Jobs Guarantee

[Belsnickel]

So, we have been discussing the minimum wage thing, and there have been discussions all over about universal basic incomes and other things of that nature. I heard a discussion recently about an alternative to this, which would be a jobs guarantee.

So, if you'd like to hear the discussion, you can check it out on The Wilderness, which is a podcast from Crooked Media. Fair warning, there is adult language and this is a podcast for liberals, so take it for what it is. The series is kind of a documentary about the history of the Democratic party and where we go from here.

Anyway, one of the ideas for an economic platform is a jobs guarantee, something akin to the Works Progress Administration. What they proposed was a federally funded but locally administered program where jobs that provide a living wage could be set up based on the community needs. When workers are displaced, the program would provide funding for training for a new job and a basic income until placed.

One of the guests discusses how this gives more power to workers because the fear of being fired is lessened, which gives more leverage for negotiating with your employer and also can decrease discrimination and sexual misconduct in the workplace.

It's a very interesting discussion and I thought I would bring it here. What do you think about this potential idea?

[fredtoast]

Giant warehouses full of stationary bikes that power electric generators.

[*michaelsean*]

I guess the question is would these people be taking jobs that people already have?

Job training I have no problem with although I've always been a little fuzzy about what that entails. Is that where you cover someone's wages at a company while they learn the job? I mean even for this conservative libertarian or whatever the hell I am, that seems like a no brainer.

[fredtoast]

(08-15-2018, 01:48 PM)michaelsean Wrote: I guess the question is would these people be taking jobs that people already have?  

If it is like the WPA they would do a lot of public service type work.  The WPA built a lot of roads in the rural parts of the United States back in the 30's.  The CCC program worked mostly in national parks.

[Belsnickel]

(08-15-2018, 01:48 PM)michaelsean Wrote: I guess the question is would these people be taking jobs that people already have?

Job training I have no problem with although I've always been a little fuzzy about what that entails. Is that where you cover someone's wages at a company while they learn the job? I mean even for this conservative libertarian or whatever the hell I am, that seems like a no brainer.

Could be covering wages, could be sending them to a trade school or working on some sort of certification. There are a lot of options here. More below.

(08-15-2018, 01:55 PM)fredtoast Wrote: If it is like the WPA they would do a lot of public service type work.  The WPA built a lot of roads in the rural parts of the United States back in the 30's.  The CCC program worked mostly in national parks.

This is where it gets a bit different from the WPA. Sure, you would still have a lot of those types of jobs, but by letting the lower levels of government administer the funds, they can direct them to the community's priorities. It could involve elder or child care services, it could be road and bridge building, or it could be bringing high-speed internet to the community by training people for the work of it. The possibilities are huge for a program like this in ways that not only put people to work, but help the overall community, as well.

[GMDino]

(08-15-2018, 02:23 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Could be covering wages, could be sending them to a trade school or working on some sort of certification. There are a lot of options here. More below.


This is where it gets a bit different from the WPA. Sure, you would still have a lot of those types of jobs, but by letting the lower levels of government administer the funds, they can direct them to the community's priorities. It could involve elder or child care services, it could be road and bridge building, or it could be bringing high-speed internet to the community by training people for the work of it. The possibilities are huge for a program like this in ways that not only put people to work, but help the overall community, as well.

PA has a program that covers part of wages for training and work.  They set a minimum pay and there are other steps to go through.  They help them do resumes and such too.  We recently hired two new employees through them and had good success with that program.  In our case they pay 50% of the wages for the first three months.

[*michaelsean*]

(08-15-2018, 02:52 PM)GMDino Wrote: PA has a program that covers part of wages for training and work.  They set a minimum pay and there are other steps to go through.  They help them do resumes and such too.  We recently hired two new employees through them and had good success with that program.  In our case they pay 50% of the wages for the first three months.

Subsidizing big business. The rich keep getting richer.  

[fredtoast]

(08-15-2018, 02:54 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Subsidizing big business.  The rich keep getting richer.  

But at least they are creating jobs for the working class.

That is better than just letting the owners get 100% of the benefit and the workers get nothing.

[*michaelsean*]

(08-15-2018, 02:59 PM)fredtoast Wrote: But at least they are creating jobs for the working class.

That is better than just letting the owners get 100% of the benefit and the workers get nothing.

There's a reason for the smiley face. I don't think Dino's boss is getting rich because he gets two employees at half off for three months.

[GMDino]

(08-15-2018, 03:00 PM)michaelsean Wrote: There's a reason for the smiley face.  I don't think Dino's boss is getting rich because he gets two employees at half off for three months.

Just to use round numbers if we normally pay $7.25 (plus bonuses) an hour these guys have to start at $9.00 and they won't get a bonus.  The business save $6.00 per hour for three months.  

If they guys work out that's a win for the company.  If they don't we're out half the pay for three months.

So they aren't getting rich but they are saving money.  And I don't have a problem with that...but I also know they would never hire someone at the higher rate without the government kicking some in. 

[*michaelsean*]

(08-15-2018, 03:21 PM)GMDino Wrote: Just to use round numbers if we normally pay $7.25 (plus bonuses) an hour these guys have to start at $9.00 and they won't get a bonus.  The business save $6.00 per hour for three months.  

If they guys work out that's a win for the company.  If they don't we're out half the pay for three months.

So they aren't getting rich but they are saving money.  And I don't have a problem with that...but I also know they would never hire someone at the higher rate without the government kicking some in. 

I think the big win is as you said, they get to try out some people with less investment.   

[Belsnickel]

(08-15-2018, 03:26 PM)michaelsean Wrote: I think the big win is as you said, they get to try out some people with less investment.   

Well, it also allows those employees to learn a new job (in theory, anyway, not knowing anything about the specific situation).

[*michaelsean*]

(08-15-2018, 03:27 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Well, it also allows those employees to learn a new job (in theory, anyway, not knowing anything about the specific situation).

We were just talking about the advantage to the employer.  

[Belsnickel]

(08-15-2018, 03:29 PM)michaelsean Wrote: We were just talking about the advantage to the employer.  

But I am all about the workers!



I feel like if I ever do run for office, my hyperbolic/fun posts like this will come back to haunt me.

[*michaelsean*]

(08-15-2018, 03:39 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: But I am all about the workers!



I feel like if I ever do run for office, my hyperbolic/fun posts like this will come back to haunt me.

A couple of us screenshot everything you post.

[Au165]

(08-15-2018, 12:47 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Giant warehouses full of stationary bikes that power electric generators.

There was a black mirror episode kind of around this. 

[BmorePat87]

(08-15-2018, 12:47 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Giant warehouses full of stationary bikes that power electric generators.

Have you seen black mirror?

[fredtoast]

(08-15-2018, 03:44 PM)Au165 Wrote: There was a black mirror episode kind of around this. 

(08-15-2018, 03:47 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: Have you seen black mirror?

I have seen a few episodes, but not that one.


Great show.  The fact that each one is a stand alone story makes it harder to figure out what exactly is going on.

[BmorePat87]

(08-15-2018, 04:05 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I have seen a few episodes, but not that one.


Great show.  The fact that each one is a stand alone story makes it harder to figure out what exactly is going on.

2nd episode of season 1. Stars the guy from Get Out.

[*bfine32*]

I much prefer a guaranteed jobs program to unemployment compensation.