Pelosi, Schumer To Trump: "Let's Debate Border Funds in Private"

[Mike M (the other one)]

(12-18-2018, 04:38 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'll just bother addressing this: no, I can't give you links. Most of the things I read are behind a university subscription paywall that prevents me from sharing them.

What are their names?
Maybe they have something public? I don't mind researching if I at least have a starting point.

[Belsnickel]

(12-18-2018, 06:49 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: What are their names?
Maybe they have something public? I don't mind researching if I at least have a starting point.

I'd really have to go digging for them. I read these publications when they come out and only really make special note of them if it is a research area that is of interest to me. This isn't one of those things for me, so I can't remember article titles or author names. It's nerdy, I know, but I spend my spare time reading these sorts of academic articles (if I'm not fishing), so I go through a lot of them.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(12-18-2018, 06:53 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'd really have to go digging for them. I read these publications when they come out and only really make special note of them if it is a research area that is of interest to me. This isn't one of those things for me, so I can't remember article titles or author names. It's nerdy, I know, but I spend my spare time reading these sorts of academic articles (if I'm not fishing), so I go through a lot of them.

LOL I'd read them while fishing, once done with it, they'd make for a great fire starter.

[Belsnickel]

(12-18-2018, 07:00 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: LOL I'd read them while fishing, once done with it, they'd make for a great fire starter.

I'm too active of an angler. Casting out jigs, plastics, spinnerbaits, etc. None of that throwing out a float with a worm on it for me, these days. Can't really read while dragging a jig on the bottom of the river.

[*Nately120*]

(12-18-2018, 07:58 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'm too active of an angler. Casting out jigs, plastics, spinnerbaits, etc. None of that throwing out a float with a worm on it for me, these days. Can't really read while dragging a jig on the bottom of the river.

This is more than enough fishing for me:

[GMDino]

https://apnews.com/0fcda32812024680ad98676379c47233

Quote:US pledges $10.6B aid for Central America, southern Mexico




MEXICO CITY (AP) — The United States pledged $5.8 billion in aid and investment Tuesday for strengthening government and economic development in Central America, and another $4.8 billion in development aid for southern Mexico.

The U.S aid aims to promote better security conditions and job opportunities as part of a regional plan to allow Central Americans and Mexicans to remain in their countries and not have to emigrate.

The plan was announced in a joint U.S.-Mexican statement released by the State Department and read aloud by Mexican
Foreign Relations Secretary Marcelo Ebrard in the Mexican capital.

“In sum I think this is good news, very good news for Mexico,” Ebrard said.

Newly inaugurated President Andres Manuel Lopez Obrador waxed poetic about the plan to provide jobs so people won’t have to emigrate.

“I have a dream that I want to see become a reality ... that nobody will want to go work in the United States anymore,” Lopez Obrador said at a morning news conference before the announcement.

The combination of public and private investment for the stay-at-home effort doesn’t require congressional approval, unlike Trump’s signature project to stem illegal immigration — a border wall.

The U.S. State Department issued a simultaneous statement saying “The United States is committing $5.8 billion through public and private investment to promote institutional reforms and development in the Northern Triangle,” a term that refers to Honduras, Guatemala and El Salvador.

Lopez Obrador’s administration has said it is also interested in agricultural, forestry and tourism projects in southern Mexico, and the U.S. said it will contribute to those efforts.

The U.S. Overseas Private Investment Corporation “is prepared to invest and mobilize $2 billion in additional funds for projects in southern Mexico that are viable and attract private sector investment,” according to the statement. “This amount is in addition to the $2.8 billion in projects for Mexico through OPIC’s current investment pipeline.”

Ebrard said “The commitments established here signify more than doubling foreign investment in southern Mexico starting in 2019.”

Southern states like Chiapas and Oaxaca are home to many of Mexico’s poorest communities. Lopez Obrador, who took office Dec. 1, has sought to make development in that region a priority, including plans for a “Mayan train” stretching from touristy parts of the Yucatan Peninsula down to Chiapas.

It was unclear if Mexico would give anything in return. A planned announcement about Mexico’s migration policy was postponed until Wednesday.

The United States has reportedly wanted Mexico to allow migrants seeking asylum in the United States to remain in Mexico while their applications are processed.

Ebrard had previously suggested that about $25 billion in U.S. investment would be an appropriate figure for what Mexicans and Central Americans have dubbed “The Alliance for Prosperity” in the region.

[GMDino]

No longer concrete...nor a wall.

....It will be beautiful and, at the same time, give our Country the security that our citizens deserve. It will go up fast and save us BILLIONS of dollars a month once completed!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 19, 2018

[Belsnickel]

(12-18-2018, 10:59 PM)GMDino Wrote: https://apnews.com/0fcda32812024680ad98676379c47233

Holy shit, something I can applaud our current administration for. This is the sort of thing we should be doing if we really want to stop the flow of undocumented immigrants, not building a wall.

[GMDino]

(12-19-2018, 08:32 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Holy shit, something I can applaud our current administration for. This is the sort of thing we should be doing if we really want to stop the flow of undocumented immigrants, not building a wall.

Indeed.

Let's see how it gets spun by the right wing noise machine to make Trump the winner.  Because he has to "win".

[GMDino]

(12-19-2018, 09:59 AM)GMDino Wrote: Indeed.

Let's see how it gets spun by the right wing noise machine to make Trump the winner.  Because he has to "win".

Ah...there it is!

Mexico is paying (indirectly) for the Wall through the new USMCA, the replacement for NAFTA! Far more money coming to the U.S. Because of the tremendous dangers at the Border, including large scale criminal and drug inflow, the United States Military will build the Wall!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 19, 2018

[jj22]

Interesting. So why again is he requesting 5 billion for the wall (and threatening a shutdown) if it is already being paid for?

I'll wait Trump supporters who will fall for this line.

[*michaelsean*]

(12-19-2018, 11:45 AM)jj22 Wrote: Interesting. So why again is he requesting 5 billion for the wall (and threatening a shutdown) if it is already being paid for?

I'll wait Trump supporters who will fall for this line.

Well even if you believed what he was saying, it still has to be allocated.  

[jj22]

If it was there he'd at least have Republicans (who aren't supporting because of the deficits) vote. He doesn't in the House or Senate from fiscal Concervatives. Which means this is a lie.

They wouldn't balk at reallocating funds, they will balk (and have) at it adding more debt.

[*michaelsean*]

(12-19-2018, 11:54 AM)jj22 Wrote: If it was there he'd at least have Republicans (who aren't supporting because of the deficits) vote. He doesn't in the House or Senate from fiscal Concervatives. Which means this is a lie.

They wouldn't balk at reallocating funds, they will balk (and have) at it adding more debt.

I'm just saying why you could still have a battle even if it were actually true.  

[jj22]

Fair enough.

[*Nately120*]

(12-19-2018, 11:45 AM)jj22 Wrote: Interesting. So why again is he requesting 5 billion for the wall (and threatening a shutdown) if it is already being paid for?

I'll wait Trump supporters who will fall for this line.

All we have to do is invest some money up-front and Trump, the super-rich winner, will see to it that we reap the benefits 100-fold!  When has Trump ever failed to live up to a promise he made to investors?

This is Trump running the country like a business.  We wanted this.  Pay up, America.

[Mike M (the other one)]

(12-19-2018, 08:32 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Holy shit, something I can applaud our current administration for. This is the sort of thing we should be doing if we really want to stop the flow of undocumented immigrants, not building a wall.

In the Long Game, i feel it is a complete waste.

In the short game, immigration will slow down a little, but after a year, back to normal.
Mexico isn't going to give up those Visa's they allow to immigrants to pass thru Mexico on the way to the US.

[Belsnickel]

(12-19-2018, 02:54 PM)Mike M (the other one) Wrote: In the Long Game, i feel it is a complete waste.

In the short game, immigration will slow down a little, but after a year, back to normal.
Mexico isn't going to give up those Visa's they allow to immigrants to pass thru Mexico on the way to the US.

When it comes to discovering policy solutions, wonks always try to get at the root cause of a problem rather than a surface level fix. Politicians only like surface level fixes because the general public doesn't have the patience for the comprehensive solutions. The reason we see immigration issues from our southern neighbors is because of violence, political instability, and economic disparity. Putting up a border wall is a surface level fix, if that. But if we work to bring more stability, both economically and politically to the entire hemisphere, then we stem the tide of immigration because they don't have the reasons to leave.

That a comprehensive solution to the immigration problem. It fixes the why, which isn't what surface level fixes look at.

[*bfine32*]

(12-19-2018, 12:15 AM)GMDino Wrote: No longer concrete...nor a wall.

....It will be beautiful and, at the same time, give our Country the security that our citizens deserve. It will go up fast and save us BILLIONS of dollars a month once completed!

— Donald J. Trump (@realDonaldTrump) December 19, 2018

Sounds like a fence. I've been told those are much better. 

[GMDino]

Don't worry folks!

There's a sucker born every minute.

Trump supporters, the ones that TRULY believe that Mexico will pay for the wall, are putting THEIR money where HIS mouth is.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2018/12/19/trump-border-wall-gofundme-crowdfunding-campaign-launched-florida-veteran/2371273002/

Quote:GoFundMe campaign for border wall raises $1 million and counting toward $1 billion goal


A GoFundMe campaign titled "We The People Will Fund The Wall" has raised over $1 million and counting to build President Donald Trump's border wall. 


More than 16,000 people have pledged donations to the campaign created Sunday by a "fundraising team" in Miramar, Florida, according to the campaign page.


Its initial goal of $200 million has been bumped to $1 billion.


"It’s up to Americans to help out and pitch in to get this project rolling," according to the campaign page, which is attributed to Air Force veteran Brian Kolfage Jr. On Sept. 11, 2004, Kolfage became the most severely wounded airman to survive any war in U.S. history, according to reports.    


On Tuesday, White House press secretary Sarah Sanders told Fox News the administration is exploring "different" sources to pay for his proposed wall along the U.S.-Mexican border, according to reports. 


“There are certainly a number of different funding sources that we’ve identified that we can use, that we can couple with money that would be given through congressional appropriations that would help us get to that $5 billion that the president needs in order to protect our border," Sanders said.


More: President Trump exploring other sources to fund wall, White House says
More: A 2,000-mile journey in the shadow of the border wall


Trump has demanded $5 billion to pay for the border wall he promised to build during his campaign, according to reports. Lawmakers have until midnight Friday to pass a spending measure or shut down some federal agencies. 

Kolfage, a staunch supporter of the Trump presidency, believes the crowdfunding campaign can reach its goal if everyone who voted for President Trump contributes. 


“If the 63 million people who voted for Trump each pledge $80, we can build the wall,” Kolfage states on the GoFundMe page. 


"That equates to roughly $5 billion, even if we get half, that's half the wall. We can do this."

And DJT's magic at separating fools and their money continues.


Despite every one of his business failures and all the underhanded business tricks and all the lies enough people still believe him.  


He's a televangelist without the charm and ethics.