MYTH: GOP is better for the Economy
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MYTH: GOP is better for the Economy
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05-22-2023, 03:58 PM
Why does Clinton get credit and not the Republican Congress? You know, the people in charge of the budget.
“History teaches that grave threats to liberty often come in times of urgency, when constitutional rights seem too extravagant to endure.”-Thurgood Marshall
![[Image: 4CV0TeR.png]](https://i.imgur.com/4CV0TeR.png) 
05-22-2023, 05:30 PM
(05-22-2023, 03:56 PM)michaelsean Wrote: For being a Republican all the way up until McConnell screwed the Dems on a SC seat, you seem to not like a lot of historical Republican ideology.. This party is so far away from traditional Republicanism that the party of the past wouldn't recognize todays. I've always leaned towards the more liberal side of the party than tried and true conservative side. The current party moved so far to the right that people like me were no longer connected to them But, it is amazing how one can grow, evolve, and change previously held opinions. IMO, the fiscal choices of the Democrats are far less harmful to this country than the politics of the 1950's that the Republicans seem to favor. The Democratic Party looks forward and the Republican look backward. The Democratic Party has ideas and the Republicans complain but offer no actual alternatives. The authoritarian, Christian-nationalist bent of today's republican party should scare the hell over anyone who claims to be a patriot Fueled by the pursuit of greatness. 
05-22-2023, 06:42 PM
(05-22-2023, 05:30 PM)pally Wrote: This party is so far away from traditional Republicanism that the party of the past wouldn't recognize todays. I've always leaned towards the more liberal side of the party than tried and true conservative side. The current party moved so far to the right that people like me were no longer connected to them Yeah, I'm not a fan of having to justify your personal changes/growth. You once identified as a Republican and no longer do so, no problem. I have the exact same experience, in the opposite direction. When I saw the real world results of Democratic policies, and the suffering they are causing, coupled with the left's embrace of anti-Constitutional ideals I walked away in the opposite direction. Much like yourself I was on the more moderate end of the Dem spectrum, but never would have envisioned the complete break with the party I would later undergo. 
05-22-2023, 07:33 PM
(05-22-2023, 06:42 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Yeah, I'm not a fan of having to justify your personal changes/growth. You once identified as a Republican and no longer do so, no problem. I have the exact same experience, in the opposite direction. When I saw the real world results of Democratic policies, and the suffering they are causing, coupled with the left's embrace of anti-Constitutional ideals I walked away in the opposite direction. Much like yourself I was on the more moderate end of the Dem spectrum, but never would have envisioned the complete break with the party I would later undergo. I’m not asking her to justify changing. Hell I’ve done that quite a bit. But she seems to really not care for tge Republican Party of yesteryear.
“History teaches that grave threats to liberty often come in times of urgency, when constitutional rights seem too extravagant to endure.”-Thurgood Marshall
05-22-2023, 07:40 PM
(05-22-2023, 05:30 PM)pally Wrote: This party is so far away from traditional Republicanism that the party of the past wouldn't recognize todays. I've always leaned towards the more liberal side of the party than tried and true conservative side. The current party moved so far to the right that people like me were no longer connected to them Based on SSF post maybe it read wrong. You just don’t seem to have any conservative ideology at all. It’s just weird that you were ever a Republican. I’m not doubting you you, it just doesn’t seem to fit. People who quit a party don’t generally go all in for the other party. Like me. I really don’t identify with Republicans anymore, but I sure as hell don’t have any love for Democrats. Maybe you are the political version of a person who quit smoking. 
“History teaches that grave threats to liberty often come in times of urgency, when constitutional rights seem too extravagant to endure.”-Thurgood Marshall
05-22-2023, 08:07 PM
(05-22-2023, 07:33 PM)michaelsean Wrote: I’m not asking her to justify changing. Hell I’ve done that quite a bit. But she seems to really not care for tge Republican Party of yesteryear. No, I get that and you're certainly not the type of poster to go after someone like that. I'm just aware of being on the other end of that question as so many of the far left posters here have hurled that accusation at me numerous times.
05-22-2023, 08:10 PM
(05-22-2023, 08:07 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: No, I get that and you're certainly not the type of poster to go after someone like that. I'm just aware of being on the other end of that question as so many of the far left posters here have hurled that accusation at me numerous times. Witnessed it first hand many times with you. Yeah I was just a bit surprised and curious when Pally said she had been a Republican up until around 2016.
“History teaches that grave threats to liberty often come in times of urgency, when constitutional rights seem too extravagant to endure.”-Thurgood Marshall
05-22-2023, 09:31 PM
(05-22-2023, 08:10 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Witnessed it first hand many times with you. Yeah I was just a bit surprised and curious when Pally said she had been a Republican up until around 2016. I had pretty much been down the middle until shortly after 9/11 when my dis-trust of the GOP began and later as their Fox News spin factory snowballed as they distorted pretty much everything they could to demonize half of the country. The only way that they can continue to get their tax cuts is to play the culture war.
Only users lose drugs.
:-)-~~~
05-22-2023, 09:42 PM
(05-22-2023, 09:31 PM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: I had pretty much been down the middle until shortly after 9/11 when my dis-trust of the GOP began and later as their Fox News spin factory snowballed as they distorted pretty much everything they could to demonize half of the country. The only way that they can continue to get their tax cuts is to play the culture war. If you don't mind my asking, what part of the country do you live in?
05-22-2023, 10:31 PM
(05-22-2023, 05:30 PM)pally Wrote: This party is so far away from traditional Republicanism that the party of the past wouldn't recognize todays. I've always leaned towards the more liberal side of the party than tried and true conservative side. The current party moved so far to the right that people like me were no longer connected to them Politics in the US are really weird. I'd probably be a moderate-ish conservative if the culture war politics weren't so prevalent. I don't love taxes and overregulation, and I definitely prefer a world where the US is the dominant global power (it's not perfect, but it beats the alternatives). I basically think able-bodies people should work hard and should be able to retire with some dignity at some point. It's just so strange that the things that impact political affiliations are some of the least impactful on the largest number of people, ie the culture war crap. I can't believe that drag queens are actually being targeted by a major political party on a national level, and it's working for the party. They've been around forever, and nobody really got their panties in a twist about it. Now they're groomers that are a danger to kids. Nutso. People accuse the left of making shit up to be outraged over, and to a large extent, they are right. Unfortunately, the right is no different. They aren't overly creative, so gay-bashing and fear mongering is a solid go to. The formula is simple, and they've done it for years. Find a smallish group of people, blame them for something horrific (or call them pedos as in the modern vernacular), rile up the base, rinse, repeat.
05-23-2023, 01:29 AM
(05-22-2023, 09:42 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: If you don't mind my asking, what part of the country do you live in? Alaska I live in Anchorage, also do business in Wasilla(50 road miles north) and Soldotna(150 road miles south). Anchorage is mostly liberal, Wasilla and Soldotna are ultra MAGA. If Washington DC was just down the coast like San Fran or Portland, I'm a firm believer that about a third of the mob on Jan 6 would have been from those two areas.
Only users lose drugs.
:-)-~~~ 
05-23-2023, 08:03 AM
(05-22-2023, 09:42 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: If you don't mind my asking, what part of the country do you live in? It really is interesting how much your location really impacts this stuff. Especially when it comes to the types of partisans that typically run in your area. Like how a California Democrat wouldn't have much luck in my area, even in the progressive college town I live in.
"A great democracy has got to be progressive, or it will soon cease to be either great or a democracy..." - TR
"The test of our progress is not whether we add more to the abundance of those who have much; it is whether we provide enough for those who have too little." - FDR
05-23-2023, 09:07 AM
(05-22-2023, 07:40 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Based on SSF post maybe it read wrong. You just don’t seem to have any conservative ideology at all. It’s just weird that you were ever a Republican. I’m not doubting you you, it just doesn’t seem to fit. People who quit a party don’t generally go all in for the other party. Like me. I really don’t identify with Republicans anymore, but I sure as hell don’t have any love for Democrats. Maybe you are the political version of a person who quit smoking. Political beliefs don’t change overnight. They evolve over time. And in reality, my personal beliefs, especially in these “culture” ideas began to separate from the then mainstream Republican Party some time ago. It just took Mitch McConnell and his block of Merrick Garland to finally say enough is enough. It was at that point I stopped self identifying as a Republican. Something similar occurs for many Catholics. They will self identify themselves as Catholic but if you ask them the last time they went to church, they might say 20 or 30 years. For me the gradual liberalization came from exposure to a wide range of people while working in the hospitality industry. Meeting, talking to, and working with immigrants, both documented and undocumented, changes perspectives. Actually talking to people from all over the world who were refugees from war, famine, political unrest, natural disasters gives you a far better understanding of their motives and lives than a news report will give you. Meeting and working with people across the spectrum of the LGBTQ community teaches you that deep down they are no different from most of us. They want a home and family, a fulfilling career, and to give back to their community. I had an employee who committed suicide by jumping off the Key Bridge in Washington DC. He had been diagnosed with HIV. His friends told us his religious family would accept suicide easier than finding out he was gay. I found that horrifying. Someone’s religious beliefs should not dictate how anyone else lives their lives. And frankly, the lives of LGBTQ folks should not be kept in turmoil so pandering politicians can score points in their self driven culture wars. Working with genuinely poor people opens you eyes to their realities. 90 minute multi transfer bus rides to work. Can’t work overtime because they have no way to get home. Easily treated medical conditions if caught early turn into serious ones because they have no medical insurance. When every dime you make goes for daily survival, insurance is a luxury. Sadly, for too many hard work can only get them so far. Escaping poverty in today’s world is far more difficult than it used to be. Education is supposed to expose a child to the world. It is not supposed to reinforce a government’s or family’s personal political or religious beliefs. I’ve decided that in America that having a decent roof over your head, healthy food for your family, and healthcare should not be something reserved for the wealthy as it is rapidly moving towards. Problems need to be solved not nursed along to be used for their next political campaign. Like I said, it is a journey not an overnight thing I tell you this because I choose to Fueled by the pursuit of greatness.
05-23-2023, 09:37 AM
(05-22-2023, 03:58 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Why does Clinton get credit and not the Republican Congress? You know, the people in charge of the budget. I agree. Clinton knew he couldn't get anything done on his own and worked with the gop to make some changes...both good and bad. ![[Image: giphy.gif]](https://media0.giphy.com/media/1kwsTjL8BNqlszNtnCE/giphy.gif) Your anger and ego will always reveal your true self.
05-23-2023, 10:41 AM
(05-23-2023, 01:29 AM)Forever Spinning Vinyl Wrote: Alaska (05-23-2023, 08:03 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: It really is interesting how much your location really impacts this stuff. Especially when it comes to the types of partisans that typically run in your area. Like how a California Democrat wouldn't have much luck in my area, even in the progressive college town I live in. These dovetail nicely as the answer from Forever was about what I expected. You live in a deep red state. In an island of blue to be sure, but your state level politics are red. I live in a deep blue state. As Bel pointed out, and anticipated why I asked, regional differences within the party can be rather stark. I firmly believe that when one side becomes too ascendant then their politics go off the deep end. When you no longer have to worry about an ideological opponent you start to out extreme the members of your own party.
05-23-2023, 10:57 AM
(05-23-2023, 09:37 AM)GMDino Wrote: I agree. Clinton knew he couldn't get anything done on his own and worked with the gop to make some changes...both good and bad. compromise...the way government with opposing forces is supposed to work Fueled by the pursuit of greatness.
05-23-2023, 11:17 AM
(05-23-2023, 10:57 AM)pally Wrote: compromise...the way government with opposing forces is supposed to work I agree they can/should compromise on most things. Your anger and ego will always reveal your true self. 
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05-23-2023, 01:48 PM
(05-23-2023, 10:57 AM)pally Wrote: compromise...the way government with opposing forces is supposed to work That's gone mostly out the window, it's b/c both sides fear the other side that's in power to get any credit whatsoever. Gone are the days of John Mccain trying to work across the aisle. We do need term limits in Congress b/c as it is now, there are just way too many old scores to settle and everyone in Congress is out to get one another for a broken promise decades ago. I thought John McCain would have made a great President b/c of his ability to work both sides and get things accomplished. I actually canvassed for him promoting his campaign, and if he picked someone other than Palin he probably would have won it. I've always identified as a left-leaning libertarian and I did vote for Trump in 2016, b/c of his sentiment on the Iraq war. However, I quickly realized what his true intentions were and that was not to be president it's to be an authoritarian dictator. Trump is definitely not a fiscal conservative, and that's what I think ppl were looking for in him. Plus, he's done more damage to our democracy than Xi or Putin could have ever dreamt of doing and this is b/c of his malignant narcissism---a trait possessed by all authoritarians. 
05-23-2023, 02:05 PM
(05-23-2023, 01:48 PM)BIGDADDYFROMCINCINNATI Wrote: That's gone mostly out the window, it's b/c both sides fear the other side that's in power to get any credit whatsoever. Gone are the days of John Mccain trying to work across the aisle. We do need term limits in Congress b/c as it is now, there are just way too many old scores to settle and everyone in Congress is out to get one another for a broken promise decades ago. I remember when McCain was speaking with that voter at the town hall thing and the woman said she's afraid of Obama because he's an Arab and McCain cut her off and said that he wasn't and that he wanted to focus on policy and so on. I had a gf at the time who was a republican and she responded that McCain completely blew it by saying that and Obama was almost a shoe in now. That was the point where I saw an educated republican admit that failing to lie and/or lean into culture war stuff that politicians and smart voters know is a lie but don't care about was harmful to the GOP's election chances. Academically I get it, but the idea that McCain can't say that Obama is NOT a dangerous Arab was a sign where the party was headed. McCain and his style/supporters would eventually become an enemy to the Trumps and Kari Lakes of the world, so that says a lot, too. Gore v McCain in 2000 would have been a more beneficial election in my mind, but thems the breaks. I guess he really was a political fossil who got left behind by the shift of the right wing.
05-23-2023, 02:39 PM
(05-23-2023, 01:48 PM)BIGDADDYFROMCINCINNATI Wrote: That's gone mostly out the window, it's b/c both sides fear the other side that's in power to get any credit whatsoever. Gone are the days of John Mccain trying to work across the aisle. We do need term limits in Congress b/c as it is now, there are just way too many old scores to settle and everyone in Congress is out to get one another for a broken promise decades ago. I really wanted McCain to win in 2000...but the Bush team went dirty. So I voted for him in 2008...but like with Biden, who I wanted to run in 2016, I did feel he was too old to run the second time. Your anger and ego will always reveal your true self. |
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