Oh the humanity..

[Belsnickel]

(08-08-2022, 06:03 PM)basballguy Wrote: Do you really think Border Patrol just became 150% more efficient at their jobs from 2019 to 2022? (increase in the encounters)

I'm just asking why the narrative is that the Biden administration isn't doing their jobs when the numbers being used to say that are evidence of them doing their job...

(08-08-2022, 06:17 PM)hollodero Wrote: I mean, not to take sides in any way, but there is a quite clear argument that an increase in encounters probably has strong correlation to an increase in illegal crossings overall.

Illegal crossings, yes. An increase in individuals? Not necessarily. The evidence on crossings since the implementation of Title 42 has been that more of the border crossers are attempting multiple times and we are seeing more repeat offenders in the numbers.

(08-08-2022, 06:23 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: wtf?

you've been pretty free with your assumptions up to this point, why stop now?

Not really. I'm using information from research on these topics. I've done a class on immigration policy and learned a ton about all of this.

[Dill]

(08-08-2022, 12:14 PM)masonbengals fan Wrote: It would appear you & I have the same question. 

And I appear to have an answer to your last question:

They WOULD NOT intentionally make our border problems worse.

So the next question is--why would someone, without evidence, claim they were intentionally making the problems worse?

[masonbengals fan]

(08-09-2022, 09:48 AM)Dill Wrote: I appear to have an answer as well:

They WOULD NOT intentionally make our border problems worse.

So the next question is--why would someone, without evidence, claim they were intentionally making them worse?

We will have to agree to disagree then. I’m getting used to it.

[Dill]

(08-09-2022, 09:57 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: -why would someone, without evidence, claim [Dems] were intentionally making [border problems] worse?

We will have to agree to disagree then. I’m getting used to it.

You've gotten used to making claims without evidence. 

I have not. And so cannot "agree to disagree" about that.

[masonbengals fan]

(08-09-2022, 10:03 AM)Dill Wrote: You've gotten used to making claims without evidence. 

I have not. And so cannot "agree to disagree" about that.

That’s fine with me. I won’t lose any sleep over it.

[Dill]

(08-09-2022, 10:08 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: That’s fine with me. I won’t lose any sleep over it.

I will. 

Millions are now comfortable "knowing" without evidence.

That makes them more susceptible to demagoguery.

[masonbengals fan]

(08-09-2022, 10:23 AM)Dill Wrote: I will. 

Millions are now comfortable "knowing" without evidence.

That makes them more susceptible to demagoguery.

I'm sure the cartels appreciate you're support. 

[*Nately120*]

(08-09-2022, 10:59 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: I'm sure the cartels appreciate you're support. 

Another aspect of invasive dangerous illegals that are supported by, you guessed it, Americans.  We sure do love encouraging and subsiding this stuff while we beg the government to save us from it. 

We want our cheap exploitable labor and we want our drugs, but geez if we don't simultaneously wish the government would force us to go back to the good ol' days when every American had a job and a single-income household and the only drug you needed were doctor recommended Chesterfields.

[Dill]

(08-09-2022, 10:59 AM)masonbengals fan Wrote: I'm sure the cartels appreciate you're support. 

Just as you are sure Dems "intentionally" create border problems.

Without respect for some evidentiary basis beyond RW rhetoric,
you allow those who control that rhetoric control your vote.

Political analysis is replaced by free association. 

[masonbengals fan]

(08-09-2022, 12:05 PM)Dill Wrote: Just as you are sure Dems "intentionally" create border problems.

Without respect for some evidentiary basis beyond RW rhetoric,
you allow those who control that rhetoric control your vote.

Political analysis is replaced by free association. 

I’ve analyzed the situation for almost 2 years and honestly believe Biden made a bad situation worse. 

Until I see improvements that is my position.

[*Nately120*]

Do we even know how long this guy has been in the USA? The victims were said to have entered the country in 2017, but I haven't found any concrete info on how long he's been here. I bring this up because we got a few "Thanks a lot, Biden" comments in the thread about the illegal who knocked up the girl who needed to leave the state to get an abortion and it turned out he'd been here since 2015.

[Belsnickel]

(08-09-2022, 12:41 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Do we even know how long this guy has been in the USA? The victims were said to have entered the country in 2017, but I haven't found any concrete info on how long he's been here. I bring this up because we got a few "Thanks a lot, Biden" comments in the thread about the illegal who knocked up the girl who needed to leave the state to get an abortion and it turned out he'd been here since 2015.

Pretty much every talking point from the right on immigration is based on faulty logic and a lack of understanding of the issue. Because of its complexity it is easy to do, which is why GOP politicians rely so much on it to fear monger their base.

[*Nately120*]

(08-09-2022, 12:44 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Pretty much every talking point from the right on immigration is based on faulty logic and a lack of understanding of the issue. Because of its complexity it is easy to do, which is why GOP politicians rely so much on it to fear monger their base.

True.  I guess when you build the narrative that your party keeps 'em out and the other side lets 'em in you don't need to bother looking stuff like this up.  

[Leon]

(08-09-2022, 12:44 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Pretty much every talking point from the right on immigration is based on faulty logic and a lack of understanding of the issue. Because of its complexity it is easy to do, which is why GOP politicians rely so much on it to fear monger their base.

are you claiming you or the left got all the imagration answers and you understand everything about it. if you aint claiming that then acusing others of not having answers or great understanding seems big time hipocritcal. 

[Leon]

(08-09-2022, 12:48 PM)Nately120 Wrote: True.  I guess when you build the narrative that your party keeps 'em out and the other side lets 'em in you don't need to bother looking stuff like this up.  

both sides have failed imigration forever. why pretend only one side is to blame

[*Nately120*]

(08-10-2022, 02:47 PM)Leon Wrote: both sides have failed imigration forever. why pretend only one side is to blame

The biggest failure are supposedly law-abiding Americans who hire illegals to perform jobs they could hire an actual American citizen to do.

It wasn't that long ago when Bush-era republicans' stance on illegals was that they were only here to do jobs that entitled and lazy union democrats didn't want to do for a reasonable wage and that amnesty was a logical and economy-bolstering idea as it was when Reagan granted it in the 80s.

Fast forward and illegals have gone from profit-making hard workers to rapists and murders.  My how the turn tables. 

[Leon]

(08-10-2022, 02:51 PM)Nately120 Wrote: The biggest failure are supposedly law-abiding Americans who hire illegals to perform jobs they could hire an actual American citizen to do.

It wasn't that long ago when Bush-era republicans' stance on illegals was that they were only here to do jobs that entitled and lazy union democrats didn't want to do for a reasonable wage and that amnesty was a logical and economy-bolstering idea as it was when Reagan granted it in the 80s.

Fast forward and illegals have gone from profit-making hard workers to rapists and murders.  My how the turn tables. 

it like your wearin a pair of glasses were you can only see out one side. you dont think the left had done any wrong or made any mistakes on imigration? you think its only one party who played politcs games with it and aint really done anything?

[*Nately120*]

(08-10-2022, 02:56 PM)Leon Wrote: it like your wearin a pair of glasses were you can only see out one side. you dont think the left had done any wrong or made any mistakes on imigration? you think its only one party who played politcs games with it and aint really done anything?

I think the republican party is a bit more culpable because they delude people into thinking the answer to our troubles with illegals is simply to vote for a republican every 4 years.  It convinces people that they don't need to do their own fair share or have discipline or control over fixing the problem themselves.

I've never hired an illegal, have you?

[Leon]

(08-10-2022, 02:58 PM)Nately120 Wrote: I think the republican party is a bit more culpable because they delude people into thinking the answer to our troubles with illegals is simply to vote for a republican every 4 years.  It convinces people that they don't need to do their own fair share or have discipline or control over fixing the problem themselves.

I've never hired an illegal, have you?

yes i have, many times on my farm in the past. they needed work. i always gave them good wages and place to stay. why they always wanted to come back. they were good workers and good folks. they ate supper with us every night. our family aint against imigration. were against not bein able to control it or have any good plans. both sides to. gotta have a way to keep criminals and dangerus folks out. im for letting imigrants who have clean records an obey law after they get here to have every chance to stay an work an become americans. but cant just allow everone and has to be some kinda process that makes sense for every one. 

[*Nately120*]

(08-10-2022, 03:12 PM)Leon Wrote: yes i have, many times on my farm in the past. they needed work. i always gave them good wages and place to stay. why they always wanted to come back. they were good workers and good folks. they ate supper with us every night. our family aint against imigration. were against not bein able to control it or have any good plans. both sides to. gotta have a way to keep criminals and dangerus folks out. im for letting imigrants who have clean records an obey law after they get here to have every chance to stay an work an become americans. but cant just allow everone and has to be some kinda process that makes sense for every one. 

Interesting.  I've never talked illegal immigration with someone who hires illegals and lets them into his house.  I feel like a lot of Americans would say you were really playing with fire by doing that. Also, I guess we will find out if any of those new IRS agents are monitoring this message board.