NY Judge ruled Trump committed fraud

[*ochocincos*]

Judge ruled that Trump has committed fraud by exaggerating his assets in financial statements.
This is in NY AG Leticia James' civil case.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/other/donald-trump-and-his-company-repeatedly-violated-fraud-law-n-y-judge-rules/ar-AA1hiVfh

Me getting ready to see all these incoming guilty verdicts in the coming months.

[*pally*]

so first they were found liable for charity fraud and now business fraud. Of course, they settled the earlier fraud case against Trump University. Seems a pattern of behavior

Donald and Trump Organization get the business death penalty

<blockquote class="twitter-tweet"><p lang="en" dir="ltr">Correct, <a href="https://twitter.com/AndrewFeinberg?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">@AndrewFeinberg</a>. The judge has ordered cancellation of all [NYS] business certs of &quot;any entity controlled or beneficially owned by Donald J. Trump, Donald Trump, Jr, Eric Trump, Alan Weisselberg, &amp; Jeffrey McConney. An independent receiver will manage the dissolutions. <a href="https://t.co/mK0vkzQXon">https://t.co/mK0vkzQXon</a></p>&mdash; Elizabeth de la Vega (@Delavegalaw) <a href="https://twitter.com/Delavegalaw/status/1706774869281579191?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw">September 26, 2023</a></blockquote>

[basballguy]

Headline:  Donald Trump liable for fraud

"If I am reading this right, Donald Trump committed fraud"

Well, sir, you aren't reading it right then.

Small nuance, but poor journalism...as usual from these guys.  

[*Nately120*]

(09-26-2023, 08:07 PM)basballguy Wrote: Headline:  Donald Trump liable for fraud

"If I am reading this right, Donald Trump committed fraud"

Well, sir, you aren't reading it right then.

Small nuance, but poor journalism...as usual from these guys.  

We are talking about a country that has executed a 14 year old, here.

[Luvnit2]

Yes, liberal NY judge ruled against Trump's COMPANY and not against the person Donald trump.

There may be guilty verdicts coming, but if so, they will be appealed and nothing decided in any case until 2025 or 2026.

If anyone feels Trump is being persecuted by a liberal weaponized DOJ and FBI, please vote for Trump in 2024 so he can clean up our justice system when he gets back into the white house. He will also address the staggering high inflation since Biden took office, address getting gas prices down and get us energy independent again. He will also send home millions of illegal immigrants who soon be the cause of overall wages lower in the US.

Illegal immigrants are working for less than minimum wage off the books and will be working (at least 1 million as Biden give them work permits) at minimum wage in 2024, the impact will be it will lower starting wages in the service industry and all industries. Illegal immigrants will be putting our citizens out of work and like I said lower average wages in the US as inflation continues to rise due to high energy and gas costs.

[*Nately120*]

(09-26-2023, 09:07 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Illegal immigrants will be putting our citizens out of work

Not me, my job requires citizenship.

[Millhouse]

(09-26-2023, 09:07 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Yes, liberal NY judge ruled against Trump's COMPANY and not against the person Donald trump.

There may be guilty verdicts coming, but if so, they will be appealed and nothing decided in any case until 2025 or 2026.

If anyone feels Trump is being persecuted by a liberal weaponized DOJ and FBI, please vote for Trump in 2024 so he can clean up our justice system when he gets back into the white house. He will also address the staggering high inflation since Biden took office, address getting gas prices down and get us energy independent again. He will also send home millions of illegal immigrants who soon be the cause of overall wages lower in the US.

Illegal immigrants are working for less than minimum wage off the books and will be working (at least 1 million as Biden give them work permits) at minimum wage in 2024, the impact will be it will lower starting wages in the service industry and all industries. Illegal immigrants will be putting our citizens out of work and like I said lower average  wages in the US as inflation continues to rise due to high energy and gas costs.

I'd rather go vegan than vote for that fraud. But any other Republican that is half way decent gets my vote over Biden.

[*pally*]

(09-26-2023, 09:07 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Yes, liberal NY judge ruled against Trump's COMPANY and not against the person Donald trump.

There may be guilty verdicts coming, but if so, they will be appealed and nothing decided in any case until 2025 or 2026.

If anyone feels Trump is being persecuted by a liberal weaponized DOJ and FBI, please vote for Trump in 2024 so he can clean up our justice system when he gets back into the white house. He will also address the staggering high inflation since Biden took office, address getting gas prices down and get us energy independent again. He will also send home millions of illegal immigrants who soon be the cause of overall wages lower in the US.

Illegal immigrants are working for less than minimum wage off the books and will be working (at least 1 million as Biden give them work permits) at minimum wage in 2024, the impact will be it will lower starting wages in the service industry and all industries. Illegal immigrants will be putting our citizens out of work and like I said lower average  wages in the US as inflation continues to rise due to high energy and gas costs.

Incorrect, he ruled Donald, Donald Jr, and Eric committed fraud as well as the company.  This action was taken by the New York Attorney General's office which is a separate entity from the federal DOJ and FBI.

If Trump is going to commit politically motivated crimes then yes the prosecution of those crimes might seem politically motivated.  Why is it ok to commit politically motivated crimes but not be prosecuted for them?

[Mike M (the other one)]

(09-27-2023, 10:19 AM)pally Wrote: Incorrect, he ruled Donald, Donald Jr, and Eric committed fraud as well as the company.  This action was taken by the New York Attorney General's office which is a separate entity from the federal DOJ and FBI.

If Trump is going to commit politically motivated crimes then yes the prosecution of those crimes might seem politically motivated.  Why is it ok to commit politically motivated crimes but not be prosecuted for them?

 So he's already guilty before he even goes to court??
.

[*pally*]

(09-27-2023, 11:05 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote:  So he's already guilty before he even goes to court??
.

The judge gave a summary judgment saying the details were not in dispute...this was his trial.  This was a civil case, not a criminal one so the rules are different.  Trump was found liable not the criminal verdict of guilty. Of course, now if some NY or Federal prosecutor now decides he is criminally guilty of fraud they can file criminal charges against him. 

He settled the Trump University fraud case.  He was found liable for committing fraud while running the Trump Foundation.  The Stormy Daniels case is about fraud.  Many of his 91 charges involve fraudulent activity. And now found he was liable in this case for Fraud.  The man has a long history of fraudulent behavior.  This is more than just smoke surrounding him, it's a raging forest fire and yet somehow he is always a victim.

[LSUfaninTN]

(09-27-2023, 10:19 AM)pally Wrote: Incorrect, he ruled Donald, Donald Jr, and Eric committed fraud as well as the company.  This action was taken by the New York Attorney General's office which is a separate entity from the federal DOJ and FBI.

If Trump is going to commit politically motivated crimes then yes the prosecution of those crimes might seem politically motivated.  Why is it ok to commit politically motivated crimes but not be prosecuted for them?

This is just a radical liberal judge wanting Donald Trump to spend money on everything but his campaign. Trump will argue that he made the valuations in good faith based on his advisors, and that the loans were given to him primarily based on his overall financial strength. This will get thrown out. 

I’d also be willing to be 90% of Democrats don’t realize all of this is a civil case and they just read the headline. 

[*pally*]

(09-27-2023, 11:54 AM)LSUfaninTN Wrote: This is just a radical liberal judge wanting Donald Trump to spend money on everything but his campaign. Trump will argue that he made the valuations in good faith based on his advisors, and that the loans were given to him primarily based on his overall financial strength. This will get thrown out. 

I’d also be willing to be 90% of Democrats don’t realize all of this is a civil case and they just read the headline. 

how much in back property taxes do you think he owes the state and city of New York because of his illegal valuation schemes?0

[*ochocincos*]

(09-27-2023, 11:54 AM)LSUfaninTN Wrote: This is just a radical liberal judge wanting Donald Trump to spend money on everything but his campaign. Trump will argue that he made the valuations in good faith based on his advisors, and that the loans were given to him primarily based on his overall financial strength. This will get thrown out. 

I’d also be willing to be 90% of Democrats don’t realize all of this is a civil case and they just read the headline. 

I'm not necessarily meaning to target you specifically with what I'm about to say, but we're hearing every excuse/conspiracy theory in the book in order to defend Trump on all these things.

Trump constantly posting online and making comments at his events are getting his supporters bought into what he says as being the reason all these things are happening.


Is it really not possible that he has actually done ANY of these things he's being accused of and every single person is out to get him?
I really don't believe that's the case.


I think Trump has gotten away with things like this for years, and things are finally catching up to him, so he's trying to cry saying it's a "witch hunt" and "politically motivated."


If we can't trust the court system, there's essentially no reason to have law and order.
Are people magically going to start trusting the courts if Trump is back in office, but not now?
That wouldn't make any logical sense.

The way I see it (and I realize not everyone will agree) is Trump has been a master manipulator his whole life.
I just would like to see Trump actually prove his theories, as he and his camp really haven't had any concrete proof of their claims in many/most of the things he whines about.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(09-27-2023, 06:42 PM)pally Wrote: how much in back property taxes do you think he owes the state and city of New York because of his illegal valuation schemes?0

If it's like any other state, the Property Tax is based on the purchase price, not how much it's worth currently.

[Belsnickel]

(09-28-2023, 11:53 AM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: If it's like any other state, the Property Tax is based on the purchase price, not how much it's worth currently.

Where is that?!

Everywhere I know, and I used to file property taxes in over 100 different localities, property taxes are based on current valuations.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(09-28-2023, 10:12 AM)ochocincos Wrote: I think Trump has gotten away with things like this for years, and things are finally catching up to him, so he's trying to cry saying it's a "witch hunt" and "politically motivated."


The way I see it (and I realize not everyone will agree) is Trump has been a master manipulator his whole life.
I just would like to see Trump actually prove his theories, as he and his camp really haven't had any concrete proof of their claims in many/most of the things he whines about.

Of course he is, he's been playing the media for a long time now. As far as consequences for his actions?? that's for normal people. He's not used to their being consequences for his actions. Up to now he's likely been able to "buy" his way out of them via courts etc. We'll see how it goes for now though. But him getting nailed isn't something i'd hold my breath on.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(09-28-2023, 12:31 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Where is that?!

Everywhere I know, and I used to file property taxes in over 100 different localities, property taxes are based on current valuations.

What it's appraised at and could sell for are 2 different things.

What Trump values it is what HE would be willing to sell it for and that is not the same as it's actual appraised value.
If banks gave him loans on HIS valued price then they are ignorant for not doing their jobs properly.

And most properties are updated at sale date and use an effective tax rate that slowly increases, and doesn't usually get fully updated for 3-6 years after.
If they over value it, you can file a "Complaint against Valuation". And definitely don't plan any major upgrades til after it's been valued by an assessor and always walk thru with the assessor, he's paid to see the shiny things IE new marble counter tops, and won't mark the crack in the basement walls that lowers your value unless you are there to point it out.

[*pally*]

(09-28-2023, 01:42 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: What it's appraised at and could sell for are 2 different things.

What Trump values it is what HE would be willing to sell it for and that is not the same as it's actual appraised value.
If banks gave him loans on HIS valued price then they are ignorant for not doing their jobs properly.

And most properties are updated at sale date and use an effective tax rate that slowly increases, and doesn't usually get fully updated for 3-6 years after.
If they over value it, you can file a "Complaint against Valuation". And definitely don't plan any major upgrades til after it's been valued by an assessor and always walk thru with the assessor, he's paid to see the shiny things IE new marble counter tops, and won't mark the crack in the basement walls that lowers your value unless you are there to point it out.

So it's the victim's fault they were defrauded?  

When Trump submitted falsified valuations that included knowingly incorrect square footage (eg:his penthouse was listed at 3x is actual size), occupation rates, or collected rents he committed fraud regardless of the actions of the people receiving the documents.  Every loan application I ever signed required a signature that the information provided was truthful and subject to punishment if falsified

Trump did point out that his properties were valued at what he said because he could call up Saudia Arabia and get it sold at whatever he asked.  The Judge said that was influence peddling.

[Belsnickel]

(09-28-2023, 01:42 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: What it's appraised at and could sell for are 2 different things.

What Trump values it is what HE would be willing to sell it for and that is not the same as it's actual appraised value.
If banks gave him loans on HIS valued price then they are ignorant for not doing their jobs properly.

And most properties are updated at sale date and use an effective tax rate that slowly increases, and doesn't usually get fully updated for 3-6 years after.
If they over value it, you can file a "Complaint against Valuation". And definitely don't plan any major upgrades til after it's been valued by an assessor and always walk thru with the assessor, he's paid to see the shiny things IE new marble counter tops, and won't mark the crack in the basement walls that lowers your value unless you are there to point it out.

Eh, no, that's not typically how it works. Most localities have an assessor's office that actually does valuations each year that the property tax is based off of. For business personal property tax, it is based on the current value of the assets in the business which is usually net depreciation.

[GreenDragon]

(09-26-2023, 08:07 PM)basballguy Wrote: Headline:  Donald Trump liable for fraud

"If I am reading this right, Donald Trump committed fraud"

Well, sir, you aren't reading it right then.

Small nuance, but poor journalism...as usual from these guys.  

"Donald Trump and his company "repeatedly" violated fraud law, N.Y. judge rules"