If Liberals Hate Him, Then Trump Must Be Doing Something Right

[CageTheBengal]

The blind leading the blind.

Quote:If there was one principle that used to unite conservatives, it was respect for the rule of law. Not long ago, conservatives would have been horrified at wholesale violations of the norms and traditions of our political system, and would have been appalled by a president who showed overt contempt for the separation of powers.

But this week, as if on cue, most of the conservative media fell into line, celebrating President Trump’s abrupt dismissal of the F.B.I. director, James Comey, and dismissing the fact that Mr. Comey was leading an investigation into the Trump campaign and its ties to Russia. “Dems in Meltdown Over Comey Firing,” declared a headline on Fox News, as Tucker Carlson gleefully replayed clips of Democrats denouncing the move. “It’s just insane actually,” he said, referring to their reactions. On Fox and talk radio, the message was the same, with only a few conservatives willing to sound a discordant or even cautious note.

The talk-show host Rush Limbaugh was positively giddy, opening his monologue on Wednesday by praising Mr. Trump for what he called his “epic trolling” of liberals. “This is great,” Mr. Limbaugh declared. “Can we agree that Donald Trump is probably enjoying this more than anybody wants to admit or that anybody knows? So he fires Comey yesterday. Who’s he meet with today? He’s meeting with the Soviet, the Russian foreign minister, Sergey Lavrov! I mean, what an epic troll this is.”

Given the enthusiasm of the president’s apologists, it is likely that much of Mr. Trump’s base will similarly rally to him as it has in the past.

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But perhaps most important, we saw once again how conservatism, with its belief in ordered liberty, is being eclipsed by something different: Loathing those who loath the president. Rabid anti-anti-Trumpism.

In a lamentably overlooked monologue this month, Mr. Limbaugh embraced the new reality in which conservative ideas and principles had been displaced by anti-liberalism. For years, Mr. Limbaugh ran what he called the “Institute for Advanced Conservative Studies.” But in the Trump era, he told his audience, he has changed that to the “Institute for Advanced Anti-Leftist Studies.”

With Mr. Trump in the White House, conservative principles were no longer the point. “How many times during the campaign did I warn everybody Trump is not a conservative? Multiple times a day,” Mr. Limbaugh said. “How many times have I told you: ‘Do not expect Trump to be a conservative? He isn’t one.’ ”

He went on to emphasize that the campaign was not about conservatism, because that’s not what Mr. Trump is about.

That was a remarkable admission, but it is also a key to understanding what is happening on the right. While there are those like Sean Hannity who are reliable cheerleaders for all things President Trump, much of the conservative news media is now less pro-Trump than it is anti-anti-Trump. The distinction is important, because anti-anti-Trumpism has become the new safe space for the right.

Here is how it works: Rather than defend President Trump’s specific actions, his conservative champions change the subject to (1) the biased “fake news” media, (2) over-the-top liberals, (3) hypocrites on the left, (4) anyone else victimizing Mr. Trump or his supporters and (5) whataboutism, as in “What about Obama?” “What about Clinton?”

For the anti-anti-Trump pundit, whatever the allegation against Mr. Trump, whatever his blunders or foibles, the other side is always worse.

But the real heart of anti-anti-Trumpism is the delight in the frustration and anger of his opponents. Mr. Trump’s base is unlikely to hold him either to promises or tangible achievements, because conservative politics is now less about ideas or accomplishments than it is about making the right enemies cry out in anguish.

Mr. Trump’s most vocal supporters don’t have to defend his specific actions as long as they make “liberal heads explode,” or as Sarah Palin put it so memorably, “It’s really funny to me to see the splodey heads keep sploding.” If liberals hate something, the argument goes, then it must be wonderful and worthy of aggressive defense. Each controversy reinforces the divisions and the distrust, and Mr. Trump counts on that.

For many in the conservative movement, this sort of anti-anti-Trumpism is the solution to the painful conundrum posed by the Trump presidency. With a vast majority of conservative voters and listeners solidly behind Mr. Trump, conservative critics of the president find themselves isolated and under siege. But, as Damon Linker noted, anti-anti-Trumpism “allows the right to indulge its hatred of liberals and liberalism while sidestepping the need for a reckoning with the disaster of the Trump administration itself.”

This is also a much sounder business model than airing doubts about the president. Conservative media is, of course, a business that relies on ratings, and few things generate ratings more quickly than bashing liberals. In this case, it is a far better business model for talk show hosts to play down Mr. Trump’s failures while piling on his enemies.

The ad hominem argument is rightly regarded as a logical fallacy because it substitutes personal attacks for a discussion of the argument someone is making. But on many talk shows, including Mr. Limbaugh’s, nearly every argument is ad hominem. Instead of offering statistics and building a case, it is easier to simply make fun of a Trump critic like Representative Maxine Waters, or shrug off a negative report because it came from the “lamestream media.”

Not surprisingly, the vast majority of airtime on conservative media is not taken up by issues or explanations of conservative approaches to markets or need to balance liberty with order. Why bother with such stuff, when there were personalities to be mocked and left-wing moonbats to be ridiculed?

What may have begun as a policy or a tactic in opposition has long since become a reflex. But there is an obvious price to be paid for essentially becoming a party devoted to trolling. In the long run, it’s hard to see how a party dedicated to liberal tears can remain a movement based on ideas or centered on principles.

Conservatives will care less about governing and more about scoring “wins” — and inflicting losses on the left — no matter how hollow the victories or flawed the policies. Ultimately, though, this will end badly because it is a moral and intellectual dead end, and very likely a political one as well.

The right’s reaction to firing of Mr. Comey hardly bodes well. Even conservatives who are still smarting from his handling of Hillary Clinton’s emails should recognize that the timing of Mr. Comey’s abrupt dismissal in the midst of a growing investigation into Russian meddling raises fundamental questions about the rule of the law and the possibility that justice is being obstructed.

As the right doubles down on anti-anti-Trumpism, it will find itself goaded into defending and rationalizing ever more outrageous conduct just as long as it annoys CNN and the left.

In many ways anti-anti-Trumpism mirrors Donald Trump himself, because at its core there are no fixed values, no respect for constitutional government or ideas of personal character, only a free-floating nihilism cloaked in insult, mockery and bombast.

Needless to say, this is not a form of conservatism that Edmund Burke, or even Barry Goldwater, would have recognized.

https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/12/opinion/sunday/if-liberals-hate-him-then-trump-must-be-doing-something-right.html

[BmorePat87]

I would say that liberals should step back and only criticize the truly outlandish and remarkable things he does wrong... but so much of what he is doing is cringeworthy and unprecedented, but they're criticizing nearly everything he does.

The leader of the free world is trying to mock Rosie O'Donnell on twitter.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

Quote:Mr. Limbaugh declared. “I mean, what an epic troll this is.”

Limbaugh just wrote the Trump Presidency's epitaph.

[hollodero]

(05-12-2017, 03:07 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I would say that liberals should step back and only criticize the truly outlandish and remarkable things he does wrong... but so much of what he is doing is cringeworthy and unprecedented, but they're criticizing nearly everything he does.

The leader of the free world is trying to mock Rosie O'Donnell on twitter.

I disagree with that one. Imho. They should fire truths and facts at everything. For this is persuading the reasonable republicans. What they shouldn't do is use exaggerations and unfactual talking points of their own. There are tendencies to fight fire with fire, and that way everything burns up and Bannon has a party.

[NATI BENGALS]

From my POV republitards have been all about party over country since I knew anything about politics.

Now it is party over countery version 2.0 with the Russian puppet conman running the show.

I had no idea Idioacracy was so closely predicting the future.

[Belsnickel]

What's funny is that most of the actual conservatives I know hate Trump as well.

[Vas Deferens]

ITS A WITCH HUNT! ...says the guy demanding to see the former POTUS' birth certificate.

Amazing.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-12-2017, 08:21 PM)Vas Deferens Wrote: ITS A WITCH HUNT!   ...says the guy demanding to see the former POTUS' birth certificate.

Amazing.

This is what you get, when so many were forced to accept whatever social and policy changes Obama wanted to make, finally had enough with the Democrat party.  From one extremist leader to another, on the polar opposite side..

[NATI BENGALS]

(05-12-2017, 09:24 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: This is what you get, when so many were forced to accept whatever social and policy changes Obama wanted to make, finally had enough with the Democrat party.  From one extremist leader to another, on the polar opposite side..

Fought through the formation of the tea party and the party of no to get health care that cant reject you for pre exsisting conditions and 2$ a gallon gas. 

Republicans reward us with the russian puppet who wants to tear it all up. Throw more people in jail. Cut health care. Spend more on the most expensive military in the world. Build the worlds most expensive wall. And invite the people who just interfered in our election into the oval office. The day after firing the guy investigating their interference.

Thanks republitards. Solid ass job you 

[NATI BENGALS]

(05-12-2017, 09:24 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: This is what you get, when so many were forced to accept whatever social and policy changes Obama wanted to make, finally had enough with the Democrat party.  From one extremist leader to another, on the polar opposite side..

You were not forced to watch Fox News and the war on christmas for 8 years.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-12-2017, 09:45 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Fought through the formation of the tea party and the party of no to get health care that cant reject you for pre exsisting conditions and 2$ a gallon gas. 

Republicans reward us with the russian puppet who wants to tear it all up. Throw more people in jail. Cut health care. Spend more on the most expensive military in the world. Build the worlds most expensive wall. And invite the people who just interfered in our election into the oval office. The day after firing the guy investigating their interference.

Thanks republitards. Solid ass job you 

Wow man, you should really lay off the Monster Energy drinks, scientists say that shit is bad for you..

(05-12-2017, 09:47 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: You were not forced to watch Fox News and the war on christmas for 8 years.

That is correct, nobody forced me to see that the Obama administration created an environment where criminals were the "good guys" and Law Enforcement shouldn't be allowed to do their jobs..

[Dill]

(05-12-2017, 10:04 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That is correct, nobody forced me to see that the Obama administration created an environment where criminals were the "good guys" and Law Enforcement shouldn't be allowed to do their jobs..

Sunset, could you elaborate on this a bit?  Which criminals were the good guys and what jobs was Law enforcement not allowed to do?

Also, Obama seems rather a centrist to me. In what sense did you find him "extremist"? I saw a youtube video once of a woman screaming Obama was a communist dictator who had tried to set off a Nuke in Charleston SC. That seems like extremism to me.

[Dill]

(05-12-2017, 01:57 PM)CageTheBengal Wrote: The blind leading the blind.
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/12/opinion/sunday/if-liberals-hate-him-then-trump-must-be-doing-something-right.html

That's an excellent article, Cage.  I took special note of the following:

For the anti-anti-Trump pundit, whatever the allegation against Mr. Trump, whatever his blunders or foibles, the other side is always worse.

But the real heart of anti-anti-Trumpism is the delight in the frustration and anger of his opponents. Mr. Trump’s base is unlikely to hold him either to promises or tangible achievements, because conservative politics is now less about ideas or accomplishments than it is about making the right enemies cry out in anguish.

Mr. Trump’s most vocal supporters don’t have to defend his specific actions as long as they make “liberal heads explode,” or as Sarah Palin put it so memorably, “It’s really funny to me to see the splodey heads keep sploding.” If liberals hate something, the argument goes, then it must be wonderful and worthy of aggressive defense. Each controversy reinforces the divisions and the distrust, and Mr. Trump counts on that.
 
For many in the conservative movement, this sort of anti-anti-Trumpism is the solution to the painful conundrum posed by the Trump presidency. With a vast majority of conservative voters and listeners solidly behind Mr. Trump, conservative critics of the president find themselves isolated and under siege. But, as Damon Linker noted, anti-anti-Trumpism “allows the right to indulge its hatred of liberals and liberalism while sidestepping the need for a reckoning with the disaster of the Trump administration itself.”

But they will have to deal with it at some point!

I have noted on other threads the tendency of Trumpsters to disconnect his behavior from any accountability, to treat criticism of his public behavior as mere name calling and "butthurt" rather than a justified concern all Americans should share about an impulsive, angry commander-in-chief who is "smarter than the generals."

This is also true of Trump defenders who claim they never voted for him, but still applaud the liberal confusion as to how someone with so little knowledge of government and history and so much contempt for statecraft could have made it to the White House and retain support through self-inflicted crisis after self-inflicted crisis. Still better than a Democrat and better than Hillary.
 
The Trump team recently threatened to use a tape of Hillary's concession speech to celebrate 6 months of the Trump presidency.

http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2017/05/white-house-clinton-concession-call

I am curious--are there any Trump defenders out there who think it quite over the top if I find this monumentally mean, petty, immature and vindictive?  If I say I can recall no president (since Jackson, or maybe A. Johnson) inclined to allow such things actions to define his presidency, would that be hyperbole? 

For the Trump defenders who can't defend this such actions but still prefer Trump to Hillary, could you perhaps lay out the cost benefit ratio here? What is the value gained which makes up for the national shame and loss of credibility

[NATI BENGALS]

(05-12-2017, 10:04 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Wow man, you should really lay off the Monster Energy drinks, scientists say that shit is bad for you..

What part of that makes you think I'm going off the rails?

Everything i said is the reality that exsists outside of the Faux News bubble.

Bill O was the father of the Republitard party for years. His transgressions are conveniently brushed aside even though he spoke to the majority of the hardcore right almost every night of the week for countless years.

You will quickly condemn the libtard congresswoman who conned her district for years. What do you think about a major news source who conned the entire country for years?

[Dill]

(05-12-2017, 11:53 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: What part of that makes you think I'm going off the rails?

Everything i said is the reality that exsists outside of the Faux News bubble.

Bill O was the father of the Republitard party for years. His transgressions are conveniently brushed aside even though he spoke to the majority of the hardcore right almost every night of the week for countless years.

You will quickly condemn the libtard congresswoman who conned her district for years. What do you think about a major news source who conned the entire country for years?

LOL, well Nati, he didn't con ALL of us!

[NATI BENGALS]

(05-13-2017, 12:02 AM)Dill Wrote: LOL, well Nati, he didn't con ALL of us!

You are correct. My bad.

[fredtoast]

(05-12-2017, 10:04 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That is correct, nobody forced me to see that the Obama administration created an environment where criminals were the "good guys" and Law Enforcement shouldn't be allowed to do their jobs..

You can not post one single fact to prove that the Obama administration ever did anything that said the criminals were the "good guys".  And you can not post one thing Obama Administration ever did that would keep police from doing their job.

You live in an echo chamber and have no idea what the truth is.  All you do is repeat what you hear in the echo chamber.  You can not post one single fact to support these claims.


 

[Dill]

(05-12-2017, 01:57 PM)CageTheBengal Wrote: The blind leading the blind.

With Mr. Trump in the White House, conservative principles were no longer the point. “How many times during the campaign did I warn everybody Trump is not a conservative? Multiple times a day,” Mr. Limbaugh said. “How many times have I told you: ‘Do not expect Trump to be a conservative? He isn’t one.’ ”
https://www.nytimes.com/2017/05/12/opinion/sunday/if-liberals-hate-him-then-trump-must-be-doing-something-right.html

Even after a few days, I find this article one of the most insightful things I have read about Trumpism.

And the central insight is still the systematic shift from defending Trump's fumbles to criticizing liberals for criticizing Trump. Or, not really "criticizing" so much as just enjoying their anger and concern as an incompetent cripples and shames the government we wall rely on. Like the proper thing to do when the president fires someone investigating him is take a chill pill. It will work itself out.

This abovementioned shift raises questions about what conservatism really was, if it could be so easily coopted by something so not (apparently) conservative, something so joyfully nihilistic and anarchic.

We are treated to Spicer and Huckabee lying everyday, trying reconstruct what Trump really meant, along with surrogates on the MSM news channels forced into rhetorical back flips to explain what Trump really meant and why he is really moving the country forward.  Conway explaining the Comey firing is a fine example of this art.

But the other pundits, especially on Fox, are all over how the liberals are imploding.

I understand why Rush and Hannity do this. It helps sell the "Russian investigation conspiracy theory." But I am still surprised the rank and file followed so quickly.

[SunsetBengal]

(05-13-2017, 09:03 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You can not post one single fact to prove that the Obama administration ever did anything that said the criminals were the "good guys".  And you can not post one thing Obama Administration ever did that would keep police from doing their job.

You live in an echo chamber and have no idea what the truth is.  All you do is repeat what you hear in the echo chamber.  You can not post one single fact to support these claims.


 

You keep saying that, like it should mean something to me.  However, I am completely capable of wasting time, looking pointless shit up, posting the necessary details to support my statement, but I would rather have you just keep thinking that I can't.  Not really worth my effort.

All you really need to know is to look into DOJ policies under Eric Holder, when directives were given to Federal prosecutors to not specify amounts in drug warrants, charge the least crime possible.  The media took it further to vilify Law Enforcement for attempting to do their jobs.  Why else would that bozo from Ferguson Mo. ever be portrayed as "some innocent kid", when the officer was completely justified in shooting him?  Had the entire Nation glued to their TVs for weeks of "protests", over justice being executed as it should have been.

[CageTheBengal]

(05-13-2017, 10:42 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: You keep saying that, like it should mean something to me.  However, I am completely capable of wasting time, looking pointless shit up, posting the necessary details to support my statement, but I would rather have you just keep thinking that I can't.  Not really worth my effort.

All you really need to know is to look into DOJ policies under Eric Holder, when directives were given to Federal prosecutors to not specify amounts in drug warrants, charge the least crime possible.  The media took it further to vilify Law Enforcement for attempting to do their jobs.  Why else would that bozo from Ferguson Mo. ever be portrayed as "some innocent kid", when the officer was completely justified in shooting him?  Had the entire Nation glued to their TVs for weeks of "protests", over justice being executed as it should have been.

It's like an actual example of the topic at hand for everybody to see and witness.

Quick! Somebody say something bad about Trump and see what he does!