No Charges Prison For Guards Who Allegedly Boiled Schizophrenic Black Man to Death

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(03-19-2017, 09:08 PM)treee Wrote: Yea, you're right that it is important to shine a light on those types of injustices. I guess the question becomes where is the line between exposing injustice and pushing a narrative? This isn't directed at you, by the way. This is something that anyone who consumes news should be asking themselves, imo.

That line is about a hundred miles to your six, it was crossed long ago.  Of course, to some on this board pointing this out somehow calls your integrity into question.  The truth is that racial tension equals clicks, hence the title.  The fact that stoking said racial tension does absolutely no one any good, especially in stories in which race hasn't been shown to play a part in the event's cause, simply hardens the stances of the people on the fringes and drives more people in the middle towards those fringes.  You'll notice some people have complained about the topic being brought up but those complaining haven't addressed points made in the thread that don't have anything to do with race.


As to the thread topic, if the events are as described then it would be staggering that no charges are being filed, of any kind.  So, either the DA in a very liberal part of the country is super soft on abuse of power by sworn peace officers (which goes completely against the current trend in this country) or there is quite a bit more to the story than is being reported in OP's article.

[Matt_Crimson]

Personally I never really like when people say "they're trying to make this about race" or "this is about race" because it's an assertion that claims to know the personal feelings or actual motives of the people involved, when in truth you never really know unless it's blatantly obvious. Now I'm not saying that you can't or cannot argue whether something is or isn't about race, but rather that I find it a bit pointless to make the assertion that it absolutely is or absolutely isn't when it's not made explicitly clear. People take issue with these kinds of articles all the time that include "black man" or whatever race in the title.

But what's more concerning to me is not the way the articles are titled, but instead what is reported in the articles themselves, because articles don't necessarily tell the entire story and can actually make it seem less or more about race when it really could have been about anything else. At the end of the day, people will decide to believe what they want to believe based on their own reasoning skills. I guess ALL I'm saying is, is that it's better to lay out the argument of why something is or isn't about race, rather than try to sway people by just saying "they're trying to make this about race" or "this is about race" because those assertions are just really another way of saying 'I'm right you're wrong" and then people start accusing each other of being racist just from an article title.

[*bfine32*]

(03-19-2017, 08:03 PM)treee Wrote: I guess it is made about race if you only read the headline and not the actual article. 

Or if you choose that one to link. Did you do as I asked and just put the victim's name in your search engine and see how far you had to go until you found a link that mentioned color in the title?

I used Google and Yahoo and made it through 3 pages each and still didn't see one. Of course data mining could play a role. I imagine if you don't include race in many of your searches; they won't be near the top. Hell it could have been the first one the OP saw. 

[treee]

(03-19-2017, 09:49 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: That line is about a hundred miles to your six, it was crossed long ago.  Of course, to some on this board pointing this out somehow calls your integrity into question.  The truth is that racial tension equals clicks, hence the title.  The fact that stoking said racial tension does absolutely no one any good, especially in stories in which race hasn't been shown to play a part in the event's cause, simply hardens the stances of the people on the fringes and drives more people in the middle towards those fringes.  You'll notice some people have complained about the topic being brought up but those complaining haven't addressed points made in the thread that don't have anything to do with race.

I don't think the descriptor of "black man" in the title in an 800 word story which focuses only on facts of the case is "trivializing it by making it about race" though. Seems like a bit of a stretch to me.

(03-19-2017, 09:49 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: As to the thread topic, if the events are as described then it would be staggering that no charges are being filed, of any kind.  So, either the DA in a very liberal part of the country is super soft on abuse of power by sworn peace officers (which goes completely against the current trend in this country) or there is quite a bit more to the story than is being reported in OP's article.

DA's being soft on agents of the justice system throughout the country has been an issue, so I would say the face value of the story is possibly is true.

[*bfine32*]

(03-19-2017, 08:25 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Looks like he copied that bit from the article title, tbh. Though, in truth, one must ask why the editor of the Miami New Times chose to include it in their title.

Of course he copied from the title. He does not have a monopoly on this tactic. Have you researched the Miami New Times? If you do then you will easily see why they chose to include it their title. They're a junk rag and they know what gets clicks. 

[treee]

(03-19-2017, 10:14 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Of course he copied from the title. He does not have a monopoly on this tactic. Have you researched the Miami New Times? If you do then you will easily see why they chose to include it their title. They're a junk rag and they know what gets clicks. 

Title aside, what about the actual article itself would you say makes it a "junk rag"? It seemed decently written to me.

[*bfine32*]

(03-19-2017, 10:12 PM)treee Wrote: I don't think the descriptor of "black man" in the title in an 800 word story which focuses only on facts of the case is "trivializing it by making it about race" though. Seems like a bit of a stretch to me.

Being as you are thinking: Why do you think it was in the title. why do you think the OP chose that particular article to link, and what do you think skin color has to do with the events?

[treee]

(03-19-2017, 10:17 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Being as you are thinking: Why do you think it was in the title. why do you think the OP chose that particular article to link, and what do you think skin color has to do with the events?

It could be in the title for any number of reasons. xxlt made a valid point that the included degree of information is subjective and to get hung up on one word in the title seems a bit out of line for having a discussion about the actual content. The OP probably chose that particular article because they have no issues with questioning the authority of the justice system, and it concerned them. There's no telling what skin color has to do with the events. That's probably why the article focused on other aspects aside from skin color.

[*bfine32*]

(03-19-2017, 10:22 PM)treee Wrote: It could be in the title for any number of reasons. 

Right about there is when I stopped. 

[treee]

(03-19-2017, 10:26 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Right about there is when I stopped. 

Just like with the thread title. I see a pattern. 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(03-19-2017, 10:12 PM)treee Wrote: I don't think the descriptor of "black man" in the title in an 800 word story which focuses only on facts of the case is "trivializing it by making it about race" though. Seems like a bit of a stretch to me.

You must have missed the part of my post were I used the term "click bait", because you just described it to a tee.

Quote:DA's being soft on agents of the justice system throughout the country has been an issue, so I would say the face value of the story is possibly is true.

It has been an issue, sure.  Has it not been an issue discussed almost incessantly in the past three years or so?  That being the case, and the fact that the DA in this instance is both an elected official and in one of the most liberal parts of the country, I find it far less likely for this to be one of those instances.  I could be wrong, but logic certainly doesn't incline me to believe so.

[treee]

(03-19-2017, 10:28 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: You must have missed the part of my post were I used the term "click bait", because you just described it to a tee.

I must misunderstand the concept of click bait entirely, because substantive articles generally aren't considered click bait from my definition.

(03-19-2017, 10:28 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: It has been an issue, sure.  Has it not been an issue discussed almost incessantly in the past three years or so?  That being the case, and the fact that the DA in this instance is both an elected official and in one of the most liberal parts of the country, I find it far less likely for this to be one of those instances.  I could be wrong, but logic certainly doesn't incline me to believe so.

I get the logic behind your assertion, but as GM pointed out: "It seems the person who made the decision to not charge anyone has never charged an officer.  I'd think you would at least in 20+ years seen a officer go to trial to determine innocence once or twice.". It seems that it's either a statistic anomaly or the DA isn't doing their job at holding their components of the justice system responsible.

[*bfine32*]

(03-19-2017, 10:27 PM)treee Wrote: Just like with the thread title. I see a pattern. 

You are correct and the fact that you find that amusing is quite telling. I did read other accounts of the incident whose goal was to focus on what happened to include a local news station that included video. 

I freely admit I didn't get my news of the story from a free tabloid using click bait to draw in those with an agenda that most likely gets all its clicks by using data mining and populating the pages of those that they know are "interested" in such things. 

[*bfine32*]

(03-19-2017, 10:33 PM)treee Wrote: I must misunderstand the concept of click bait entirely, because substantive articles generally aren't considered click bait from my definition.

Well at least you admit it. 

[treee]

(03-19-2017, 10:36 PM)bfine32 Wrote: You are correct and the fact that you find that amusing is quite telling. I did read other accounts of the incident whose goal was to focus on what happened to include a local news station that included video. 

Well? What is the Herald missing then? Where is the junk rag evidence within the story? 

[treee]

(03-19-2017, 10:38 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Well at least you admit it. 

And with this you just placed yourself in the "Fredtoast" grouping of people who like to instigate instead of having discussions. But that was evident with the first post you made in the thread, wasn't it?

[Belsnickel]

(03-19-2017, 10:33 PM)treee Wrote: I must misunderstand the concept of click bait entirely, because substantive articles generally aren't considered click bait from my definition.

Creating a title that sensationalizes the story, such as this title does, is an attempt by the editorial staff to gain traffic. Those snippets to grab your attention are what I would consider click bait.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(03-19-2017, 11:22 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Creating a title that sensationalizes the story, such as this title does, is an attempt by the editorial staff to gain traffic. Those snippets to grab your attention are what I would consider click bait.

Like including "boiled" in the title when water boils at 212 F at sea level.

He wouldn't be boiled to death, he would be scalded to death. (Admittedly neither are particularly good things to happen.) Boiled to death is much more sensational sounding, of course, so into the title it goes.

[treee]

(03-19-2017, 11:53 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: Like including "boiled" in the title when water boils at 212 F at sea level.

He wouldn't be boiled to death, he would be scalded to death. (Admittedly neither are particularly good things to happen.) Boiled to death is much more sensational sounding, of course, so into the title it goes.

"Man allegedly left under 180 degree Fahrenheit water until it caused his death" is a little wordy I suppose.

(03-19-2017, 11:53 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Creating a title that sensationalizes the story, such as this title does, is an attempt by the editorial staff to gain traffic. Those snippets to grab your attention are what I would consider click bait.

The only incorrect portion of the title is by the technical definition of the term "boils", which doesn't seem that egregious considering it's used informally quite often. I understand what you're saying, but the reason I don't like calling it click bait is because the information actually is shocking. I mean how much can you really sensationalize a story as horrible as that? For a nurse to say your skin peels off at touch? That's pretty extreme.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(03-20-2017, 12:08 AM)treee Wrote: "Man allegedly left under 180 degree Fahrenheit water until it caused his death" is a little wordy I suppose.

"Rundle Won't Charge Prison Guards Who Allegedly Boiled Schizophrenic Black Man to Death"

...to...

"Rundle Won't Charge Prison Guards Who Allegedly Scalded Prisoner To Death"



....Yes, I can see how horribly wordy it would be to make it less click-baity.