Notre Dame Cathedral

[*michaelsean*]

I've actually had to work all day so I just saw this. That's just awful. Among the most beautiful buildings in the world just burning like that. My sympathies to Arturo B, but really to the whole world.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

Truly horrifying.  You all know I'm not religious at all, but I've been in that building a few times and it is awe inspiring.  A humbling work of art and culture.  I've heard suggestions that the fire was intentional, I honestly hope that's not true.  It's awful enough as is, if someone did it on purpose... it's a sickening thought.

[CKwi88]

Wow, last year had Brazil's National Museum Fire, now Notre Dame. Terrible.

[Vas Deferens]

Ditto SSF. It’s an amazing sight to behold in person.

While I’m confident it will be rebuilt. I’m afraid the world just doesn’t have craftsmen capable of this level of detail and quality anymore.

[CJD]

(04-15-2019, 07:45 PM)Vas Deferens Wrote: Ditto SSF.  It’s an amazing sight to behold in person.

While I’m confident it will be rebuilt.  I’m afraid the world just doesn’t have craftsmen capable of this level of detail and quality anymore.

I don't know about that. We're more advanced technologically than they were in the 12th century. At the absolute worst, craftsmen should be able to recreate what was lost.

I think the reason you don't see buildings like the Cathedral of Notre Dame built anymore is because of the cost of beauty and art (which is harder to justify when everything is being optimized for profit in the modern age of architecture). 

If you gave an architect a budget for artistic vision, I see no reason why they'd not be able to come up with something as beautiful today.

[GMDino]

(04-16-2019, 08:54 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: I don't know about that. We're more advanced technologically than they were in the 12th century. At the absolute worst, craftsmen should be able to recreate what was lost.

I think the reason you don't see buildings like the Cathedral of Notre Dame built anymore is because of the cost of beauty and art (which is harder to justify when everything is being optimized for profit in the modern age of architecture). 

If you gave an architect a budget for artistic vision, I see no reason why they'd not be able to come up with something as beautiful today.

I agree.  We COULD make beautiful things but that costs more than making boring things that we can "optimize for profit".

Seems they saved most (all) of the treasurers there though.  That is a good thing!

[Belsnickel]

(04-16-2019, 08:59 AM)GMDino Wrote: I agree.  We COULD make beautiful things but that costs more than making boring things that we can "optimize for profit".

Seems they saved most (all) of the treasurers there though.  That is a good thing!

The picture of the candles still burning that had been lit by visitors before the fire was a heartwarming scene.

[hollodero]

(04-15-2019, 06:46 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I've heard suggestions that the fire was intentional, I honestly hope that's not true.

Seems to be an accident, not an attack or anything like that. I'm confident it will be rebuilt and stay a mgnificent building.

Maybe the floor needed more raking and there also was a clear failure to waterbomb the building, but that's rather sloppy than malicious.

[*michaelsean*]

(04-16-2019, 09:20 AM)hollodero Wrote: Seems to be an accident, not an attack or anything like that. I'm confident it will be rebuilt and stay a mgnificent building.

Maybe the floor needed more raking and there also was a clear failure to waterbomb the building, but that's rather sloppy than malicious.

I don't know if he was suggesting an attack as much as some POS being a POS which unfortunately is believable.  But yeah it seems to be linked to the work being done on it.

[hollodero]

(04-16-2019, 09:28 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I don't know if he was suggesting an attack as much as some POS being a POS which unfortunately is believable.

Well... that POS would carry out an attack in my view, but semantics sure isn't on my side in this weird language of yours. 
It's unfortunate that in such events, the first thought often is "oh, that probably was a muslim terror deed", which sadly is true more often than not. I'm happy it's likely not in that case.

---
Also, Trump is such an idiot. "Must act quickly", well thanks for this valuable input, the French would probably just have watched indecisively for days without that expertise. I'm sure he knows more than anyone about fire too. Still, bombing water on the building would be just destructive and why can't this man just keep his mouth shut for once if he has no clue. Really, why.

[*michaelsean*]

(04-16-2019, 09:44 AM)hollodero Wrote: Well... that POS would carry out an attack in my view, but semantics sure isn't on my side in this weird language of yours. 
It's unfortunate that in such events, the first thought often is "oh, that probably was a muslim terror deed", which sadly is true more often than not. I'm happy it's likely not in that case.

---
Also, Trump is such an idiot. "Must act quickly", well thanks for this valuable input, the French would probably just have watched indecisively for days without that expertise. I'm sure he knows more than anyone about fire too. Still, bombing water on the building would be just destructive and why can't this man just keep his mouth shut for once if he has no clue. Really, why.

You guys divide your inanimate objects into chicks and dudes so whatever.

 Yeah technically I suppose it would be an attack, but when I think "attack" I would think political or religious, and not some arsonist who wants to set anhistorical building on fire for the sake of setting an historical building on fire.  

[hollodero]

(04-16-2019, 09:54 AM)michaelsean Wrote: You guys divide your inanimate objects into chicks and dudes so whatever.

Chicks, dudes and neuter things even. A woman is chick, but a girl is a thing.

(04-16-2019, 09:54 AM)michaelsean Wrote:  Yeah technically I suppose it would be an attack, but when I think "attack" I would think political or religious, and not some arsonist who wants to set anhistorical building on fire for the sake of setting an historical building on fire.  

Fair enough. In any case, good that it was probably an accident. Still I worry a bit, for as a civilization player I know Notre Dame brought 4 faith and 10 happiness to the empire. They will have to build coliseums all over the place to make up for that.

[Bengalzona]

Very tragic.

One good thing: the exterior walls are primarily stone. It can be rebuilt. However, the interior and roof are wasted.

My wife's first thoughts were, "Must be terrorists, eh?". But I guess it was just your old fashioned accidental blaze. Messed up world we live in where that is always in the backs (or fronts) of our minds.

[Bengalzona]

(04-16-2019, 10:05 AM)hollodero Wrote: Still I worry a bit, for as a civilization player I know Notre Dame brought 4 faith and 10 happiness to the empire. They will have to build coliseums all over the place to make up for that.

ikr!

How will I ever make those nuclear weapons without it?!?!

[Vas Deferens]

(04-16-2019, 08:54 AM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: I don't know about that. We're more advanced technologically than they were in the 12th century. At the absolute worst, craftsmen should be able to recreate what was lost.

I think the reason you don't see buildings like the Cathedral of Notre Dame built anymore is because of the cost of beauty and art (which is harder to justify when everything is being optimized for profit in the modern age of architecture). 

If you gave an architect a budget for artistic vision, I see no reason why they'd not be able to come up with something as beautiful today.

Great point, person I'm communicating with digitally; We are more technologically advanced than we were in the 12th century.

There are trades and skillsets which have all but died off and we literally cannot build structures with the same artistry.  Take a look at the detail in this small section of the grand place in Brussels.  We no longer have the tradesmen capable of creating sculptures like this.  Obviously technology could aide in an attempt to replicate it stylistically, but introducing robotics would make it a poor facsimile in my opinion.  



 

[Bengalzona]

(04-16-2019, 09:44 AM)hollodero Wrote: Also, Trump is such an idiot. "Must act quickly", well thanks for this valuable input, the French would probably just have watched indecisively for days without that expertise. I'm sure he knows more than anyone about fire too. Still, bombing water on the building would be just destructive and why can't this man just keep his mouth shut for once if he has no clue. Really, why.

[*michaelsean*]

(04-16-2019, 11:10 AM)Bengalzona Wrote: Very tragic.

One good thing: the exterior walls are primarily stone. It can be rebuilt. However, the interior and roof are wasted.

My wife's first thoughts were, "Must be terrorists, eh?". But I guess it was just your old fashioned accidental blaze. Messed up world we live in where that is always in the backs (or fronts) of our minds.

I don't know.  Your wife is the first person I've seen that suggested terrorism.  I was kind of happy at the lack of jumping to conclusions until some Arizona bumpkins rolled into the thread.  

[Bengalzona]

(04-16-2019, 11:12 AM)Vas Deferens Wrote: Great point, person I'm communicating with digitally; We are more technologically advanced than we were in the 12th century.

There are trades and skillsets which have all but died off and we literally cannot build structures with the same artistry.  Take a look at the detail in this small section of the grand place in Brussels.  We no longer have the tradesmen capable of creating sculptures like this.  Obviously technology could aide in an attempt to replicate it stylistically, but introducing robotics would make it a poor facsimile in my opinion.  



 

They used 52 acres of trees to make the roof at Notre Dame. Each beam was made from a single tree.

[*michaelsean*]

(04-16-2019, 11:12 AM)Vas Deferens Wrote: Great point, person I'm communicating with digitally; We are more technologically advanced than we were in the 12th century.

There are trades and skillsets which have all but died off and we literally cannot build structures with the same artistry.  Take a look at the detail in this small section of the grand place in Brussels.  We no longer have the tradesmen capable of creating sculptures like this.  Obviously technology could aide in an attempt to replicate it stylistically, but introducing robotics would make it a poor facsimile in my opinion.  



 

Yes now sculptures sculpt shapes trying to pretend it's not because they couldn't possibly sculpt any of this.

[Bengalzona]

(04-16-2019, 11:15 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I don't know.  Your wife is the first person I've seen that suggested terrorism.  I was kind of happy at the lack of jumping to conclusions until some Arizona bumpkins rolled into the thread.  

Well, she is European. So you have to take that into consideration.