If fedreal agents kill 1000 protestors.

[fredtoast]

If federal agents kill 1000 protestors do you believe it will bring "peace" and end the protesting? If so how long will the peace last? If a thousand doesn't do it then how many do you think they would have to kill to end the rioting?

Honestly I believe the more they kill the worse it will get.

Too many people have forgotten how many people were killed, mostly by police, national guard, and federal troops, in the 1960's race riots.

26 in Newark
34 in Watts
43 in Detroit
39 in Chicago
34 in Los Angeles
13 in Washington
And many more in multiple smaller riots.

Killing did not stop the violence. It seemed to just make it worse.

[Belsnickel]

(07-21-2020, 08:49 AM)fredtoast Wrote: If federal agents kill 1000 protestors do you believe it will bring "peace" and end the protesting? If so how long will the peace last? If a thousand doesn't do it then how many do you think they would have to kill to end the rioting?

Honestly I believe the more they kill the worse it will get.

You're spot on. Lots of folks on the right think people on the left are all anti-gun and will just throw sticks and bricks. But there is a sizable group that are well armed and see this as the tyrannical government the 2A was intended to allow us to rise against.

[GMDino]

(07-21-2020, 08:56 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: You're spot on. Lots of folks on the right think people on the left are all anti-gun and will just throw sticks and bricks. But there is a sizable group that are well armed and see this as the tyrannical government the 2A was intended to allow us to rise against.

It's not even people on "the left" being pro gun or anti gun...sending troops into Chicago is just asking for the regular gangs to strike back.

Let's be fair though:  Trump doesn't care.  He wants to project the image of "tough guy" and using his position to send in American troops to kill Americans is how he will do it.  And his "2A" supporters will jump for joy that it is happening because it was never about "overthrowing a tyrannical government" it was about being able to kill people who disagree with them.

[fredtoast]

Police already feel threatened.  And I don't blame them.  Lots of people are targeting them.

But if a hundred protesors get killed the the number of officers getting killed across the country will skyrocket.

Trump has lived his life like a bully because he felt his money gave him more power than other people.  If he tries to end these protests with more violence the streets will run with blood and the rioting will not end.

[GMDino]

(07-21-2020, 09:05 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Poluice already feel threatened.  And I don't blame them.  Lots of people are targeting them.

But if a hundred protesors get killed the the number of officers getting killed across the country will skyrocket.

Trump has lived his life like a bully because he felt his money gave him more power than other people.  If he tries to end these protests with more violence the streets will run with blood and the rioting will not end.

And the "thugs" and "vigilantes" will shoulder the blame from the right because the federal officers are there to "keep the peace".

[*Nately120*]

It's a genuine nightmare that a significant portion of our population is going to cheer our own troops treating our citizens as the enemy. This is Trump's first term, too. We are putting boots on the ground and going after "insurgents" within our own border with the same zeal Trump expressed for defeating ISIS within 30 days.

[Yojimbo]

NFAC

https://thehill.com/blogs/blog-briefing-room/news/505929-armed-black-protesters-march-through-confederate-memorial-park

[samhain]

(07-21-2020, 08:56 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: You're spot on. Lots of folks on the right think people on the left are all anti-gun and will just throw sticks and bricks. But there is a sizable group that are well armed and see this as the tyrannical government the 2A was intended to allow us to rise against.

Yep.  Anyone that thinks that only right wingers own guns is fooling themselves.  

Also, if president Pinochet, err, Trump thinks his desired policing action in Chicago will go like his trial run vs a bunch of hippies in Portland, then I think he's in for an unpleasant surprise.  I imagine that this is what he and Wolf intend, though.  Go somewhere where you can get some feds shot and killed, then you can really ramp up the campaign rhetoric to fire up his base against blacks and liberals.  He'll be trying to paint any opposition like they're ISIS before the end of August, because he's flailing and he's that desperate.  We are in a very dangerous place in our experiment right now.  Honestly, and I've never said this, someone should remove him before he starts a hot civil war with his stupidity.

[samhain]

(07-21-2020, 11:46 AM)Nately120 Wrote: It's a genuine nightmare that a significant portion of our population is going to cheer our own troops treating our citizens as the enemy.  This is Trump's first term, too.  We are putting boots on the ground and going after "insurgents" within our own border with the same zeal Trump expressed for defeating ISIS within 30 days.

I've seen people on social media unable to answer the question of whether or not they're against facism.  Like actual Americans that think being against facism is un-American.  

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-21-2020, 03:57 PM)samhain Wrote: Yep.  Anyone that thinks that only right wingers own guns is fooling themselves.  

They're not the only ones that own them, they're the only ones that know how to use them.

[samhain]

(07-21-2020, 04:07 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: They're not the only ones that own them, they're the only ones that know how to use them.

Yeah, they're great at Call of Duty.

[*Nately120*]

(07-21-2020, 04:07 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: They're not the only ones that own them, they're the only ones that know how to use them.

I had no idea the Southside of Chicago was so conservative. 

[fredtoast]

(07-21-2020, 04:07 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: They're not the only ones that own them, they're the only ones that know how to use them.

Yep.

All street gang members are conservative Republicans, right?

[hollodero]

(07-21-2020, 04:37 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yep.

All street gang members are conservative Republicans, right?

One might argue that being in a gang and waving around and potentially using guns in street fights is not the right way to use them.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-21-2020, 04:14 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I had no idea the Southside of Chicago was so conservative. 

(07-21-2020, 04:37 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yep.

All street gang members are conservative Republicans, right?

Knowing how to use them and being able to pull a trigger are two different things

(07-21-2020, 04:49 PM)hollodero Wrote: One might argue that being in a gang and waving around and potentially using guns in street fights is not the right way to use them.

This man gets it, and he's European for god's sake!!!

[*Nately120*]

(07-21-2020, 04:49 PM)hollodero Wrote: One might argue that being in a gang and waving around and potentially using guns in street fights is not the right way to use them.

I'm sure from a perspective outside of the USA there seems like there would be right and wrong ways to use a gun, but I tells ya this country is all over the map with it. My comment was more about the notion that neo-cons love to paint gang thugs as murder machines and the source of massive amounts of gun violence, yet they won't give them credit that they may be somewhat prepared to deal with an armed force.

I'm just trying to give them some credit here. I will say now that I'm finishing up another post analyzing which American civilians are best suited to fight and die against our own defense agents I'm back to my original feelings of apathy.

[hollodero]

(07-21-2020, 05:31 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I'm sure from a perspective outside of the USA there seems like there would be right and wrong ways to use a gun, but I tells ya this country is all over the map with it.  My comment was more about the notion that neo-cons love to paint gang thugs as murder machines and the source of massive amounts of gun violence, yet they won't give them credit that they may be somewhat prepared to deal with an armed force.

In this particular instance I agree with this neo-con notion. I mean, gangs are the source of massive amounts of gun violence.

Also, I guess for many the right way to use a gun is not so much about fighting an armed force, but about self-reliantly protecting themselves and their family from intruders and other criminals.

With that being said, from a perspective outside of the USA your whole gun laws, including the second amendment, are flatout crazy.

[SunsetBengal]

(07-21-2020, 06:22 PM)hollodero Wrote: In this particular instance I agree with this neo-con notion. I mean, gangs are the source of massive amounts of gun violence.

Also, I guess for many the right way to use a gun is not so much about fighting an armed force, but about self-reliantly protecting themselves and their family from intruders and other criminals.

With that being said, from a perspective outside of the USA your whole gun laws, including the second amendment, are flatout crazy.

I hear ya, Hollo.  When I was a kid, they told me that drinking alcohol was the devil.  I believed them, and agreed, until I tried the stuff.  Wow, the teetotalers had that one completely wrong..  

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-21-2020, 06:22 PM)hollodero Wrote: With that being said, from a perspective outside of the USA your whole gun laws, including the second amendment, are flatout crazy.

Our histories are radically different in this regard, and that's by design.  The Framers saw the European model of enforcing an unarmed populace as a means for their governments to maintain control over the masses.  To them personal liberty was only guaranteed if the state could not impose a tyranny by force.  A key element to avoiding the government having that ability is an armed populace.  Of course this also involves the whole Federalist and anti-Federalist debate.

You also throw in the US attitude of rugged individualism, self sufficiency and the "conquering" of the frontier and our gun laws are actually not that mystifying.

[Belsnickel]

(07-21-2020, 04:07 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: They're not the only ones that own them, they're the only ones that know how to use them.

Yeah, you've never been to an SRA range day. Let's just say they love having former service members around to assist in their training.