M/illions march in NY against the Repubs

[Millhouse]

I hope those kids weren't eating too many cheeseburgers.

[GMDino]

(09-23-2019, 10:46 PM)Millhouse Wrote: I hope those kids weren't eating too many cheeseburgers.

So far I've seent that various FOX "News" hosts and guests have called the girl mentally ill and compared her to Children of the corn.

That she has Aspergers and they are making fun of her would surprise me if it wasn't for the "man" they blindly support as POTUS.

Over the weekend a man who received a presidential pardon compared her to the children used in Hitler propaganda posters.

And Trump is intimidated by a 16 year old who can think more deeply and clearly than him.

She seems like a very happy young girl looking forward to a bright and wonderful future. So nice to see! https://t.co/1tQG6QcVKO

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) September 24, 2019

t>

And she shows that that she is a bigger person than any of them can ever be.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

A few things about this kid and this movement in general.

1. I'm not a fan of using children to make political points. It's an appeal to emotion and it's using them. Regardless of your feelings on the topic at hand this kid is being astroturfed and propped up by people with a political agenda. She also isn't changing anyone's mind. Either you agree with her message and love her or you don't and don't. She's not persuasive. If anything her accusatory, aggressive, style probably turns off more people than it wins over. Of course, we shouldn't expect swaying oratory from children, which is another reason they shouldn't be used for political purposes.

2. This message is being directed at the wrong audience. The main polluter in the world is China. Somehow I don't think we'll see Greta in Beijing delivering her fiery lecture. Add in the third world and you have the vast majority of pollution, yet these polluters are omitted. The more cynical side of me believes this is because attacking poor third world countries would be dreadfully un-PC. Also, population control would go much further towards eliminating pollution than anything proposed by Greta. Yet we haven't heard that mentioned at all. The cynical side of me raises its head again.

3. We're already past the point that reducing emissions will be a game changer. Especially, as mentioned above, due to the fact that most pollution is generated by countries and areas of the world that Greta (or more appropriately her handlers) don't appear to be concerned about. What we need is a scientific process to reverse the damage already caused. It's certainly possible and already achievable at a small scale. An international style Manhattan Project to develop this process would be an excellent solution IMO.

[GMDino]

(09-24-2019, 10:55 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: A few things about this kid and this movement in general.

1.  I'm not a fan of using children to make political points.  It's an appeal to emotion and it's using them.  Regardless of your feelings on the topic at hand this kid is being astroturfed and propped up by people with a political agenda.  She also isn't changing anyone's mind.  Either you agree with her message and love her or you don't and don't.  She's not persuasive.  If anything her accusatory, aggressive, style probably turns off more people than it wins over.  Of course, we shouldn't expect swaying oratory from children, which is another reason they shouldn't be used for political purposes.

2.  This message is being directed at the wrong audience.  The main polluter in the world is China.  Somehow I don't think we'll see Greta in Beijing delivering her fiery lecture.  Add in the third world and you have the vast majority of pollution, yet these polluters are omitted.  The more cynical side of me believes this is because attacking poor third world countries would be dreadfully un-PC.  Also, population control would go much further towards eliminating pollution than anything proposed by Greta.  Yet we haven't heard that mentioned at all.  The cynical side of me raises its head again.

3.  We're already past the point that reducing emissions will be a game changer.  Especially, as mentioned above, due to the fact that most pollution is generated by countries and areas of the world that Greta (or more appropriately her handlers) don't appear to be concerned about.  What we need is a scientific process to reverse the damage already caused.  It's certainly possible and already achievable at a small scale.  An international style Manhattan Project to develop this process would be an excellent solution IMO.

1. She started this last year.  Sorry that it catching on bothers you.  But as always, go after the messenger first, right?

2.  You have an unhealthy obsession with China.  That aside we can start with our own house and then move on to everyone else in the world.

3.  Gotta start somewhere.  The "Well, that won't do enough so we might as well not do anything" is causing more damage.

It was a valiant attempt to pretend that you wanted to talk about the environment while simply going after the girl, the people who marched and her "handlers".  lol

I just picture you in the 60's going on about those "damn hippies!" 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(09-24-2019, 11:08 AM)GMDino Wrote: 1. She started this last year.  Sorry that it catching on bothers you.  But as always, go after the messenger first, right?

I believe I stated my issue with this, and it has nothing to do with Greta herself.  Do try and address points made instead of trying to shoehorn everyone's response into your preconceived notions of them.

Quote:2.  You have an unhealthy obsession with China.  That aside we can start with our own house and then move on to everyone else in the world.

You have an unhealthy aversion to facts.  But as always, go after the messenger first, right?

Quote:3.  Gotta start somewhere.  The "Well, that won't do enough so we might as well not do anything" is causing more damage.

It was a valiant attempt to pretend that you wanted to talk about the environment while simply going after the girl, the people who marched and her "handlers".  lol

I just picture you in the 60's going on about those "damn hippies!" 

You've rapidly become even more boring then you used to be.  I honestly think three years of Trump has damaged your ability to have an adult conversation.  Alternatively, you could try again and actually address the content of my post.  I won't hold my breath.

[GMDino]

(09-24-2019, 11:17 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I believe I stated my issue with this, and it has nothing to do with Greta herself.  Do try and address points made instead of trying to shoehorn everyone's response into your preconceived notions of them.



You have an unhealthy aversion to facts.  But as always, go after the messenger first, right?


You've rapidly become even more boring then you used to be.  I honestly think three years of Trump has damaged your ability to have an adult conversation.  Alternatively, you could try again and actually address the content of my post.  I won't hold my breath.

I addressed exactly what you posted:

You "issue" is that you don't like children (and their 'handlers' lolz) pushing the message.  You also disagree with the message.

You don't want to do anything that won't help "enough" and want other countries (CHINA!!!) to go first.

That response to climate change is what is boring.  

Anyone out there raising awareness to the issue is good by me.  Other countries ARE worse but we have to be willing to clean up our own mess first/too.  

If you posted something of substance against the march I'd take it more seriously.  Until then..c'ya!

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(09-24-2019, 11:26 AM)GMDino Wrote: I addressed exactly what you posted:

No, you didn't.

Quote:You "issue" is that you don't like children (and their 'handlers' lolz) pushing the message.

 
I don't like using children for political purposes, this is not the same argument you just stated.

Quote:You also disagree with the message.

I didn't say that.

Quote:You don't want to do anything that won't help "enough" and want other countries (CHINA!!!) to go first.

I didn't say that.

Quote:That response to climate change is what is boring.  

Anyone out there raising awareness to the issue is good by me.  Other countries ARE worse but we have to be willing to clean up our own mess first/too.  

If you posted something of substance against the march I'd take it more seriously.  Until then..c'ya!

Maybe if you actually read posts they'd have some substance?

[*bfine32*]

(09-24-2019, 11:17 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I believe I stated my issue with this, and it has nothing to do with Greta herself.  Do try and address points made instead of trying to shoehorn everyone's response into your preconceived notions of them.

I such as you "attacked" who pimped her rather than the messenger herself and likewise was accused of attacking the messager. But apparently I did it in cowardly manner because I was scared.

Perhaps those accusing us of attacking the messenger in these back and forths instead of addressing the point are.......wait for it........it's coming........here it is... ATTACKING THE MESSENGERS

[*Nately120*]

She's old enough to be bleeding out of her...wherever...so who cares what she says?

[fredtoast]

(09-20-2019, 05:07 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Nothing speaks about Bravery like having children march for you.

(09-23-2019, 08:32 PM)bfibfine32 Wrote: 2. Which messenger did I cowardly attack in my fear?

The marchers.

[fredtoast]

(09-24-2019, 12:12 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Perhaps those accusing us of attacking the messenger in these back and forths instead of addressing the point are.......wait for it........it's coming........here it is... ATTACKING THE MESSENGERS

Here is my reply to every comment you have made about climate change in this thread.

".  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  "

[*michaelsean*]

(09-24-2019, 10:55 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: A few things about this kid and this movement in general.

1. I'm not a fan of using children to make political points. It's an appeal to emotion and it's using them. Regardless of your feelings on the topic at hand this kid is being astroturfed and propped up by people with a political agenda. She also isn't changing anyone's mind. Either you agree with her message and love her or you don't and don't. She's not persuasive. If anything her accusatory, aggressive, style probably turns off more people than it wins over. Of course, we shouldn't expect swaying oratory from children, which is another reason they shouldn't be used for political purposes.

2. This message is being directed at the wrong audience. The main polluter in the world is China. Somehow I don't think we'll see Greta in Beijing delivering her fiery lecture. Add in the third world and you have the vast majority of pollution, yet these polluters are omitted. The more cynical side of me believes this is because attacking poor third world countries would be dreadfully un-PC. Also, population control would go much further towards eliminating pollution than anything proposed by Greta. Yet we haven't heard that mentioned at all. The cynical side of me raises its head again.

3. We're already past the point that reducing emissions will be a game changer. Especially, as mentioned above, due to the fact that most pollution is generated by countries and areas of the world that Greta (or more appropriately her handlers) don't appear to be concerned about. What we need is a scientific process to reverse the damage already caused. It's certainly possible and already achievable at a small scale. An international style Manhattan Project to develop this process would be an excellent solution IMO.

I had no idea who she was when I commented on Dino’s meme. I just thought it was a stupid meme. But I have since looked up a video of her, and yeah it’s not s great approach. “We will never forgive you”. First of all, I don’t care you won’t be the first, but who is she speaking for? And then a bunch of “How dare you’d”. If I heard it right she scoffs at 50% reduction in emissions in ten years. So she’s aligned with some hardcore people. She dismisses the need for economic growth but can afford to sail a yacht across the Atlantic.

Edit: Yes this is 100% about the messenger since I don’t know from whom the message originated.

[GMDino]

Poster A & B go after the "children" and the girl who started the strikes.

Other posters say they aren't posting anything of substance by going after the messenger.

Poster A & B claim they are being attacked rather than their message.

Trump has taught some how to crawl up on the cross quite well.

[*bfine32*]

(09-24-2019, 12:41 PM)fredtoast Wrote: The marchers.

If you read that post and process that I'm attacking the marchers then I have to question your cognition. Especially when the original post you quoted stated I said it was good to see the kids active.

 

(09-24-2019, 12:44 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Here is my reply to every comment you have made about climate change in this thread.

".  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  .  "

The OP did not address Climate Change. He addressed these young people marching "against republicans". But in the future feel free to use that reply for all my posts.

[GMDino]

https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/people/why-is-greta-thunberg-so-triggering-for-certain-men-1.4002264?fbclid=IwAR3P2Q2pmFAcLjtRI5Of9cooj9P95Fb2uBnE8ZcTsJwHAD9-yz2wyFCsTis

Quote:Why is Greta Thunberg so triggering for certain men?

How can a 16-year-old girl in plaits, dedicated to trying to save the planet, inspire such incandescent rage?

Sat, Sep 7, 2019, 06:02

 
Why is Greta Thunberg so triggering? How can a 16-year-old girl in plaits, who has dedicated herself to the not-exactly sinister, authoritarian plot of trying to save the planet from extinction, inspire such incandescent rage?


Last week, she tweeted that she had arrived into New York after her two week transatlantic voyage: “Finally here. Thank you everyone who came to see me off in Plymouth, and everyone who welcomed me in New York! Now I’m going to rest for a few days, and on Friday I’m going to participate in the strike outside the UN”, before promptly giving a press conference in English. 


Yes, her second language.


Her remarks were immediately greeted with a barrage of jibes about virtue signalling, and snide remarks about the three crew members who will have to fly out to take the yacht home.

This shouldn’t need to be spelled out, but as some people don’t seem to have grasped it yet, we’ll give it a lash: Thunberg’s trip was an act of protest, not a sacred commandment or an instruction manual for the rest of us. Like all acts of protest, it was designed to be symbolic and provocative. For those who missed the point – and oh, how they missed the point – she retweeted someone else’s “friendly reminder” that: “You don’t need to spend two weeks on a boat to do your part to avert our climate emergency. You just need to do everything you can, with everyone you can, to change everything you can.”

Quote:It is the most vicious and the most fatuous kind of playground bullying

Part of the reason she inspires such rage, of course, is blindingly obvious. Climate change is terrifying. The Amazon is burning. So too is the Savannah. Parts of the Arctic are on fire. Sea levels are rising. There are more vicious storms and wildfires and droughts and floods. Denial is easier than confronting the terrifying truth.

Then there’s the fact that we don’t like being made to feel bad about our life choices. That’s human nature. It’s why we sneer at vegans. It’s why we’re suspicious of sober people at parties. And if anything is likely to make you feel bad about your life choices -- as you jet back home after your third Ryanair European minibreak this season – it’ll be the sight of small-boned child subjecting herself to a fortnight being tossed about on the Atlantic, with only a bucket bearing a “Poo Only Please” sign by way of luxury, in order to make a point about climate change.




But that’s not virtue signalling, which anyone can indulge in. As Meghan Markle, Prince Harry, and their-four-private-jets-in-11-days found recently, virtue practising is a lot harder.


Even for someone who spends a lot of time on Twitter, some of the criticism levelled at Thunberg is astonishing. It is, simultaneously, the most vicious and the most fatuous kind of playground bullying. The Australian conservative climate change denier Andrew Bolt called her “deeply disturbed” and “freakishly influential” (the use of “freakish”, we can assume, was not incidental.) The former UKIP funder, Arron Banks, tweeted “Freaking yacht accidents do happen in August” (as above.) Brendan O’Neill of Spiked called her a “millenarian weirdo” (nope, still not incidental) in a piece that referred nastily to her “monotone voice” and “the look of apocalyptic dread in her eyes”.


But who’s the real freak – the activist whose determination has single-handedly started a powerful global movement for change, or the middle-aged man taunting a child with Asperger syndrome from behind the safety of their computer screens?

And that, of course, is the real reason why Greta Thunberg is so triggering. They can’t admit it even to themselves, so they ridicule her instead. But the truth is that they’re afraid of her. The poor dears are terrified of her as an individual, and of what she stands for – youth, determination, change.
Swedish climate activist Greta Thunberg and a crew consisting of German skipper Boris Herrmann, filmmaker Nathan Grossman, founder of Team Malizia Pierre Casiraghi, and her father Svante Thunberg sailed to the US for the UN Climate Action Summit on the racing boat Malizia II. Photograph: Greta Thunberg/ EPA
She is part of a generation who won’t be cowed. She isn’t about to be shamed into submission by trolls. That’s not actually a look of apocalyptic dread in her eyes. It’s a look that says “you’re not relevant”.


The reason they taunt her with childish insults is because that’s all they’ve got. They’re out of ideas. They can’t dismantle her arguments, because she has science – and David Attenborough – on her side. They can’t win the debate with the persuasive force of their arguments, because these bargain bin cranks trade in jaded cynicism, not youthful passion. They can harangue her with snide tweets and hot take blogposts, but they won’t get a reaction because, frankly, she has bigger worries on her mind.

Quote:In an age when democracy is under assault, she hints at the emergency of new kind of power

That’s not to say that we should accept everything Thunberg says without question. She is an idealist who is young enough to see the world in black and white. We need voices like hers. We should listen to what she has to say, without tuning the more moderate voices of dissent out.


Why is Greta Thunberg so triggering? Because of what she represents. In an age when democracy is under assault, she hints at the emergency of new kind of power, a convergence of youth, popular protest and irrefutable science. And for her loudest detractors, she also represents something else: the sight of their impending obsolescence hurtling towards them.

[*michaelsean*]

(09-24-2019, 01:36 PM)GMDino Wrote: https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/people/why-is-greta-thunberg-so-triggering-for-certain-men-1.4002264?fbclid=IwAR3P2Q2pmFAcLjtRI5Of9cooj9P95Fb2uBnE8ZcTsJwHAD9-yz2wyFCsTis

She thinks I sneer at vegans because they make me feel bad about my choices.  She missed that one by a mile.  

[GMDino]

(09-24-2019, 01:50 PM)michaelsean Wrote: She thinks I sneer at vegans because they make me feel bad about my choices.  She missed that one by a mile.  

Huh.  Then maybe she wasn't talking about you but rather others.

[*michaelsean*]

(09-24-2019, 01:52 PM)GMDino Wrote: Huh.  Then maybe she wasn't talking about you but rather others.

She said "we".  She casts a very large net in her column with no explanation for how she knows all these things.

Personally I don't think the girl is an effective messenger to the middle of the road people. Fifteen year olds yelling "How dare you" over and over at adults generally doesn't go over well.

[GMDino]

(09-24-2019, 01:53 PM)michaelsean Wrote: She said "we".  She casts a very large net in her column with no explanation for how she knows all these things.

Personally I don't think the girl is an effective messenger to the middle of the road people. Fifteen year olds yelling "How dare you" over and over at adults generally doesn't go over well.

Gee.  I guess the article wasn't about you then.  Don't see why you are defending yourself from it.

[*michaelsean*]

(09-24-2019, 02:02 PM)GMDino Wrote: Gee.  I guess the article wasn't about you then.  Don't see why you are defending yourself from it.

No I'm saying there are a multitude of reasons people can be responding to her negatively. Why do you think she excluded women? Certainly there have been women who have responded negatively.

Meanwhile I'm going to go write an article about why black men do certain things.  It  should be a hit.