Perception of Biden when he is denied a pause in Gaza?

[Luvnit2]

Joe Biden has gone from I am in all in for support of Israel, to publicly asking Israel to pause/cease fire in Gaza while Israel has ground forces surrounding Gaza city? Bibi had a strong message to Biden and anyone calling for a pause/cease fire, it won't happen until all 241 hostages are returned. To be clear, these are not prisoners of war Hamas took, they are civilian hostages that include innocent women, men, grand parents, children and babies.

How does it make Joe look when Bibi refuses his requests? Does he look powerful to his allies or weak?

Why can't Biden get Egypt another US ally to allow Palestinians to enter Egypt and get out of harm's way? If Biden gets Egypt to take in millions of Palestinians, it gets them out of harms way and they can get them water, food and any medical care they need. Why isn't getting Egypt on board to allow Palestinians to leave Gaza to the south not the top priority?

Why can't Biden get this done? Why does Egypt refuse to take Palestinians? What do they know that we don't?

[*pally*]

Egypt doesn't trust Netanyahu and Israel. They do not believe that Israel would ever allow the refugees to return to Gaza. There have been rumors that Bibi let the Hamas attack happen just to have the excuse to finally get rid of the Palestinians out of Gaza. Nor do the Egyptians trust Israel not to start making more encroachment into the Sinai Peninsula. Additionally, they do not Hamas to gain a stronghold in their country. So far Egypt is yielding to the Israelis

Joe got them to open the border to allow some humanitarian assistance to go into Gaza and to allow foreign nationals out of Gaza.

The President has 3 major concerns with this conflict that require a delicate balancing act

1) get rid of Hamas
2) support Israel's need to protect themselves
3) do not let this blow up the entire Middle East

You seem to think only the first 2 are important.

[Dill]

(11-04-2023, 12:48 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: Joe Biden has gone from I am in all in for support of Israel, to publicly asking Israel to pause/cease fire in Gaza while Israel has ground forces surrounding Gaza city? Bibi had a strong message to Biden and anyone calling for a pause/cease fire, it won't happen until all 241 hostages are returned. To be clear, these are not prisoners of war Hamas took, they are civilian hostages that include innocent women, men, grand parents, children and babies.

How does it make Joe look when Bibi refuses his requests? Does he look powerful to his allies or weak?

Why can't Biden get Egypt another US ally to allow Palestinians to enter Egypt and get out of harm's way? If Biden gets Egypt to take in millions of Palestinians, it gets them out of harms way and they can get them water, food and any medical care they need. Why isn't getting Egypt on board to allow Palestinians to leave Gaza to the south not the top priority?

Why can't Biden get this done? Why does Egypt refuse to take Palestinians? What do they know that we don't?

Pally answered your question about Egypt. She may even have understated the general fear in the region that Israel would use an evacuation to push more Palestinians permanently off their land.

Our allies know what a problem Israel is. Most will be for a cease fire, right along with Biden. Most of the world will, for that matter.

Everyone expects Israel to be hard to rein in now, since 1400 Israelis were killed. No one expects Biden to control Israel like a vassal state.

Netanhayu may be unable to do otherwise than "bounce the rubble" over civilian bodies. He knows there will be a political reckoning in Israel when this is over and it is not likely to go in his favor. His immediate audience and concern are Israeli voters, not the US or the international community. So he needs a pretty decisive, vengeful victory to make up for the political mistakes--strengthening Hamas and ignoring Gaza while focusing on West Bank annexation and normalizing relations with Gulf states.

So I don't think most of our allies have a MAGA worldview; they know "weak" and "strong" are tremendous (and very authoritarian) oversimplifications. If anything, most are upset that the US backing has for decades protected Israel from accountability, allowing it to scoff at international law; they probably (depending on the ally) think it was a mistake to jump in and "stand by Israel" with no conditions, and then send material to help with the assault on Gaza. 

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

(11-04-2023, 12:48 PM)Luvnit2 Wrote: If Biden gets Egypt to take in millions of Palestinians, it gets them out of harms way and they can get them water, food and any medical care they need. Why isn't getting Egypt on board to allow Palestinians to leave Gaza to the south not the top priority?

Why does Egypt refuse to take Palestinians? What do they know that we don't?

Even if we ignore the terrorist government aspect of Hamas/Gaza, no country can afford to take 2% of their population worth of refugees at once.

Egypt is also already in an economic crisis. Their credit score has been downgraded twice this year alone. March '22 to March '23 the value of their currency depreciated by 50% against the dollar. In January of this year, inflation was 25.8%.

(11-04-2023, 01:14 PM)pally Wrote: Additionally, they do not Hamas to gain a stronghold in their country.

I think this is the biggest reason. Egypt also considers Hamas a terrorist organizaiton. Nobody wants to open their borders to a terrorist organization.

Even if money weren't already a huge issue for Egypt struggling to make sure their own people can eat.