Scouts also handle free agency too at some level and gameplanning. It's kind of hard to have coaches scouting as the college season is during the NFL season. If they wait until after the season, other teams just gained 4 months. I know that people will counter with you don't need scouts with TV, but lets compare us to the 49ers who are currently undefeated:
So under Personnel & Scouting...the 49ers have 21 people listed. That doesn't count John Lynch who is their GM. And they have a football analytics department in addition that has a salary cap specialist. Another 8 employees. So 29 total!
The Bengals have 8 people listed for Player Personnel...which appears to include their Analytics Dept...
Bengals Player Personnel
Duke Tobin Director of Player Personnel
Mike Potts Scouting Director (College)
Steven Radicevic Scouting Director (Pro)
Bill Tobin Personnel Executive
Andrew Johnson Scout
Christian Sarkisian Scout
Geoff Smith Scouting Technology Consultant
Debbie LaRocco Personnel Assistant
49ers Personnel & Scouting
Adam Peters Vice President of Player Personnel
Martin Mayhew Vice President of Player Personnel
Keena Turner Vice President and Senior Advisor to the General Manager
Ran Carthon Director, Pro Personnel
Ethan Waugh Director, College Scouting
R.J. Gillen Pro Personnel Scout
Justin Chabot National Scout
Chip Flanagan National Scout
Tariq Ahmad Area Scout
Dominic DeCicco Area Scout
Ryan Kessenich Area Scout
Steve Rubio Area Scout
John Stevenson Area Scout
Joshua Williams Area Scout
Salli Clavelle Pro Personnel Analyst
Fred Gammage III Pro Personnel Analyst
Crowley Hanlon Pro Personnel Coordinator
Travis Dauro College Scouting Coordinator
Thomas Tupa Scouting Assistant
Warren Ball Scouting Assistant
Steve Slowik Scouting Assistant
49ers Football Operations
Brian Hampton Director, Football Administration & Analytics
Kwesi Adofo-Mensah Director, Football R&D
Steve Wagner Manager, Football Systems
Demitrius Washington Manager, Football R&D
Neil Mayfield Software Developer
Dyng Au Software Developer
Richard Buffum Contract Administrator
Jeffrey Diamond Salary Cap Analyst
(10-28-2019, 11:30 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Scouts also handle free agency too at some level and gameplanning. It's kind of hard to have coaches scouting as the college season is during the NFL season. If they wait until after the season, other teams just gained 4 months. I know that people will counter with you don't need scouts with TV, but lets compare us to the 49ers who are currently undefeated:
So under Personnel & Scouting...the 49ers have 21 people listed. That doesn't count John Lynch who is their GM. And they have a football analytics department in addition that has a salary cap specialist. Another 8 employees. So 29 total!
The Bengals have 8 people listed for Player Personnel...which appears to include their Analytics Dept...
Bengals Player Personnel
Duke Tobin Director of Player Personnel
Mike Potts Scouting Director (College)
Steven Radicevic Scouting Director (Pro)
Bill Tobin Personnel Executive
Andrew Johnson Scout
Christian Sarkisian Scout
Geoff Smith Scouting Technology Consultant
Debbie LaRocco Personnel Assistant
49ers Personnel & Scouting
Adam Peters Vice President of Player Personnel
Martin Mayhew Vice President of Player Personnel
Keena Turner Vice President and Senior Advisor to the General Manager
Ran Carthon Director, Pro Personnel
Ethan Waugh Director, College Scouting
R.J. Gillen Pro Personnel Scout
Justin Chabot National Scout
Chip Flanagan National Scout
Tariq Ahmad Area Scout
Dominic DeCicco Area Scout
Ryan Kessenich Area Scout
Steve Rubio Area Scout
John Stevenson Area Scout
Joshua Williams Area Scout
Salli Clavelle Pro Personnel Analyst
Fred Gammage III Pro Personnel Analyst
Crowley Hanlon Pro Personnel Coordinator
Travis Dauro College Scouting Coordinator
Thomas Tupa Scouting Assistant
Warren Ball Scouting Assistant
Steve Slowik Scouting Assistant
49ers Football Operations
Brian Hampton Director, Football Administration & Analytics
Kwesi Adofo-Mensah Director, Football R&D
Steve Wagner Manager, Football Systems
Demitrius Washington Manager, Football R&D
Neil Mayfield Software Developer
Dyng Au Software Developer
Richard Buffum Contract Administrator
Jeffrey Diamond Salary Cap Analyst
Why? Because the Brown family are a bunch of retards.
And really, we can all post scenarios on here where the Bengals nail a draft and sign 3-4 impact free agents and turn this around...but it likely won't play out that way.
A team like the Dolphins has a lot of high picks and $100+ million of cap space. They'll be the ones that nail the draft.
Because that's how they did it in Mike's day. His daddy had 2 scouts, and his daddy had two scouts. They walked 10 miles in the snow, up a 45 degree incline to school everyday, they all had polio, and they like it that way. These kids and their cellphones and scouting departments are for the birds! He's frozen in a time when you called women broads and dames and you won ballgames with moxie, not analytics!
Because they want as trim of an organization as possible. Maybe not necessarily completely due to financial constraints, but having fewer staff members allows for easier and quicker collaboration. It's a lot easier to get 2-3 people in a room to discuss something and come to an agreement than it is 10 people.
Zac Taylor 2019-2020: 6 total wins
Zac Taylor 2021-2022: Double-digit wins each season, plus 5 postseason wins
Patience has paid off!
(10-28-2019, 11:30 AM)THE PISTONS Wrote: Scouts also handle free agency too at some level and gameplanning. It's kind of hard to have coaches scouting as the college season is during the NFL season. If they wait until after the season, other teams just gained 4 months. I know that people will counter with you don't need scouts with TV, but lets compare us to the 49ers who are currently undefeated:
So under Personnel & Scouting...the 49ers have 21 people listed. That doesn't count John Lynch who is their GM. And they have a football analytics department in addition that has a salary cap specialist. Another 8 employees. So 29 total!
The Bengals have 8 people listed for Player Personnel...which appears to include their Analytics Dept...
Bengals Player Personnel
Duke Tobin Director of Player Personnel
Mike Potts Scouting Director (College)
Steven Radicevic Scouting Director (Pro)
Bill Tobin Personnel Executive
Andrew Johnson Scout
Christian Sarkisian Scout
Geoff Smith Scouting Technology Consultant
Debbie LaRocco Personnel Assistant
49ers Personnel & Scouting
Adam Peters Vice President of Player Personnel
Martin Mayhew Vice President of Player Personnel
Keena Turner Vice President and Senior Advisor to the General Manager
Ran Carthon Director, Pro Personnel
Ethan Waugh Director, College Scouting
R.J. Gillen Pro Personnel Scout
Justin Chabot National Scout
Chip Flanagan National Scout
Tariq Ahmad Area Scout
Dominic DeCicco Area Scout
Ryan Kessenich Area Scout
Steve Rubio Area Scout
John Stevenson Area Scout
Joshua Williams Area Scout
Salli Clavelle Pro Personnel Analyst
Fred Gammage III Pro Personnel Analyst
Crowley Hanlon Pro Personnel Coordinator
Travis Dauro College Scouting Coordinator
Thomas Tupa Scouting Assistant
Warren Ball Scouting Assistant
Steve Slowik Scouting Assistant
49ers Football Operations
Brian Hampton Director, Football Administration & Analytics
Kwesi Adofo-Mensah Director, Football R&D
Steve Wagner Manager, Football Systems
Demitrius Washington Manager, Football R&D
Neil Mayfield Software Developer
Dyng Au Software Developer
Richard Buffum Contract Administrator
Jeffrey Diamond Salary Cap Analyst
More scouts means less money for MB. I don't believe he has the ability to listen to others that is why he won't hire a GM.
(10-28-2019, 11:57 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Because they want as trim of an organization as possible. Maybe not necessarily completely due to financial constraints, but having fewer staff members allows for easier and quicker collaboration. It's a lot easier to get 2-3 people in a room to discuss something and come to an agreement than it is 10 people.
But scouts...actually scout.
It's not like the 49ers scouts sit in a room and read Mel Kiper Jr's draft analysis and vote on what they think of a prospect. They actually go out and cover games.
Because they are the classic snake oil salesmen, and have gotten filthy rich from scamming taxpayers and leaching from the numerous successful NFL franchises.
Here are a few of the orchestrators of this shit show.
Andrew Johnson (Bengals scout): “Nobody in my family worked in football, which is a pretty uncommon theme,” said Johnson. “Normally there’s a connection that way to get into it.
FOR FUX SAKE!
Mike Potts, Scout (Thought Sample in the 2nd round was the right pick): “He pretty much checks every box you can think of other than if you are looking at the stat sheet.”
THE ONE THING THAT SHOULD MATTER THE MOST....THE DAMN STAT SHEET, MORON!
(10-28-2019, 11:57 AM)ochocincos Wrote: Because they want as trim of an organization as possible. Maybe not necessarily completely due to financial constraints, but having fewer staff members allows for easier and quicker collaboration. It's a lot easier to get 2-3 people in a room to discuss something and come to an agreement than it is 10 people.
It is 100% about being cheap. Mikey , for some reason, actually thinks half a scouting staff can do the same job as a full staff. And they did nail a few drafts along the way so that makes him think it can be done again. Paying for scouts is an investment in the team and he has proven over an over he will not do this. He wants the annual cash flow and won't waver from that in order to improve the product and the franchise value.
(10-28-2019, 12:11 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: But scouts...actually scout.
It's not like the 49ers scouts sit in a room and read Mel Kiper Jr's draft analysis and vote on what they think of a prospect. They actually go out and cover games.
Why bother paying people to go to the games in person when you can have them watch the film after the season, and do so at PBS or their own homes?
Zac Taylor 2019-2020: 6 total wins
Zac Taylor 2021-2022: Double-digit wins each season, plus 5 postseason wins
Patience has paid off!
(10-28-2019, 12:41 PM)I_C_DeadPeople Wrote: It is 100% about being cheap. Mikey , for some reason, actually thinks half a scouting staff can do the same job as a full staff. And they did nail a few drafts along the way so that makes him think it can be done again. Paying for scouts is an investment in the team and he has proven over an over he will not do this. He wants the annual cash flow and won't waver from that in order to improve the product and the franchise value.
I understand your point and agree with it. They need more scouts. I was just trying to put some logic behind their decisions to have a small department. And I think everyone who has worked with a small group and a large group would agree that it's much easier and faster to get things done with a smaller group.
Zac Taylor 2019-2020: 6 total wins
Zac Taylor 2021-2022: Double-digit wins each season, plus 5 postseason wins
Patience has paid off!
That's been the 64 dollar question here for two+ decades.
They pimp the you can only win thru relying on the draft. Yet they nickle and dime the staff they have to do it.
It's like saying I'm going to hit it big in the stock market, having $100,000 to invest, and going to Wall St. and putting 3 bucks into GM and walking out saying watch me shine.
(10-28-2019, 02:01 PM)ochocincos Wrote: I understand your point and agree with it. They need more scouts. I was just trying to put some logic behind their decisions to have a small department. And I think everyone who has worked with a small group and a large group would agree that it's much easier and faster to get things done with a smaller group.
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