

Because the most popular guy on any struggling team is the back up quarterback. 

[Shake n Blake]

At this point, I really don't care. The Bengals aren't winning no matter who they trot out there. Mike Brown sucks. Marvin and Ivory Tickler suck. The line is a disaster. We can't run (32nd in rush yards AND average per rush). Our defense looks disinterested. We're probably several years from winning again. I'm to the point where I hope the Bengals start McCarron just so I can sit back and have a laugh at all the folks who thought he'd be better than Dalton.

It'd be pretty hilarious to watch these anti-Dalton guys start defending Mac by blaming the line for his terrible performances. They'd be correct, but it would just expose their hypocrisy. Dalton gets no such benefit of the doubt.

[sonofstat]

be careful what you wish for....the way the pass protection has looked we may yet seem him this year.

Personally I don't think he's the saviour and agree that the only thing that happens if we start him is that he looks bad and drives down his value

[George Cantstandya]

I don't see what starting AJ the rest of the season would solve, especially behind this horrible o-line. He is most likely going to another team next year so it would more or less just be an audition for his potential suitors. In 2018 he will either be a restricted free agent or an unrestricted free agent depending on what happens with his case. If he is a restricted free agent the Bengals will put a tender on him meaning that if he gets an offer from another team the Bengals have the option to match it or receive a draft pick based on the tender. If he is a unrestricted free agent he is free to go wherever and the Bengals best case get a comp pick. I think AJ is ready to move on to a team where he can have a legit shot at be a starter. There are several teams I think will be looking at him.

So what happens if AJ somehow manages to play amazing the rest of the season behind one of the worst o-lines in the NFL? Then the Bengals have an issue. Andy is still on the roster. So do they throw a very expensive franchise tag on AJ to keep him and then trade Andy? If not and AJ remains a restricted free agent do they put a 1st round tender on him and hope no one bites? If not AJ is most likely off to another team that wants to give him a shot at a starting job. I don't see a case where starting AJ the rest of the season is of benefit to anyone. You bench a team leader for a guy that is more than likely going to be on another team next year to play behind the still horrible o-line. I don't see this as a solution.

As others have stated, AJs value still looks pretty high at this point. He is probably going to be worth a second round tender if he remains a restricted free agent. So what happens if he plays like crud? His value drops significantly. So is it worth the chance of his value dropping behind a terrible o-line and a team with few offensive weapons?

[Shake n Blake]

(11-06-2017, 02:20 PM)BMK Wrote: Because the most popular guy on any struggling team is the back up quarterback. 

Fair enough, but I can remember when we were winning and people were saying we should give Jason Campbell a shot.

People didn't just start hating Dalton last year.

[Millhouse]

Even though it will never happen, I'd be for it for a few reasons, none of which really relate to AJM himself but 1.

- it will show ownership that the problem of the team lies mainly with the o-line right now
- it could show other players that their jobs arent safe anymore, and might motivate them more than ever. aka Marvin will do whatever it takes to win.
- it will keep Andy healthy going into next year
- Andy can take time to reflect and re-learn things from the sideline perspective; a mid-career jumpstart if you will
- more tv shots of AJMs wife
- last but not least, what if AJM actually does kicks this offense into another gear and they produce? Not saying he would or wouldn't, but if he did, would that really be such a bad thing? And if he didn't, then is that a bad thing as well for all the Dalton fanboys?

As I said it wont happen, but at this point it would breathe some new air into me as a fan of this current team, because anything different at this point is welcome by me when it concern this horrific offense.

[WhoDeyandtheBlowFish]

(11-06-2017, 11:24 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: I dont really care at this point. I'de rather evaluate AJ and see if hes the guy.
 

Spoiler alert. He's not the guy

[THE PISTONS]

(11-06-2017, 02:28 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Fair enough, but I can remember when we were winning and people were saying we should give Jason Campbell a shot.

People didn't just start hating Dalton last year.

Honestly...not being able to run the ball is a big handicap.

Not being able to run the ball and having interior defenders running untouched at the QB is impossible.

[THE PISTONS]

I atleast conceptually understand the want to play McCarron. There aren't a ton of variables we can change at this point.

[*bfine32*]

I do not think AJM should replace Andy this year. I wouldn't mind seeing a little shorter leash when he is struggling though. Folks say no QB could perform behind this line. They don't know this; they're just making it up. Andy, himself has had some fine games behind this line. he just hasn't been able to sustain it.

[Shake n Blake]

(11-06-2017, 02:37 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Honestly...not being able to run the ball is a big handicap.

Not being able to run the ball and having interior defenders running untouched at the QB is impossible.

That gets lost a bit in the shuffle...or I should say it just isn't talked about enough. We are 32nd in rush yards and yards per carry. 72.3 yards per game in pathetic. 20 teams are averaging 101.6 or better. 29 teams are averaging 81.9 or better.

We are averaging 3.07 yards per carry. The 29th ranked team is averaging 3.48 per carry. 20 teams are averaging at least 4 per carry. As poor as we've been at running the ball over the last 12 years, that 3.07 average is by far the worst in team history. 

[PDub80]

(11-06-2017, 11:21 AM)bengals67 Wrote: no QB can perform without any running game and with D lineman in his face up the middle a second after the ball is snapped.

I said this in another post but this season could be completely different if they had resigned Whit and Zeitler and replaced Bodine.

Organization is run by stubborn  men who won't admit mistakes and with no vision or courage to make changes when needed.

Please... Stop. The excuse making is pathetically sad. There's a difference between explanations and excuses. These blanket statements as if Andy hasn't had any chances to be good or great are sad excuses.

Andy Dalton has missed plays and been bad even when he's had time this season. Sorry, but he has. He's missed plenty of throws that were needed when they were there to make. Certainly a lot more than he's made. He's not under duress every single snap. Not at all or even close. He's had time and blown it.... over and over.

NOBODY in their right mind is thinking "Well, with Andy Dalton the Bengals have a chance." when the Bengals are underdogs. He's not any sort of big reason the Bengals win or any sort of significant significant difference maker. Virtually ANY starter in the NFL over the past few seasons would be able to have done what Andy Dalton has done with this team around him.

This doesn't excuse the bad Oline play. It's been horrific. But when the plays have been there... He leads AJ out of bounds. Over.. and over... and over. He sucks.

At this point, AJ McCarron, even if similar in skill set to Andy Dalton... is $96MILLION cheaper. $96million buys some nice Olinemen. I would take AJ Mac & an upgraded Oline over AD and this crap show he's been running.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-06-2017, 11:13 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: How can you justify it?

At this point, us and the Bengals know what we have in Dalton. Andy has reached his potential and his ceiling is somewhere between below average (when he has a bad offensive line and offense) to above average (when everything on the offense is perfect).

So, why not start McCarron and see what you have in the guy? See if hes the answer at quarterback and see if hes an upgrade over Dalton. The season is all but over (no way this team is good enough to make the playoffs).

We have seen what we have in AJM as well and he sucked all Offseason and has a much slower release then Dalton.

Might be able to set the sack record if we put AJM in, if that is what you want.

Keep starting Dalton and hope he turns it around and plays decent and maybe we might be able to get something for him.

The Browns guy up top sabotaged the trade for AJM cause he knew he wasn't worth it and this is the Browns.

I would trade Dalton and draft Baker Mayfield.

[*Nate (formerly eliminate08)*]

(11-06-2017, 11:57 AM)Goalpost Wrote: No need to beat up McCarron on this.  In limited play, his regular season stats and playoff stats are actually slightly better than Andy's.  I'm not going to post them, but look them up.

With a much better O-line than we have now as Caped Crusader here says.

I actually wouldn't be against starting AJM if he played well this Offseason and Preseason but he sucked worse than Driskell.

Cannot believe Hue was even interested in him, maybe he didn't pay attention to AJM this year.

(11-06-2017, 12:04 PM)The Caped Crusader Wrote: The same team Dalton was having an MVP caliber year, McCarron scooted by with 'okay' numbers...they weren't 'slightly' better than Andy's. Andy was in the running for MVP before his injury.

Exactly. :andy:

[muskiesfan]

(11-06-2017, 02:52 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: That gets lost a bit in the shuffle...or I should say it just isn't talked about enough. We are 32nd in rush yards and yards per carry. 72.3 yards per game in pathetic. 20 teams are averaging 101.6 or better. 29 teams are averaging 81.9 or better.

We are averaging 3.07 yards per carry. The 29th ranked team is averaging 3.48 per carry. 20 teams are averaging at least 4 per carry. As poor as we've been at running the ball over the last 12 years, that 3.07 average is by far the worst in team history. 

Not to beat our shitty rushing attack to death, but Jets QB Josh McCown has more rushing touchdowns than the entire Bengals offense (3 to 2). So we have no rushing attack and a bad OLine that allows free runners at our QB, however it's Dalton's fault for teams being able to drop everyone in coverage, blitz whenever they want, and not respect the running game.

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

(11-06-2017, 11:21 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Your QB is your leader. When you bench him you signal to the team that he's the issue. That leadership is done then.

Yeah, plus, what if AJ gets hurt badly behind this line?  You may damage his value IF he comes out of this deal a RFA.