Playing the "called me racist" card.

[fredtoast]

I have heard an awful lot of people complaining about being called racist, but I am not really seeing it. I have even heard some people here in this forum complain about being called racist, but I have not seen it.  On Fox I saw Greg Gutfeld say that he was not going to watch NFL games because he did not want to see "overpaid hypocrites (Yes, Gutfeld actually called someone else an 'overpaid hypocrite') calling him a racist".  So when I watched the NFL games and I did not see anyone calling Gutfeld or anyone else a racist.  

Seems like just another case of people creating their own victim card.  

So has anyone here actually been called a racist?  I don't mean just people complaining about or disagreeing with your opinion on social justice issues.  I mean someone actually directly calling you a racist.

[Mickeypoo]

(09-15-2020, 03:23 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I have heard an awful lot of people complaining about being called racist, but I am not really seeing it. I have even heard some people here in this forum complain about being called racist, but I have not seen it.  On Fox I saw Greg Gutfeld say that he was not going to watch NFL games because he did not want to see "overpaid hypocrites (Yes, Gutfeld actually called someone else an 'overpaid hypocrite') calling him a racist".  So when I watched the NFL games and I did not see anyone calling Gutfeld or anyone else a racist.  

Seems like just another case of people creating their own victim card.  

So has anyone here actually been called a racist?  I don't mean just people complaining about or disagreeing with your opinion on social justice issues.  I mean someone actually directly calling you a racist.

Nope.

Maybe all the "White Privilege" talk and protesters showing up at peoples homes yelling about "White Privilege" makes people feel like they are being called a racist?  Just a thought.

[Belsnickel]

(09-15-2020, 03:32 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: Nope.

Maybe all the "White Privilege" talk and protesters showing up at peoples homes yelling about "White Privilege" makes people feel like they are being called a racist?  Just a thought.

That certainly is a big part of it from my experience. It's unfortunate, because that's a misunderstanding of the idea of white privilege and, also based on my experience, those folks tend to not be willing to seek understanding.

[fredtoast]

(09-15-2020, 03:32 PM)Mickeypoo Wrote: Nope.

Maybe all the "White Privilege" talk and protesters showing up at peoples homes yelling about "White Privilege" makes people feel like they are being called a racist?  Just a thought.

Well they are wrong.  

Saying that white people have privileges in our society is not the same as saying white people are racist.  All the white people who acknowledge their privilege are not admitting that they are racist.

And refusing to acknowledge white privilege is usually more about ignorance than racism.  You can tell by the arguments white people usually use to try and deny it like "Why are their poor white people if they are all so privileged?"    

[*PhilHos*]

(09-15-2020, 03:23 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I have heard an awful lot of people complaining about being called racist, but I am not really seeing it. I have even heard some people here in this forum complain about being called racist, but I have not seen it.  On Fox I saw Greg Gutfeld say that he was not going to watch NFL games because he did not want to see "overpaid hypocrites (Yes, Gutfeld actually called someone else an 'overpaid hypocrite') calling him a racist".  So when I watched the NFL games and I did not see anyone calling Gutfeld or anyone else a racist.  

Seems like just another case of people creating their own victim card.  

So has anyone here actually been called a racist?  I don't mean just people complaining about or disagreeing with your opinion on social justice issues.  I mean someone actually directly calling you a racist.

My wife was; on Facebook; by a black man we considered a friend. My wife doesn't generally post political stuff on Facebook and when she does it's more along the line of questions (i.e. Why are people blocking traffic during protests or something along those lines (I don't have a specific example because it's been like 2 and half years since this happened). She asked a question about something related to something people were saying about Trump and race (it was an honest question; my wife doesn't watch the news or read newspapers or even read news articles on Facebook) and this friend essentially accused her of being racist just for asking the question. 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(09-15-2020, 03:44 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Well they are wrong.

Pretty much the opening line of every argument you make.  

Quote:Saying that white people have privileges in our society is not the same as saying white people are racist.  All the white people who acknowledge their privilege are not admitting that they are racist.

Probably because the term is racially charged.  The correct term would be majority privilege.  If a white person moved to China, Japan, Kenya, Saudi Arabia or anywhere else with a extremely low white population they wouldn't have white privilege there. 
  

Quote:And refusing to acknowledge white privilege is usually more about ignorance than racism.  You can tell by the arguments white people usually use to try and deny it like "Why are their poor white people if they are all so privileged?"    

My point above aside, there are plenty of people who will castigate white people for not acknowledging their privilege.  The whole "anti-racist" movement is a good example.  It's not enough to not be a racist person, you either actively attack racism, in all its forms, or you are part of the problem.  The militant language used by some (many?) creates far more problems than it could ever solve.  People don't like being treated or labeled as "x" because they belong to a group, whether that group is religious, ethnic, sexual orientation or gender.  Especially when it's done in a confrontational or aggressive manner.  They tend to react in a negative manner to such treatment and it'd be difficult to impossible to fault them for it.

[Belsnickel]

(09-15-2020, 03:55 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Probably because the term is racially charged. The correct term would be majority privilege. If a white person moved to China, Japan, Kenya, Saudi Arabia or anywhere else with a extremely low white population they wouldn't have white privilege there.

I'll have to see if I can find the studies, but the interesting thing is that isn't actually true. There is research that has found that white privilege exists even in many places where the white population is not the majority. The idea is that this is due to the pervasiveness of western culture around the globe.

[*bfine32*]

2 things:

I don't consider being called a racist as making me a victim

Most follow the Kamala Harris model: "I'm not saying you're a racist, just pointing out some racist stuff you've done...can I be your VP"

For instance: A forum member and I had a back and forth recently on Jacob Blake. He tried to assert my opinion was different toward Jacob Blake because Jacob Blake was black, not because Jacob Blake was violating a PPO when arrested. Now did that person call me a racist even though he didn't use the actual words 'You're a racist"?

[*PhilHos*]

(09-15-2020, 04:04 PM)bfine32 Wrote: 2 things:

I don't consider being called a racist as making me a victim

Most follow the Kamala Harris model: "I'm not saying you're a racist, just pointing out some racist stuff you've done...can I be your VP"

For instance: A forum member and I had a back and forth recently on Jacob Blake. He tried to assert my opinion was different toward Jacob Blake because Jacob Blake was black, not because Jacob Blake was violating a PPO when arrested. Now did that person call me a racist even though he didn't use the actual words 'You're a racist"?

Isn't that how it pretty much goes nowadays? And not just with racism but pretty much any 'ism'. People rarely openly call someone a racist unless said someone is wearing a Nazi uniform or KKK robes. Instead it's snarky comments and innuendos.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(09-15-2020, 03:59 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'll have to see if I can find the studies, but the interesting thing is that isn't actually true. There is research that has found that white privilege exists even in many places where the white population is not the majority. The idea is that this is due to the pervasiveness of western culture around the globe.

Interesting point, although I don't think it's as universal as that.  I will say that being white is the "next best thing" to being Chinese if you're in China or Japanese if you're in Japan.  I'm sure someone here will try and spin that statement way beyond what I'm actually saying.  The real question is why would that be the case?  Is it as simple as western culture being so dominant?  The follow up to that would be why is western culture so dominant?  Ans I suppose the follow up to that would be is that a bad thing?

[fredtoast]

(09-15-2020, 03:54 PM)PhilHos Wrote: My wife was; on Facebook; by a black man we considered a friend. My wife doesn't generally post political stuff on Facebook and when she does it's more along the line of questions (i.e. Why are people blocking traffic during protests or something along those lines (I don't have a specific example because it's been like 2 and half years since this happened). She asked a question about something related to something people were saying about Trump and race (it was an honest question; my wife doesn't watch the news or read newspapers or even read news articles on Facebook) and this friend essentially accused her of being racist just for asking the question. 

Hard to tell if the allegation was justified without knowing what she said.

Not saying she is racist, but I can think of a lot of questions that would clearly indicate a racist position.

[fredtoast]

(09-15-2020, 03:55 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: My point above aside, there are plenty of people who will castigate white people for not acknowledging their privilege.  The whole "anti-racist" movement is a good example.  It's not enough to not be a racist person, you either actively attack racism, in all its forms, or you are part of the problem.  The militant language used by some (many?) creates far more problems than it could ever solve.  People don't like being treated or labeled as "x" because they belong to a group, whether that group is religious, ethnic, sexual orientation or gender.  Especially when it's done in a confrontational or aggressive manner.  They tend to react in a negative manner to such treatment and it'd be difficult to impossible to fault them for it.

So what you are saying is that no one has specifically called you a racist, right?

[*PhilHos*]

(09-15-2020, 04:32 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Hard to tell if the allegation was justified without knowing what she said.

Not saying she is racist, but I can think of a lot of questions that would clearly indicate a racist position.

I get that, but trust me when I say that it was NOT a racist question. Believe me, my wife has privately said some stuff that comes VERRRRRRRY close to the line. This was not one of those times.

Think of someone asking why people hate Trump and someone responding that they're a racist. It wasn't that extreme a leap but it was relatively close to it.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(09-15-2020, 04:36 PM)fredtoast Wrote: So what you are saying is that no one has specifically called you a racist, right?

If that's what you got out of it then I guess we're done here.  

[fredtoast]

(09-15-2020, 04:04 PM)bfine32 Wrote: For instance: A forum member and I had a back and forth recently on Jacob Blake. He tried to assert my opinion was different toward Jacob Blake because Jacob Blake was black, not because Jacob Blake was violating a PPO when arrested. Now did that person call me a racist even though he didn't use the actual words 'You're a racist"?

I pointed out that you posted a lie about Jacob Blake in order to try and make him look worse than he was.  You never gave a good answer for why you did that.  

You didn't mention anything about a PPO or "guilty until proven innocent" until I asked you why you posted the lie.

But this is a perfect example of you accusing me of calling you racist when all I did was call out your BS.  

[fredtoast]

(09-15-2020, 04:38 PM)PhilHos Wrote: I get that, but trust me when I say that it was NOT a racist question. Believe me, my wife has privately said some stuff that comes VERRRRRRRY close to the line. This was not one of those times.

Think of someone asking why people hate Trump and someone responding that they're a racist. It wasn't that extreme a leap but it was relatively close to it.

I have to admit that Facebook is the one place where people are most likely to call people racist. 

[fredtoast]

(09-15-2020, 04:39 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: If that's what you got out of it then I guess we're done here.  

Well if you don't deny it then we are definitely done here.

[*bfine32*]

(09-15-2020, 04:43 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I pointed out that you posted a lie about Jacob Blake in order to try and make him look worse than he was.  You never gave a good answer for why you did that.  

You didn't mention anything about a PPO or "guilty until proven innocent" until I asked you why you posted the lie.

But this is a perfect example of you accusing me of calling you racist when all I did was call out your BS.  

Well I eliminated names to protect the guilty. But you clearly asked why I felt differently about folks "like Blake".

I clearly admitted the meme I posted was inaccurate and gave why I hold him to a different standard in this case (he was violating a PPO). But that never stopped your "folks like Blake" position.  You clearly made it about race at your first possible opportunity. Perhaps you meant I have a different standard for Geminis 

Yeah, there's definitely some BS going on. But you know what they say "Innocent until proven guilty..."

WTS, my position remains unchanged. Folks won't just come out and call someone a racist, they like to consider themselves "open-minded". They'll just paint the picture with a broad brush and let other figure it out.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-15-2020, 04:46 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I have to admit that Facebook is the one place where people are most likely to call people racist. 

Amongst other things.

My friend did kinda back away from calling my wife a racist (the old "i'm sorry you feel that way but this is how i feel" type comment) when he realized her question was genuine.

I was called a racist about 30 years ago. I was a counselor at a summer camp and this 10 year old black kid called me a racist. Because I asked him to put on his shoes. Because the rest of the cabin (made up up of about 50% black kids 50% white kids) was waiting for him so they could all go on a hike together.

Aside from that, i can't say I've ever been accused of being racist. I've always just attributed that to the fact that I'm not a racist nor do i say or do racist things. 

[fredtoast]

So I 100% get the comments about how "people who do nothing are part of the problem" seem to call everyone a racist. But that type of allegation is usually not brought up against a specific individual to label them as a racist. It is usually just a generic complaint against indifference.

However, if you are in a position to address public policy through your job then indifference and inaction can be a form of racist behavior.