Joe Biden is Trying to Lose

[XenoMorph]

(03-12-2020, 06:23 PM)6andcounting Wrote: Best of all I'm not conservative (I mean there are issues I'm conservative on), Republican or a Trump voter. I run counter to a lot of the left wing viewpoints and Trump bashing on this board so I get pegged s a Republican. I'm more than willing to argue against Trump supporters, hypocrisy in the criticism of Obama vs the defending of Trump on similar issues, and right wing outrage culture (I'm looking at you Sean Hannity), but no one on this board is right wing.  

Im more Right than Left when talking politics....  but I generally choose not to talk about them... Cause like a religious discussion there generally seems like there is no point as most people have made up their minds no matter what is presented to them

[*Nately120*]

(03-13-2020, 11:34 AM)Catmandude123 Wrote: Rooting for Bernie like in 2016? The DNC is telling you who to vote for in 2020? They know you will vote for who they tell you to vote for. BLIND SHEEP!!!! BAA BAA BAA

That's what is so amazing about the democratic party.  They are facing an election where they can get more actual votes and still lose in a landslide and yet they insist on pushing the candidate they want rather than the ones the voters ask for.

I assume Trump went from being a populist to a neo-con because it's the easiest route to the white house.  I mean, good on him for taking advantage of a flawed system and I bet NYC republican Bloomberg is still stewing that he didn't think of it first.

[*michaelsean*]

(03-13-2020, 11:34 AM)Catmandude123 Wrote: Rooting for Bernie like in 2016? The DNC is telling you who to vote for in 2020? They know you will vote for who they tell you to vote for. BLIND SHEEP!!!! BAA BAA BAA

I've never voted for a Democrat for President, and I'm rooting for Bernie so I don't have to vote for one this year.  

[fredtoast]

(03-13-2020, 11:49 AM)Nately120 Wrote: That's what is so amazing about the democratic party.  They are facing an election where they can get more actual votes and still lose in a landslide and yet they insist on pushing the candidate they want rather than the ones the voters ask for.

The voters are asking for Biden.  Have you not seen the primary results?

[*Nately120*]

(03-13-2020, 12:34 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The voters are asking for Biden.  Have you not seen the primary results?

Apparently not.  I was just responding to someone saying that Biden was being forced on us (us as a candidate for all, not me claiming to be a democrat, per se)...I guess I took the Socratic method to a level of fault on that one.  As the man in the orthopedic shoes said "I stand corrected."

[Mike M (the other one)]

(03-12-2020, 07:58 PM)Dill Wrote: What Dems complain about is the poor judgment Trump uses in making statements he does as president. Even a joke from him can send the stock market plummeting or send pipe bombs to his opponents.

E.g., when he said "Russia, if you're listening . . ." during the campaign.  Everyone knew that he was not "really" speaking to Russia, and yet soon after came the DNC hack and dump.  But when Democrats complained, Trump supporters immediately insisted it was "only a joke," and how foolish to take such statements seriously-- as if that somehow salvages Trump's poor judgment and self discipline.

Trump rattles off jokes and threats like he is simply an ordinary bully loudmouth shouting at the tv in a New York sports bar, with no wider consequences. And his supporters seem to see it that way too. He may be a bully loudmouth, but he is not in a sports bar. He represents the nation when he speaks and the whole world is listening. His statements not only have a performative effect, they signal the rest of the world what the U.S. tolerates, and when his statements contradict other departments and spokespersons of the exec, that signals disorganization and dysfunction--and for some foreign actors, that is an opportunity.

Why are you bringing up Hillary?

Like it or not, Trump is POTUS, and it's the Dems fault for not finding a better Opponent and currently, I see 2020 being no different. They will shoot down Bernie again and probably support Biden.

Trump and Hillary are both polarizing people, difference is, Hillary broadcasts herself as out of touch with non 1%'ers, where as Trump's campaigned was focused on the common person.

[fredtoast]

(03-13-2020, 02:06 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote:  where as Trump's campaigned was focused on the common person.

Trump's campaign was focused on helping corporations more than individuals with deregulation and lower taxes.  The rubes just fell for more of that "trickle down" bullshit.

[Dill]

(03-13-2020, 02:06 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Why are you bringing up Hillary?

Like it or not, Trump is POTUS, and it's the Dems fault for not finding a better Opponent and currently, I see 2020 being no different. They will shoot down Bernie again and probably support Biden.

Trump and Hillary are both polarizing people, difference is, Hillary broadcasts herself as out of touch with non 1%'ers, where as Trump's campaigned was focused on the common person.

Hillary was not a bad choice. She was clearly the most experienced of the Dem field and much more competent and mentally balanced than Trump.
The country would be much better off now, had she been elected.

And she did get almost three million more votes than Trump.  I wonder who on the Dem side could have done that well, or was as well prepared as she was.

And I don't find Hillary especially polarizing. She was a woman. The biggest drop in her numbers came after the Benghazi investigation discovered her private server, and then after "deep state" Comey announced he had re-opened an investigation into her server.  Yet that appears a sham concern now, given the president's family member's forced clearances and private cell phone use.

The difference is that Fox, with generous help from Russia, broadcast Hillary as out of touch--and Trump as somehow not part of "the elite." 

I am just puzzled by any claim Trump's rhetoric was aimed at "the common person." What drove his numbers up so rapidly were his racial slurs, the wall, and the Muslim ban.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(03-13-2020, 02:16 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Trump's campaign was focused on helping corporations more than individuals with deregulation and lower taxes.  The rubes just fell for more of that "trickle down" bullshit.

(03-13-2020, 02:35 PM)Dill Wrote: Hillary was not a bad choice. She was clearly the most experienced of the Dem field and much more competent and mentally balanced than Trump.
The country would be much better off now, had she been elected.

And she did get almost three million more votes than Trump.  I wonder who on the Dem side could have done that well, or was as well prepared as she was.

And I don't find Hillary especially polarizing. She was a woman. The biggest drop in her numbers came after the Benghazi investigation discovered her private server, and then after "deep state" Comey announced he had re-opened an investigation into her server.  Yet that appears a sham concern now, given the president's family member's forced clearances and private cell phone use.

The difference is that Fox, with generous help from Russia, broadcast Hillary as out of touch--and Trump as somehow not part of "the elite." 

I am just puzzled by any claim Trump's rhetoric was aimed at "the common person." What drove his numbers up so rapidly were his racial slurs, the wall, and the Muslim ban.

Clearly neither of you watched Hillary's or Trumps rallies.

Both were completely different. Trump talked about economics and bringing jobs back, things that common people care about. Hillary's people would leave after Beyoncé or who ever she had performing was done. People didn't care what her message was because it wasn't for them.

[Dill]

(03-13-2020, 04:24 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Clearly neither of you watched Hillary's or Trumps rallies.

Both were completely different. Trump talked about economics and bringing jobs back, things that common people care about. Hillary's people would leave after Beyoncé or who ever she had performing was done. People didn't care what her message was because it wasn't for them.

I did watch both. Trump talked about bringing jobs back--and the wall and the Muslim ban.
Three years later we've got a partial ban but not the wall.  And jobs are still leaving.

Some people didn't care that Hillary's "message" was based upon a more  competent and realistic assessment of the economy.
Again, a larger number did care about Hillary's message and policies. They knew she would keep the Iran Deal and go forward with the TPP and Paris Accord. Women would get a fairer shake in the workplace. The banks would be more closely watched. Healthcare would be expanded.

This was not a message for Fox viewers, for sure, who'd been hearing for years how "corrupt" and "dishonest" the Clinton's were, the Iran Deal was "the worst ever" etc. A caller to Rush Limbaugh in 2016 said "If Hillary wins, the White House will be up for sale; If Trump wins, the US will be open for Business." Then suddenly, corruption didn't matter when Trump won, and the WH was not only for sale, but open to unsupervised Russian diplomats and spies . Chaos ever since.

[GMDino]

(03-13-2020, 04:54 PM)Dill Wrote: I did watch both. Trump talked about bringing jobs back--and the wall and the Muslim ban.
Three years later we've got a partial ban but not the wall.  And jobs are still leaving.

Some people didn't care that Hillary's "message" was based upon a more  competent and realistic assessment of the economy.
Again, a larger number did care about Hillary's message and policies. They knew she would keep the Iran Deal and go forward with the TPP and Paris Accord. Women would get a fairer shake in the workplace. The banks would be more closely watched. Healthcare would be expanded.

This was not a message for Fox viewers, for sure, who'd been hearing for years how "corrupt" and "dishonest" the Clinton's were, the Iran Deal was "the worst ever" etc. A caller to Rush Limbaugh in 2016 said "If Hillary wins, the White House will be up for sale; If Trump wins, the US will be open for Business." Then suddenly, corruption didn't matter when Trump won, and the WH was not only for sale, but open to unsupervised Russian diplomats and spies . Chaos ever since.

A lot of people had their opinion of Clinton before she ever ran.

But yeah DJT spoke about those things.  He spoke about his Healthcare plan to.  Oddly he never presented one.

Seems he just said whatever he thought the his fans wanted to hear and enough voted in the right places to make him what will be the worst POTUS in our history.

So he's got that going for him.  

[fredtoast]

(03-13-2020, 04:24 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: Hillary's people would leave after Beyoncé or who ever she had performing was done. People didn't care what her message was because it wasn't for them.

This is bullshit.

How did she get 3 million more votes than Trump?

[CarolinaBengalFanGuy]

(03-13-2020, 04:54 PM)Dill Wrote: I did watch both. Trump talked about bringing jobs back--and the wall and the Muslim ban.
Three years later we've got a partial ban but not the wall.  And jobs are still leaving.

Some people didn't care that Hillary's "message" was based upon a more  competent and realistic assessment of the economy.
Again, a larger number did care about Hillary's message and policies. They knew she would keep the Iran Deal and go forward with the TPP and Paris Accord. Women would get a fairer shake in the workplace. The banks would be more closely watched. Healthcare would be expanded.

This was not a message for Fox viewers, for sure, who'd been hearing for years how "corrupt" and "dishonest" the Clinton's were, the Iran Deal was "the worst ever" etc. A caller to Rush Limbaugh in 2016 said "If Hillary wins, the White House will be up for sale; If Trump wins, the US will be open for Business." Then suddenly, corruption didn't matter when Trump won, and the WH was not only for sale, but open to unsupervised Russian diplomats and spies . Chaos ever since.

Hey now, there's a partial wall as well. 

I personally just did not like Hillary. And my mom watched a lot of reality TV so I was mostly familiar with Trump, for good or bad. I also did not vote for him in our Primary either though. I'm currently 0-3 in my primary choices lol