Is The United States Hypocritical?

[BFritz21]

One of the main reasons that we revolted against England was because of taxation without representation.

If a minor earns over 12k, as unlikely as that sounds, they have to pay taxes, but they can't vote, so wouldn't that be taxation without representation?

Is that hypocritical of the government?

[fredtoast]

No.

Children are not qualified to vote and earning money does not change that. There are children who are not even old enough to write their own names that pay taxes on interest and dividends from investment made in their names.

[SunsetBengal]

(12-03-2019, 06:28 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: One of the main reasons that we revolted against England was because of taxation without representation.

If a minor earns over 12k, as unlikely as that sounds, they have to pay taxes, but they can't vote, so wouldn't that be taxation without representation?

Is that hypocritical of the government?

Did they change something that I missed?  I distinctly remember being so disappointed in my first paycheck from McDonald's, when I saw the payroll taxes.  As compared to the money I earned mowing lawns, shoveling snow, delivering newspapers, and other odd chores, that money was "all mine".

[fredtoast]

(12-03-2019, 07:47 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Did they change something that I missed?  I distinctly remember being so disappointed in my first paycheck from McDonald's, when I saw the payroll taxes.  As compared to the money I earned mowing lawns, shoveling snow, delivering newspapers, and other odd chores, that money was "all mine".

If you had filed a return you would probably have gotten that withheld money back in a refund.

[SunsetBengal]

(12-03-2019, 07:50 PM)fredtoast Wrote: If you had filed a return you would probably have gotten that withheld money back in a refund.

Of course I got the Federal and State tax returned.  It still didn't stop the initial shock, when I received that first paycheck, not to mention FICA and any other little deductions that weren't return eligible.

[hollodero]

(12-03-2019, 06:28 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: One of the main reasons that we revolted against England was because of taxation without representation.

If a minor earns over 12k, as unlikely as that sounds, they have to pay taxes, but they can't vote, so wouldn't that be taxation without representation?

Is that hypocritical of the government?

I don't know about that specific issue, but in general it's glaringly hypocritical how you treat Puerto Rico. And other "colonies".

[Vas Deferens]

(12-03-2019, 08:52 PM)hollodero Wrote: I don't know about that specific issue, but in general it's glaringly hypocritical how you treat Puerto Rico. And other "colonies".

or the residents of the District of Columbia (Washington D.C.) for that matter..

[SunsetBengal]

(12-03-2019, 08:52 PM)hollodero Wrote: I don't know about that specific issue, but in general it's glaringly hypocritical how you treat Puerto Rico. And other "colonies".

That's right, we should be raping them for every tax dollar and profitable good they have, just like England did.  But instead, they squander everything that we give them with their corrupt politicians who pocket the money earmarked for disaster relief and such.

[NATI BENGALS]

Im pretty pissed about states raising the age to buy cigarettes to 21.

Its already horseshit you can sign your life away at 18 to serve in the military yet you can not legally buy a beer... Now you can not even buy cigarettes in some places.

Not the most popular rights to fight for.. But damn that really gets me fired up and i dont even smoke anymore.

[BmorePat87]

(12-03-2019, 09:09 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That's right, we should be raping them for every tax dollar and profitable good they have, just like England did.  But instead, they squander everything that we give them with their corrupt politicians who pocket the money earmarked for disaster relief and such.

This is a pathetically false narrative. There are a lot of issues regarding disaster relief with blame to be shared by the White House, Congress, FEMA, and Puerto Rico. Suggesting the issue is that they are wasting everything we spend to them and pocketing it is just patently false. 

[*Nately120*]

I think the bigger taxation without representation effect would be us continuing to accrue massive amounts of debt that we will saddle future generations with that didn't have a chance to vote for the parade of fiscally absurd politicians we elect, if they are even going to be born while said politicians are in office.

I guess that is more us having the ability to mortgage the futures of the unborn for our own desires rather than taxation, but you get my drift. I like to think I'm a fiscally conservative, environmentally friendly and overall decent person BUT I do have to admit the idea of leaving a debt-stricken country with dangerous pollution levels behind does sound kind of fun.

[hollodero]

(12-03-2019, 09:09 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: That's right, we should be raping them for every tax dollar and profitable good they have, just like England did.  But instead, they squander everything that we give them with their corrupt politicians who pocket the money earmarked for disaster relief and such.

Yeah I don't know about the level of corruption there. I just find it amazing that the self-declared beacon of democracy that is the US still holds areas whose citizens are not represented in Congress and do not get to vote in the presidential election. While, willfully or not, being US-Americans. That's just weird and feels wrong.

Since they do pay federal taxes, I guess taxation without representation might very well apply here. Also the word "colony". By that I do not compare the modern day US to 18th century England.

[hollodero]

(12-03-2019, 09:01 PM)Vas Deferens Wrote: or the residents of the District of Columbia (Washington D.C.) for that matter..

Oh yeah right, that is pretty messed up too.

I learned that from John Oliver. Not to brag. Just saying.

[SunsetBengal]

(12-03-2019, 09:48 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: This is a pathetically false narrative. There are a lot of issues regarding disaster relief with blame to be shared by the White House, Congress, FEMA, and Puerto Rico. Suggesting the issue is that they are wasting everything we spend to them and pocketing it is just patently false. 

I don't know for sure, Pat.  But from what I've read, as soon as the military got done setting up temporary services and stabilized the situation, their time was done, and they left.  After that, the Puerto Rican Gov't simply folded up their tents and left the people to fend for themselves.  All of that money that was sent to rebuild their power grid seemed to just vanish.  Fast forward a bit, then you have Puerto Rican officials resigning in disgrace over corruption charges.

Did it happen differently?  You tell me.

[BmorePat87]

(12-03-2019, 11:53 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: I don't know for sure, Pat.  But from what I've read, as soon as the military got done setting up temporary services and stabilized the situation, their time was done, and they left.  After that, the Puerto Rican Gov't simply folded up their tents and left the people to fend for themselves.  All of that money that was sent to rebuild their power grid seemed to just vanish.  Fast forward a bit, then you have Puerto Rican officials resigning in disgrace over corruption charges.

Did it happen differently?  You tell me.

You need to find better sources if this is what you’re being told about the situation on the ground there. Plenty out there about the troubles faced by Puerto Rico and the Virgin Islands in actually getting access to aid and the lack of liquidity for the localities to even begin work as they wait for the FEMA aid to come in afterwards. Usually local groups rely on loans and charities to begin work and are reimbursed by FEMA later. That’s not available in Puerto Rico, however.

The corruption charges were unrelated to FEMA and involved the education and health secretaries giving their friends contracts but not actually profiting themselves.

[Belsnickel]

Minors are, in theory, represented by their parents. But yeah, our territories definitely create that hypocritical situation for us.

[GMDino]

(12-03-2019, 06:28 PM)BFritz21 Wrote: One of the main reasons that we revolted against England was because of taxation without representation.

If a minor earns over 12k, as unlikely as that sounds, they have to pay taxes, but they can't vote, so wouldn't that be taxation without representation?

Is that hypocritical of the government?

Yes for many reasons if not that one.