New Air Force One refrigerators to cost nearly $24 million

[GMDino]

http://www.foxnews.com/travel/2018/01/26/new-air-force-one-refrigerators-to-cost-nearly-24-million.html

Quote:It costs to be cool aboard Air Force One: The president's official plane is being outfitted with a new refrigeration system to the tune of almost $24 million in taxpayer dollars.


According to the Department of Defense contract notice, the U.S. Air Force awarded Boeing $23,657,671 to replace two "chillers," or refrigerators, on the plane in December 2017. Defense One notes that though the astronomical sum may seem like price-gouging by the aircraft manufacturer, it’s in fact the complex requirements instated by the White House Military Office and the Air Force that require such a pricey job.


Further, the jumbo jet requires quite the serious refrigeration system, far beyond typical first class amenities. As the plane itself is a mobile command station for the President, the aircraft must be able to feed passengers and crew for weeks at a time without resupplying in the event of an emergency, storing about 3,000 meals in massive cooling units below the passenger cabin, Travel + Leisure notes.

“Although serviced on a regular basis, reliability has decreased with failures increasing, especially in hot/humid environments,” Air Force spokesman Ann Stefanek told Defense One.

The high-tech fridges have not been updated since 1990.  (Reuters)
Though the fridges use “available industry technology,” Stefanek said that they’re only part of the total cost. “The engineering required to design, manufacture, conduct environmental testing and obtain Federal Aviation Administration certification are included in the cost,” as many contractors who work on the Air Force One jets are also required to have high-level security clearances.

The current refrigerators aboard Air Force One are 27 years old, and have not been updated since 1990. The new chillers are expected to be installed by October 2019.

Despite his known penchant for chilled Diet Coke, President Donald Trump has previously criticized the sky-high sums needed to keep presidential aircraft up and running. In December 2016, he threatened to cancel the construction of two new 747 Air Force One jets for official use as the “costs are out of control."

[url=http://www.foxbusiness.com/markets/2016/12/06/trump-tweets-cancel-order-on-boeings-new-air-force-one-because-costs-are-out-control.html][/url]

[Au165]

It is expensive to do anything custom in the aviation world, so it doesn't bother me or shock me. This is actually a relatively important requirement in the event of some sort of attack requiring Air force One to become a mobile command center they will need to make sure they can keep food stored for long periods of time.

[*Nately120*]

If you would have asked me how a series of refrigerators could cost $24 million dollars I probably would have guessed they dispense diamonds instead of ice, or something stupid like that.

(01-30-2018, 04:23 PM)Au165 Wrote: It is expensive to do anything custom in the aviation world, so it doesn't bother me or shock me. This is actually a relatively important requirement in the event of some sort of attack requiring Air force One to become a mobile command center they will need to make sure they can keep food stored for long periods of time.

It says the current fridges on air force one haven't been updated since 1990.  I guess we're lucky no one has wanted to do us harm in the past 27 years, eh? I guess I'm just out to get Trump, but I do find it interesting that refrigerators that were good enough for the other guys just don't hold up to the scrutiny of the only president who came from a golden penthouse.

[GMDino]

(01-30-2018, 04:23 PM)Au165 Wrote: It is expensive to do anything custom in the aviation world, so it doesn't bother me or shock me. This is actually a relatively important requirement in the event of some sort of attack requiring Air force One to become a mobile command center they will need to make sure they can keep food stored for long periods of time.

I understand there are very specific requirements.  $12 million a piece still sounds pretty steep.  

I'm certain the POTUS will negotiate it down though.  

[Au165]

(01-30-2018, 04:39 PM)GMDino Wrote: I understand there are very specific requirements.  $12 million a piece still sounds pretty steep.  

I'm certain the POTUS will negotiate it down though.  

Have you ever asked an aero space engineer and their firm to design and then produce a one off piece of specialty equipment that has to fit inside the bounds of a nearly 30 year old enviroment? As noted by the article federal aviation regulation testing is also part of this cost as well which is not a cheap thing to do. You have to make sure the specialized one off system isn't going to potentially be a hazard in various conditions. 

The uniqueness of the requirements for Air Force One tend to make me give them a pass on cost. 

[*michaelsean*]

(01-30-2018, 04:35 PM)Nately120 Wrote: If you would have asked me how a series of refrigerators could cost $24 million dollars I probably would have guessed they dispense diamonds instead of ice, or something stupid like that.



It says the current fridges on air force one haven't been updated since 1990.  I guess we're lucky no one has wanted to do us harm in the past 27 years, eh?  I guess I'm just out to get Trump, but I do find it interesting that refrigerators that were good enough for the other guys just don't hold up to the scrutiny of the only president who came from a golden penthouse.

I don't think he makes the call on these.

[*Nately120*]

(01-31-2018, 10:10 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I don't think he makes the call on these.

I thought the point of hiring THE businessman in the USA to be the president was that he was going to run the county like  a business.  I can see why the politicians who came before him wouldn't care about negotiating prices and making deals, but I think Mr. the art of the deal could have taken some time to save the taxpayers some money on this one.

[GMDino]

(01-31-2018, 10:10 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I don't think he makes the call on these.

He said he would.  Well, he said he would "instruct" people to save money.  Mind you, same guy with a solid gold apartment.  And not the fun dancing kind.

(01-31-2018, 10:14 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I thought the point of hiring THE businessman in the USA to be the president was that he was going to run the county like  a business.  I can see why the politicians who came before him wouldn't care about negotiating prices and making deals, but I think Mr. the art of the deal could have taken some time to save the taxpayers some money on this one.

Technically he IS running it like his business.  He tells everyone else to work while he golfs.  then he slaps his name on it.  When it fails he just denies it every happened.  When it works he takes full credit.

[Au165]

(01-31-2018, 10:14 AM)Nately120 Wrote: I thought the point of hiring THE businessman in the USA to be the president was that he was going to run the county like  a business.  I can see why the politicians who came before him wouldn't care about negotiating prices and making deals, but I think Mr. the art of the deal could have taken some time to save the taxpayers some money on this one.

Again, specialized Airplane design and fabrication costs no matter what aren't cheap. I am a huge Trump critic but this really isn't even an issue to anyone that understands how expensive anything in this realm is. This is about optics and being painted as "oh they are just refrigerators". If they were replacing something you had never heard of on an airplane no one would blink, but the reality is people think it should be cheap because they see the word refrigerator. Work on the planes can only be done by people with high level security clearance, which means these engineers aren't even your normal expensive aero space engineers they are even more expensive aero space engineers. They then must build prototypes to retrofit to 30 year old technology and then those must meet current department of defense testing standards for military aircraft. 

Industry experts have already come out and basically said there is nothing weird about this. 

[*Nately120*]

(01-31-2018, 10:27 AM)Au165 Wrote: Again, specialized Airplane design and fabrication costs no matter what aren't cheap. I am a huge Trump critic but this really isn't even an issue to anyone that understands how expensive anything in this realm is. This is about optics and being painted as "oh they are just refrigerators". If they were replacing something you had never heard of on an airplane no one would blink, but the reality is people think it should be cheap because they see the word refrigerator. Work on the planes can only be done by people with high level security clearance, which means these engineers aren't even your normal expensive aero space engineers they are even more expensive aero space engineers. They then must build prototypes to retrofit to 30 year old technology and then those must meet current department of defense testing standards for military aircraft. 

Industry experts have already come out and basically said there is nothing weird about this. 

Look, I'm playing devil's advocate here.  I'm a marketing guy and I'm more interested in the way people perceive things and how that drives their behavior.  I say this sort of scenario, if presented to a Trump fan before the election or now, would have been viewed as one where a career politician would have just passed along the max cost to the taxpayers with no care about the price, because that's what politicians do.

Trump would have fostered competition between bidders and used the free-market and his own skill as the best businessman in the world to save the taxpayers money.  That's the perception, and that's why this country needed THE businessman in charge, rather than just another tax-blowing, no-bid contract-loving politician.

You get it.  You know how this stuff works, but the consumer base doesn't.  It doesn't matter in the end though, because even the people who think Trump could have used "business" to save the taxpayers money would excuse it by saying that he's too busy defeating ISIS to waste time on refrigerator deals.

[Au165]

(01-31-2018, 10:48 AM)Nately120 Wrote: Look, I'm playing devil's advocate here.  I'm a marketing guy and I'm more interested in the way people perceive things and how that drives their behavior.  I say this sort of scenario, if presented to a Trump fan before the election or now, would have been viewed as one where a career politician would have just passed along the max cost to the taxpayers with no care about the price, because that's what politicians do.

Trump would have fostered competition between bidders and used the free-market and his own skill as the best businessman in the world to save the taxpayers money.  That's the perception, and that's why this country needed THE businessman in charge, rather than just another tax-blowing, no-bid contract-loving politician.

You get it.  You know how this stuff works, but the consumer base doesn't.  It doesn't matter in the end though, because even the people who think Trump could have used "business" to save the taxpayers money would excuse it by saying that he's too busy defeating ISIS to waste time on refrigerator deals.

I am actually a marketing guy too, glad to know I'm not alone here! My background is in business development and marketing around technology and security in the government sector, so I have some knowledge of how all this works. There was a fallacy coming in by Trump and his supporters that the federal government easily works inside of the "free-market". In this specific case for example it isn't a free market as this is a sole source project being there are limited people with the correct skill set, clearance and knowledge to accomplish this task. This is somewhat common in high level government purchasing because it tends to be riddled with special requests on niche items.

From the public perception stand point you are right this plays bad in the media. I was more so trying to take the middle ground position here to try and be a balanced voice on this particular subject.

[BmorePat87]

3,000 meals on hand. Damn!