Planned Parenthood: New Video

[jakefromstatefarm]

(08-26-2015, 12:02 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: Is it? How much do your individual freedoms matter in a plutocracy?

Quite a lot, I'd say. 

I didn't work two jobs for 7 years and go to school so I can have the same life as a cousin of mine, a high school dropout with three kids with two different dads and is completely dependent on the government to take care of her and her kids. 

Explain to me why someone like that is deserving of an equal outcome?  Why should the quality of my life be scaled back so someone like that can have economic equality?

I don't get the trust in government that liberals/socialists/communists/collectivists/pick your ideology have. 

Big government has shown throughout history that they are more corrupt than any wealthy people could ever dream of being.  Millions upon millions of people have been slaughtered by their own governments throughout history when given too much power, and there is no way possible to solve the economic inequality "problem" without a massive and authoritarian government. 

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(08-26-2015, 12:15 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Big government has shown throughout history that they are more corrupt than any wealthy people could ever dream of being.   

I almost fell out of my chair laughing at this.

You're a funny guy.

[Belsnickel]

(08-26-2015, 12:15 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Quite a lot, I'd say. 

I didn't work two jobs for 7 years and go to school so I can have the same life as a cousin of mine, a high school dropout with three kids with two different dads and is completely dependent on the government to take care of her and her kids. 

Explain to me why someone like that is deserving of an equal outcome?  Why should the quality of my life be scaled back so someone like that can have economic equality?

I don't get the trust in government that liberals/socialists/communists/collectivists/pick your ideology have. 

Big government has shown throughout history that they are more corrupt than any wealthy people could ever dream of being.  Millions upon millions of people have been slaughtered by their own governments throughout history when given too much power, and there is no way possible to solve the economic inequality "problem" without a massive and authoritarian government. 

You're misunderstanding what the issue is about. What I am talking about is not making everyone equal, but it is addressing the disparity in classes that exists in this country. The system doesn't need to be level, there needs to be a middle class. When economic inequality continues to grow, that gap widens and there is no middle class. Our economic inequality is on par with third-world countries, not industrialized nations, and it is continuously widening. This isn't sustainable for our country.

And no, it does not have to be massive or authoritarian. That is nothing more than fear mongering. There are many different models out there for this sort of thing. Our government was not as massive 100 years ago and our economic inequality was nothing like it is today.

(08-26-2015, 12:33 PM)RICHMONDBENGAL_07 Wrote: I almost fell out of my chair laughing at this.

You're a funny guy.

Yeah, that was pretty funny. Private sector using money to influence the public sector is where corruption happens.

[*bfine32*]

It is funny to me when folks try to clump together Microeconomics and Macroeconomics. Then try to apply the terms of trickle up and tickle down to each.

[jakefromstatefarm]

(08-26-2015, 12:57 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: You're misunderstanding what the issue is about. What I am talking about is not making everyone equal, but it is addressing the disparity in classes that exists in this country. The system doesn't need to be level, there needs to be a middle class. When economic inequality continues to grow, that gap widens and there is no middle class. Our economic inequality is on par with third-world countries, not industrialized nations, and it is continuously widening. This isn't sustainable for our country.

And no, it does not have to be massive or authoritarian. That is nothing more than fear mongering. There are many different models out there for this sort of thing. Our government was not as massive 100 years ago and our economic inequality was nothing like it is today.

Okay, well then instead of making vague references without specifics and then critiquing my posts when I'm left to guess what you're referring to, why don't you lay out some detailed specifics of what you'd like to see and we can go from there?

It's very difficult to make an argument against something when I'm arguing against nothing more than vague talking points.  

[Belsnickel]

(08-26-2015, 01:06 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Okay, well then instead of making vague references without specifics and then critiquing my posts when I'm left to guess what you're referring to, why don't you lay out some detailed specifics of what you'd like to see and we can go from there?

It's very difficult to make an argument against something when I'm arguing against nothing more than vague talking points.  

I don't know specifics, I don't have a plan because that sort of thing is above my pay grade. I just know that it is an issue that can, and needs to be fixed.

I'm not an economist by any means, I just know what I read online and elsewhere and what makes sense to me. Lots of terms and words get misrepresented when they get the political treatment, and redistribution of wealth is one of those big ones.

[Belsnickel]

(08-26-2015, 01:06 PM)bfine32 Wrote: It is funny to me when folks try to clump together Microeconomics and Macroeconomics. Then try to apply the terms of trickle up and tickle down to each.

It's funny when folks make passive aggressive comments trying to say somebody is wrong without actually doing anything to refute what was actually said.

[fredtoast]

(08-26-2015, 01:16 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: It's funny when folks make passive aggressive comments trying to say somebody is wrong without actually doing anything to refute what was actually said.

Rep

[fredtoast]

(08-26-2015, 12:15 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Big government has shown throughout history that they are more corrupt than any wealthy people could ever dream of being. 

Not true at all.  The only time governments get out of hand is when the wealthy elite run it unchecked by the influence of the masses.

[fredtoast]

(08-26-2015, 12:15 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: I didn't work two jobs for 7 years and go to school so I can have the same life as a cousin of mine, a high school dropout with three kids with two different dads and is completely dependent on the government to take care of her and her kids. 

Then it is a good thing that no one here is suggesting anything like this.

Why can't you discuss what we are talking about instead of making stuff up like this?

[jakefromstatefarm]

(08-26-2015, 01:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Not true at all.  The only time governments get out of hand is when the wealthy elite run it unchecked by the influence of the masses.

Really?  So you're not only ignorant on economics, you're ignorant on history as well. 

Go read up on the Great Leap Forward and get back to me.  

[jakefromstatefarm]

(08-26-2015, 01:28 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Then it is a good thing that no one here is suggesting anything like this.

Why can't you discuss what we are talking about instead of making stuff up like this?

Maybe if those proposing such things would provide some specifics, I wouldn't be left to guess.

WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING!

[Belsnickel]

(08-26-2015, 01:45 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Maybe if those proposing such things would provide some specifics, I wouldn't be left to guess.

WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING!

If you present 300 economists with a problem you will have 300 different solutions. The specifics are a very difficult thing to get into and there is no one on this board that could actually have any real grasp of what was going on. The only person that has displayed any level of economic understanding above the average Joe around here has been JustWinBaby. I'm not saying I think he's always right, but he is probably the only one here that has any knowledge beyond having just taken some basic econ courses in college.

I'm just willing to acknowledge where my knowledge is lacking. I'm not much of a theorist, I'm an application guy.

[jakefromstatefarm]

I don't understand how you and other posters can be such vocal critics of economic inequality and have no opinions at all on how to fix it.

This is eerily similar to conversations that I've had with a lot of people in favor of increased gun control.

[Belsnickel]

(08-26-2015, 02:58 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: I don't understand how you and other posters can be such vocal critics of economic inequality and have no opinions at all on how to fix it.

This is eerily similar to conversations that I've had with a lot of people in favor of increased gun control.

It's easy to see there is a problem. It's much more difficult to find a solution to fix it when it is on such a large scale. I'm not sure why that is difficult to understand, really. I'm just not the type of person to throw out answers without a lot of research and time put into the development of the solution.

[*bfine32*]

(08-26-2015, 01:16 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: It's funny when folks make passive aggressive comments trying to say somebody is wrong without actually doing anything to refute what was actually said.

Tell it to him

RICHMONDBENGAL_07 Wrote:I almost fell out of my chair laughing at this.

You're a funny guy.

As for me, I pointed out no one nor told anyone they were wrong (maybe too "passive aggresive" for your taste). I simply read through the last few pages and found it amusing. Do you really need me to go back and quote for you the various posts that employ this fallacy? Well I'm not going to.

In case you want to do your own research anywhere someone tries to compare government economies/polocies to private sector finances.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(08-26-2015, 11:47 AM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: I didn't see a point to address, for starters.

Probably because, at best, you're a troll who's not intelligent enough to be good at trolling.

Quote:I don't claim to be a white crusader.

 
But your posts absolutely scream it.

Quote:I'd consider someone that is a white crusader is someone that thinks so little of black people that they don't think they're capable of things like procuring an ID to vote, or that any talk of shrinking social programs is racism. 

Or someone who thinks so little of black people that they don't notice an open attempt to enact genocide upon them under the guise of access to birth control.  You know, someone exactly like you.

Quote:Yes, I do think a lot of blacks vote based on what party will do the most for them.  Most whites vote for the same reason.

 
This type of behavior is hardly a racial issue.  Interesting that you don't see that.

Quote:I don't see any noble crusade in making that claim, your lame attempt at playing the race card notwithstanding. 

Unfortunately I'm not playing anything, just pointing out the logic behind your arguments.  

[jakefromstatefarm]

(08-26-2015, 11:47 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Probably because, at best, you're a troll who's not intelligent enough to be good at trolling.

 

I'm not even sure if you know what a troll is, but whatever.

I think you and I are pretty much done here. 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(08-27-2015, 12:13 AM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: I'm not even sure if you know what a troll is, but whatever.

I think you and I are pretty much done here. 

If you're only going to respond to 1/10th of my posts content then yes.  Of course, that seems to be your intent.  

[jakefromstatefarm]

(08-27-2015, 12:25 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: If you're only going to respond to 1/10th of my posts content then yes.  Of course, that seems to be your intent.  

Why bother if you think I'm some lameazz troll? 

Newsflash:  Not everyone on the internet is going to agree on everything.  That doesn't make the person who thinks differently than you a troll. 

If you want to have serious conversation, I'm all for it.  Stop with the condescending overtones and BS and converse or put me on ignore and move on.