Post-Election Thoughts

[Belsnickel]

I'm here to eat crow. I said all along that this was a Clinton win. I am a political science junky (I study public policy and admin because it is the practical application of poli sci) and the vast majority of what the field looks at pointed to Clinton, and that was wrong. This means that for the next few years academics will be having all sorts of fun trying to understand what happened. Of course, they will likely face decreased funding to do so, but that's a different matter.

My wife is very unhappy with the result, but I am a bit more pragmatic. I told her not to get to snappy with any of the folks we work with that voted Trump, because their votes didn't help him win since Virginia went Clinton and all of our electoral votes go to her. I also told her to keep in mind that while the House will be favorable to Trump because they will often look to their constituents to take their cues, the Senate is not that way and looks more towards the country as a whole and while it is a GOP majority they will not just let things go through that will cause irreparable harm to our country.

My frustrations with this situation are these:

1. We don't know what we are getting. With the constant position switching and ambiguous policy plans it's hard to say what he will actually be pushing for. This leads to the next one.

2. This was not an issues election, and that concerns me. Either major party candidate would have been elected not based on issues, but on emotions. That's not logical, and that's concerning.

3. This country just elected, for the first time in our history, a President with no prior government experience. The first President in our history that has neither held public office and/or been in the military. Someone without knowledge of how government works to head up the largest bureaucracy in the hemisphere. This concerns me. Everything else aside, this is what concerned me the most about Trump from the beginning.

So, whatever your leanings in this election, what are your thoughts this morning?

[RICHMONDBENGAL_07]

(11-09-2016, 09:40 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'm here to eat crow. I said all along that this was a Clinton win. I am a political science junky (I study public policy and admin because it is the practical application of poli sci) and the vast majority of what the field looks at pointed to Clinton, and that was wrong. This means that for the next few years academics will be having all sorts of fun trying to understand what happened. Of course, they will likely face decreased funding to do so, but that's a different matter.

My wife is very unhappy with the result, but I am a bit more pragmatic. I told her not to get to snappy with any of the folks we work with that voted Trump, because their votes didn't help him win since Virginia went Clinton and all of our electoral votes go to her. I also told her to keep in mind that while the House will be favorable to Trump because they will often look to their constituents to take their cues, the Senate is not that way and looks more towards the country as a whole and while it is a GOP majority they will not just let things go through that will cause irreparable harm to our country.

My frustrations with this situation are these:

1. We don't know what we are getting. With the constant position switching and ambiguous policy plans it's hard to say what he will actually be pushing for. This leads to the next one.

2. This was not an issues election, and that concerns me. Either major party candidate would have been elected not based on issues, but on emotions. That's not logical, and that's concerning.

3. This country just elected, for the first time in our history, a President with no prior government experience. The first President in our history that has neither held public office and/or been in the military. Someone without knowledge of how government works to head up the largest bureaucracy in the hemisphere. This concerns me. Everything else aside, this is what concerned me the most about Trump from the beginning.

So, whatever your leanings in this election, what are your thoughts this morning?

I'm stunned, I admit I didn't think it could happen.  This is going to be interesting.

[Vas Deferens]

4. Clinton and DWS are the scum of the ***** earth for rigging the primaries. I hope their legacies are solidified and are publicly shamed every time they step outside. I would fund a shaming Kickstarter actually.

5. Bye bye reproductive rights.

6. Thanks scared low T baby boomers. Just ***** die already. Everyone hates you. Especially your children. Trust me.

[Belsnickel]

(11-09-2016, 10:32 AM)Vas Deferens Wrote: 6. Thanks scared low T baby boomers. Just ***** die already. Everyone hates you. Especially your children. Trust me.

I will be interested to look at the data on the election on the demographics once it is compiled in more detail. This was the first election where boomers were outnumbered by the younger generations, and so I will be curious to see the breakdown.

[GMDino]

(11-09-2016, 10:32 AM)Vas Deferens Wrote: 4.  Clinton and DWS are the scum of the ***** earth for rigging the primaries.  I hope their legacies are solidified and are publicly shamed every time they step outside.  I would fund a shaming Kickstarter actually.

5.  Bye bye reproductive rights.  

6.  Thanks scared low T baby boomers.  Just ***** die already. Everyone hates you.  Especially your children. Trust me.

It does seem, looking at the number of people who felt Trump was unqualified but voted for him anyway, that a lot of people just voted against the party in power.  Not a big surprise there after eight years of democrat control.

And based on my facebook feed he was voted in by a lot of people who think America needs a loudmouth bully to tell the rest of the world we are the top dog.  Same people who think John Wayne was an actual cowboy.  

[*michaelsean*]

I'm kind of speechless. I had made peace with a Hillary presidency. I never even contemplated a Trump presidency because I didn't think there was a chance.


I don't think he is going to get rubber stamped by the Republican congress. I didn't see the final Senate numbers, but it will only take a few Republicans to stop anything, and there will be more than a few willing. Maybe Congress starts working together. Democrats are praying this continues to be the "party of no".

I'd say Supreme Court nominees is a good thing, but who knows who this guy will nominate.

Looks like Gary Johnson got 3%. The Libertarians should just go away if that's all they could muster with these two candidates.

I think Bfine, Mike M and SSF both believed this could very well happen, so congrats to them on seeing what most of us didn't.

I wonder if Trump is thinking, "WTF do I do now?" And does he have a plan for his businesses? I assume that's all of limits to him.

[WeezyBengal]

Pretty easy to tell what happened.

A ton of people had an honest disdain for Hillary. Couple that with the black vote not coming out as strong as four/eight years ago and the rural/suburban white vote coming out stronger than ever and you get your results.

[WeezyBengal]

(11-09-2016, 09:40 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I'm here to eat crow. I said all along that this was a Clinton win. I am a political science junky (I study public policy and admin because it is the practical application of poli sci) and the vast majority of what the field looks at pointed to Clinton, and that was wrong. This means that for the next few years academics will be having all sorts of fun trying to understand what happened. Of course, they will likely face decreased funding to do so, but that's a different matter.

My wife is very unhappy with the result, but I am a bit more pragmatic. I told her not to get to snappy with any of the folks we work with that voted Trump, because their votes didn't help him win since Virginia went Clinton and all of our electoral votes go to her. I also told her to keep in mind that while the House will be favorable to Trump because they will often look to their constituents to take their cues, the Senate is not that way and looks more towards the country as a whole and while it is a GOP majority they will not just let things go through that will cause irreparable harm to our country.

My frustrations with this situation are these:

1. We don't know what we are getting. With the constant position switching and ambiguous policy plans it's hard to say what he will actually be pushing for. This leads to the next one.

2. This was not an issues election, and that concerns me. Either major party candidate would have been elected not based on issues, but on emotions. That's not logical, and that's concerning.

3. This country just elected, for the first time in our history, a President with no prior government experience. The first President in our history that has neither held public office and/or been in the military. Someone without knowledge of how government works to head up the largest bureaucracy in the hemisphere. This concerns me. Everything else aside, this is what concerned me the most about Trump from the beginning.

So, whatever your leanings in this election, what are your thoughts this morning?

I voted for Trump, but this is the one point in which I agree with you. His lack of experience and the "unknown" of what we are getting with trump tends to worry me a bit. I am optimistic, though.

[WeezyBengal]

(11-09-2016, 10:32 AM)Vas Deferens Wrote: 4.  Clinton and DWS are the scum of the ***** earth for rigging the primaries.  I hope their legacies are solidified and are publicly shamed every time they step outside.  I would fund a shaming Kickstarter actually.

5.  Bye bye reproductive rights.  

6.  Thanks scared low T baby boomers.  Just ***** die already. Everyone hates you.  Especially your children. Trust me.

You sound like a salty little *****. Bernie Sanders would have been destroyed even more than Hillary. That dude would have had no shot. None. 

[samhain]

We'll see how it goes. I hope the markets rebound fully as they seem to be starting some kind of recovery.

I also hope that he staffs his cabinet with competent, experienced people. I fear we'll get vindictive douches like Rudy and Christie. Hopefully Bridgegate torpedoes Christie's rep enough to make him toxic. If either one becomes AG, all the states that have legalized marijuana better prepare to see a drop in tax revenue when those asshats start sending the feds in. I also hope that he doesn't just hand the jobs to his kids.

I guess I see some hope in that Trump is not a conventional Republican. As has been said, he was a liberal through and through until he tuned 60 or so. Perhaps he could truly become a president that transcends party politics. I sometimes have a tough time believing that he really just up and changes his views on things like abortion magically, overnight. The downside is that there's a huge possibility that he just turns out to be a Republican than spends money like a Democrat and bankrupts us with his border wall and infrastructure projects.

[*michaelsean*]

(11-09-2016, 11:05 AM)samhain Wrote: We'll see how it goes.  I hope the markets rebound fully as they seem to be starting some kind of recovery.  

I also hope that he staffs his cabinet with competent, experienced people.  I fear we'll get vindictive douches like Rudy and Christie.  Hopefully Bridgegate torpedoes Christie's rep enough to make him toxic.  If either one becomes AG, all the states that have legalized marijuana better prepare to see a drop in tax revenue when those asshats start sending the feds in.  I also hope that he doesn't just hand the jobs to his kids.

I guess I see some hope in that Trump is not a conventional Republican.  As has been said, he was a liberal through and through until he tuned 60 or so.  Perhaps he could truly become a president that transcends party politics.  I sometimes have a tough time believing that he really just up and changes his views on things like abortion magically, overnight.  The downside is that there's a huge possibility that he just turns out to be a Republican than spends money like a Democrat and bankrupts us with his border wall and infrastructure projects.

He babbled what he thought people wanted to hear.  I don't think he is going to make any big waves on the social front.  Then again after last night, wtf do I know?

[GMDino]

(11-09-2016, 11:09 AM)michaelsean Wrote: He babbled what he thought people wanted to hear.  I don't think he is going to make any big waves on the social front.  Then again after last night, wtf do I know?

I've been saying that all night.  I was so wrong I don't even know what right is! 

[WeezyBengal]

(11-09-2016, 11:05 AM)samhain Wrote: We'll see how it goes.  I hope the markets rebound fully as they seem to be starting some kind of recovery.  

I also hope that he staffs his cabinet with competent, experienced people.  I fear we'll get vindictive douches like Rudy and Christie.  Hopefully Bridgegate torpedoes Christie's rep enough to make him toxic.  If either one becomes AG, all the states that have legalized marijuana better prepare to see a drop in tax revenue when those asshats start sending the feds in.  I also hope that he doesn't just hand the jobs to his kids.

I guess I see some hope in that Trump is not a conventional Republican.  As has been said, he was a liberal through and through until he tuned 60 or so.  Perhaps he could truly become a president that transcends party politics.  I sometimes have a tough time believing that he really just up and changes his views on things like abortion magically, overnight.  The downside is that there's a huge possibility that he just turns out to be a Republican than spends money like a Democrat and bankrupts us with his border wall and infrastructure projects.

Dude, the market is down 200 points. Big deal. Thats a normal day in the neighborhood considering how this year has gone. 

[Belsnickel]

(11-09-2016, 11:05 AM)samhain Wrote: We'll see how it goes. I hope the markets rebound fully as they seem to be starting some kind of recovery.

The market reactions are based more on the unknown of Trump. They will stabilize some, but there will continue to be some volatility until we know what we are getting ourselves into.

[CKwi88]

After my feelings of horror, I am absolutely fascinated by the results. You always hear about "who is going to carry the woman vote, the Latinos, the African Americans" Trump gave a big middle finger to the system and said to heck with it, I'm going after the whites. And it worked.

My first thought is that I hope our current SCOTUS justices hold on for as long as possible. I'm not too concerned with Trump doing irreparable harm in the next 4 years. The damage that a generation of an overwhelmingly conservative SCOTUS is much more worrisome for me.

[samhain]

(11-09-2016, 11:15 AM)WeezyBengal Wrote: Dude, the market is down 200 points. Big deal. Thats a normal day in the neighborhood considering how this year has gone. 

Given what happened after Britain voted for Brexit, there's no telling.  The market doesn't like unpredictability.

[samhain]

(11-09-2016, 11:17 AM)CKwi88 Wrote: After my feelings of horror, I am absolutely fascinated by the results. You always hear about "who is going to carry the woman vote, the Latinos, the African Americans" Trump gave a big middle finger to the system and said to heck with it, I'm going after the whites. And it worked.

My first thought is that I hope our current SCOTUS justices hold on for as long as possible. I'm not too concerned with Trump doing irreparable harm in the next 4 years. The damage that a generation of an overwhelmingly conservative SCOTUS is much more worrisome for me.

SCOTUS is never a sure thing.  Republican presidents have nominated judges that turned out to be a hell of a lot more liberal that expected on more than one occasion.  There's no telling how they will act when they're in.

[Belsnickel]

(11-09-2016, 10:56 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I don't think he is going to get rubber stamped by the Republican congress. I didn't see the final Senate numbers, but it will only take a few Republicans to stop anything, and there will be more than a few willing. Maybe Congress starts working together. Democrats are praying this continues to be the "party of no".

This was what I was saying to my wife. The Senate is the body of stability in our government and is typically (not always, but usually) the more pragmatic and responsible, they are the trustees of our country. It's either going to be 53-47 or 52-48 once all the votes are counted, I think, so it won't be easy to just push things through.

One thing to keep in mind, though, is that both chambers have been seeing a polarization as far as ideology is concerned. I don't know whether Trump's elected will serve to further that divide, or reverse it. It will be interesting to see. Policy mood in general tends to be a negative correlation to the ideology of the party in power, and it was more conservative now than it had been in the history of the measurement. So the trends that will occur now will be interesting to watch.

[GMDino]

(11-09-2016, 11:17 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: The market reactions are based more on the unknown of Trump. They will stabilize some, but there will continue to be some volatility until we know what we are getting ourselves into.

[Bengalzona]

(11-09-2016, 10:35 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: I will be interested to look at the data on the election on the demographics once it is compiled in more detail. This was the first election where boomers were outnumbered by the younger generations, and so I will be curious to see the breakdown.

I'm hearing some initial reports that it appears a lot of the younger people didn't vote. They were either convinced that Hillary had already wrapped up the election and their vote didn't matter or they were turned off by the whole campaign. Not that this doesn't happen in nearly every election, but it appears to be more prominent in this one.

My personal opinions:

It appears that the majority of the country has decided to see what the Republican Party is offering by granting them the presidency and majorities in both houses of Congress again. The last time this happened was 2004. They now have a chance to prove that what they propose is better for the people of this country. We will see how it goes.

I'll start with an open mind and see how things go from there. They have enough rope. They can build a rope bridge or hang themselves. The ball is in their court.

What I find tremendously disappointing this morning are the posts from Trump supporters who are still criticizing Hillary Clinton. Really? Your guy won the election and rather than talk about good things you expect will happen, you still feel it necessary to sling mud and tak about 'how bad it would have been' if she had won? Wow! The pessimistic vitriol is like a disease of the soul.

On the other hand, Arizona voters finally voted out Sheriff Joe Arpiao (after he wasted $50 million in taxpayer money fighting the Federal Government in a court battle where he was clearly guilty). My faith in the system is somewhat restored.