MAGA

[jj22]

This was a topic that was never resolved during the election cycle. Probably because of the horrific facts that it entails.

So I ask Trump supporters, when was America Great in their opinion?

During what era?

Give me the date and era so I can understand what you guys are looking for.

[Dill]

(07-11-2019, 03:59 PM)jj22 Wrote: This was a topic that was never resolved during the election cycle. Probably because of the horrific facts that it entails.

So I ask Trump supporters, when was America Great in their opinion?

During what era?

Give me the date and era so I can understand what you guys are looking for.

[Goalpost]

Economically, right now, in comparison to the rest of the world ,ie vs Europe and Asia we are great. I would say historically we were great during World War11.

[*bfine32*]

Early 80s.

Your boy bfine was rocking the parachute pants, popping the collar on the polo, and setting it off with the Members Only jacket. He was cruising Golden Tee and Malibu Grand Prix with the fellas and hooking up with the ladies.

[6andcounting]

Doesn't it refer to when manufacturing jobs weren't outsourced and when America was more energy independent?

[*Nately120*]

I'd imagine people picture the whitewashed 50's but relate to the gilded 80's. Now if you'll excuse me, I'm gonna crack some Vinnie Vincent Invasion and daydream about Reaganomics and expensive missile-defense systems.

[Benton]

(07-11-2019, 06:39 PM)6andcounting Wrote: Doesn't it refer to when manufacturing jobs weren't outsourced and when America was more energy independent?

That's the general idea.

Also, there's a focus on some issues today (violence, alcohol abuse, sexual assaults, drug abuse, etc) that weren't really discussed back then. That leads to a misonception that suddenly were more violent, more addicted, more abusive. Truth is, proportionally, were about the same. 

[Dill]

(07-12-2019, 02:10 AM)Benton Wrote: That's the general idea.

Also, there's a focus on some issues today (violence, alcohol abuse, sexual assaults, drug abuse, etc) that weren't really discussed back then. That leads to a misonception that suddenly were more violent, more addicted, more abusive. Truth is, proportionally, were about the same. 

Some things have gotten better, though.
 
Or worse--depending on one's perspective.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-12-2019, 11:10 AM)Dill Wrote: Some things have gotten better, though.

Many things have gotten better.

Quote: Or worse--depending on one's perspective.

Dog whistle. 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-12-2019, 02:10 AM)Benton Wrote: That's the general idea.

Concurred.  That's always been the thrust of the slogan.

Quote:Also, there's a focus on some issues today (violence, alcohol abuse, sexual assaults, drug abuse, etc) that weren't really discussed back then. That leads to a misonception that suddenly were more violent, more addicted, more abusive. Truth is, proportionally, were about the same. 

Actually, things are much less violent now then they were in the 70's-80's, per capita.  Conversely, you are correct that there is a proportion of our population that thinks thing are infinitely worse.  This skewed perception is responsible for a far percentage of today's social unrest.

[Dill]

(07-12-2019, 11:13 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Dog whistle. 

Must be. No one said "race"  .

So, depending on one's perspective, things haven't gotten worse?

No one out there complaining about "what's gotten better"?

[*jason*]

Prior to 1492.

[GMDino]

I think it varies from supporter to supporter.

There is a group who wants anyone "different" than them to shut up and start acting like "Americans".

There is a group who want the 80's with the "greed is good" mentality.

There is a group who want manufacturing jobs (and wages) back to the way they were prior to the 80's.

I don't know if any of them are getting what the want or if that will change their votes in 2020.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-12-2019, 11:29 AM)Dill Wrote: Must be. No one said "race"  .

So, depending on one's perspective, things haven't gotten worse?

No one out there complaining about "what's gotten better"?

I'm just enjoying you engaging in behavior you decry in others.  Any social change is going to have some people yearning for the way things used to be.  In some cases they are blinkered and short sighted, in some cases they are not.  Not all changes are objectively good.  Your thinly disguised attempt to paint those who don't embrace every change as bad people deserves to be called out, just as GMDin's blatant racism deserved to be called out.  At the very least, have the moral courage to actually say what you mean, it would make these types of discussions easier to have.

[Dill]

(07-12-2019, 11:44 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I'm just enjoying you engaging in behavior you decry in others.  Any social change is going to have some people yearning for the way things used to be.  In some cases they are blinkered and short sighted, in some cases they are not.  Not all changes are objectively good.  Your thinly disguised attempt to paint those who don't embrace every change as bad people deserves to be called out, just as GMDin's blatant racism deserved to be called out.  At the very least, have the moral courage to actually say what you mean, it would make these types of discussions easier to have.

LOL my reference to people who were happier before Brown vs Board="engaging in the behavior [I] decry in others." Somehow.

A thinly disguised attempt to paint people who don't embrace equal rights as bad people has been duly "called out."

Should have said what I meant. Instead of showing.

Like just saying what you mean establishes Dino's "blatant racism."

Enjoying the "moral courage," which makes these types of discussions easier.

[GMDino]

(07-12-2019, 11:44 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I'm just enjoying you engaging in behavior you decry in others.  Any social change is going to have some people yearning for the way things used to be.  In some cases they are blinkered and short sighted, in some cases they are not.  Not all changes are objectively good.  Your thinly disguised attempt to paint those who don't embrace every change as bad people deserves to be called out, just as GMDin's blatant racism deserved to be called out.  At the very least, have the moral courage to actually say what you mean, it would make these types of discussions easier to have.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-12-2019, 11:58 AM)Dill Wrote: LOL my reference to people who were happier before Brown vs Board="engaging in the behavior [I] decry in others." Somehow.

A thinly disguised attempt to paint people who don't embrace equal rights as bad people has been duly "called out."

Should have said what I meant. Instead of showing.

This is not what I said and no person with a modicum of intelligence could have inferred it.  But feel free to point out in my post where I referenced that particular decision or the people who would have been/still are against it.

Quote:Like just saying what you mean establishes Dino's "blatant racism."

So, in your opinion, making a blatantly racist statement is not an indicator of being a racist person?  Now your Tucker Carlson argument doesn't make any sense at all.

Quote:Enjoying the "moral courage," which makes these types of discussions easier.

You might enjoy it when you start engaging in it.  Maybe try addressing the actual post you quoted and the points made in it rather than engaging in Fred style twisting?

[Dill]

(07-12-2019, 02:19 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: This is not what I said and no person with a modicum of intelligence could have inferred it.  But feel free to point out in my post where I referenced that particular decision or the people who would have been/still are against it.

Sure. Here you go:

(07-12-2019, 11:44 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I'm just enjoying you engaging in behavior you decry in others. . . . Your thinly disguised attempt to paint those who don't embrace every change as bad people deserves to be called out, just as GMDin's blatant racism deserved to be called out.

Lots of "calling out" deserved here.  Moral courage.

So what sort of behavior do you think I would be "decrying" by posting an image of federal marshals escorting a black girl to school?
Who are the bad people "thinly disguised" by such images?

(07-12-2019, 02:19 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: So, in your opinion, making a blatantly racist statement is not an indicator of being a racist person?  Now your Tucker Carlson argument doesn't make any sense at all.

You might enjoy it when you start engaging in it.  Maybe try addressing the actual post you quoted and the points made in it rather than engaging in Fred style twisting?

If we are clear on the definition of "racist," I suppose making a "blatantly racist statement" could indicate a person is racist. 
But just claiming another poster is blatantly racist--sans definition and evidence--just doesn't meet the bar. Especially when the "racist" in question critiques racism in thread after thread. (Do I sense a charge of "reverse racism" in the offing here? lol)

Somehow you have managed to draw Dino and Fred into claims against my post.   And Tucker Carlson too?  Why isn't this "Fred-style twisting" as you put it?

Just looks like a lot of negative, unsupported statements about other posters presented as fact, personal grudges carried over from other threads  "thinly disguised" as moral courage, and taking yet another discussion down the rabbit hole.

Why are you unable to discuss "Tucker Carlson arguments" on the Carlson thread?  A post still awaits your answer there. 

Why not pursue your specific gripes against Dino and Fred on those other threads, and here come back to the thread topic of when Trump supporters thought America was great?  

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-12-2019, 03:03 PM)Dill Wrote: Sure. Here you go:

Oh, was your comment directed solely at those against integration?  It certainly didn't come off that way.

Quote:Lots of "calling out" deserved here.  Moral courage.

So what sort of behavior do you think I would be "decrying" by posting an image of federal marshals escorting a black girl to school?
Who are the bad people "thinly disguised" by such images?

Again, if that was the only societal change you were inferring with your post then I wouldn't have made the point I did.  However, as you infer in others, I inferred from your posting history and prior statements that was not the case.  You should be familiar with this practice as you recently advocated for it in another thread.

Quote:If we are clear on the definition of "racist," I suppose making a "blatantly racist statement" could indicate a person is racist. 
But just claiming another poster is blatantly racist--sans definition and evidence--just doesn't meet the bar. Especially when the "racist" in question critiques racism in thread after thread. (Do I sense a charge of "reverse racism" in the offing here? lol)

You are correct an accusation is not sufficient.  An accusation coupled with a concrete example is.  Also, there is no such thing as "reverse racism" there is only racism.  Maybe you're comfortable with certain racist statements or claims depending on the group they are directed towards.  I am not.  Also, being ostensibly against something and then engaging in it is not exculpatory evidence.

Quote:Somehow you have managed to draw Dino and Fred into claims against my post.   And Tucker Carlson too?  Why isn't this "Fred-style twisting" as you put it?

You addressed points not made.  I thought I was being quite clear.

Quote:Just looks like a lot of negative, unsupported statements about other posters presented as fact, personal grudges carried over from other threads  "thinly disguised" as moral courage, and taking yet another discussion down the rabbit hole.

Quote:Why are you unable to discuss "Tucker Carlson arguments" on the Carlson thread?  A post still awaits your answer there. 

I'd be happy to discuss it.  I won't discuss it with a person engaging in racist behavior and then expecting to discuss racist behavior in others. 

Quote:Why not pursue your specific gripes against Dino and Fred on those other threads, and here come back to the thread topic of when Trump supporters thought America was great?  

I mentioned Fred because you were engaging in classic Fred behavior, but I will absolutely withdraw his name from further discussion here to mollify you.

[Dill]

(07-12-2019, 03:39 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Oh, was your comment directed solely at those against integration?  It certainly didn't come off that way.

Rockwell image of Marshals forcing integration. Not quite a Rorschach blot, was it? Posted on a thread themed by the question, "when do Trump supporters think America was great?"  Tacked on to a point by Benton, that drug use and violence are about the same as ever. Framed by the words "Some things have gotten better" (in contrast to the events represented in the picture), and the words "Or worse--depending on one's perspective." Both statements a reference to the present, to the legacy of integration.

You read into that a "thinly disguised attempt to paint those who don't embrace every change as bad people"?  Me engaging in behavior I "decry in others"?  A dog whistle?

(07-12-2019, 03:39 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Again, if that was the only societal change you were inferring with your post then I wouldn't have made the point I did.  However, as you infer in others, I inferred from your posting history and prior statements that was not the case.  You should be familiar with this practice as you recently advocated for it in another thread.
You are correct an accusation is not sufficient.  An accusation coupled with a concrete example is.  Also, there is no such thing as "reverse racism" there is only racism.  Maybe you're comfortable with certain racist statements or claims depending on the group they are directed tow
I'd be happy to discuss it.  I won't discuss it with a person engaging in racist behavior and then expecting to discuss racist behavior in others. 
I mentioned Fred because you were engaging in classic Fred behavior, but I will absolutely withdraw his name from further discussion here to mollify you.

I still don't know what "Fred-twisting" behavior is.  I cannot recall a single post by Fred as opaque and obfuscatory as yours in this thread.

Now reference to an undefined, mysterious "practice" of mine, which involves "inferring in others" and is "advocated" on another thread?  What??

And still talking about unspecified "racist statements" made somewhere. Dino's? Mine? You'll continue throw ther term "racist" around with neither definition nor examples, but you "won't discuss it with a person engaging in racist behavior and then expecting to discuss racist behavior in others."
That is a standard?? 

Define your terms, provide examples, offer proof of claims--that is what I "advocate" here and on every thread.

Connect your points to the thread, or this is just name calling and I am not interested in providing a foil for that.