Prosecutors and Judges Need to Be Talked About More In Relation to Rising Crime

[Belsnickel]

So here's the issue. The problem with our criminal justice system is that it is not just the criminal justice system causing the problems. The social death enacted against criminals in this country, which results in difficulties getting a job, finding housing, and just general difficulty participating in society as someone that has served their time creates a perpetual cycle in which criminals continue to commit crimes because they see no other way to live. When that is combined with the systemic racism in the country that has created gross inequities as well as the perceived heavy-handedness of the system in general, it has caused many people to see the solution as being to lighten up on criminals. This is completely idiotic and ignores all of the actual issues that are at play creating the environment for criminal activity.

This is all, of course, a bit tangential to the systems put in place that attempt to streamline the criminal justice process that result in some of the issues we see in the first post. These policies are, and always have been, flawed. They stem from judicial systems being overburdened and underfunded, resulting in efforts to push cases through as efficiently as possible. That's how things like that often slip by in places where prosecutorial discretion isn't as loosey-goosey as what SSF is talking about.

Anyway, I don't have the solutions. I have just done some reading on the issues

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

Very germane and timely article from the San Francisco Chronicle.

https://www.sfchronicle.com/bayarea/article/Half-of-people-released-from-jail-in-San-16310162.php

Roughly half of people charged with crimes and released from jail before their trials in San Francisco in recent years failed to show up for court, and a similar share were accused of committing a new crime while free, a new study found.

More than 1 in 6 defendants allegedly committed a new violent offense, according to the findings from May 2016 to December 2019 published by the California Policy Lab, based at UC Berkeley and UCLA.

These are rather telling, and damning, numbers. Interestingly enough, this study covers the time Gascon was DA in San Francisco County, prior to moving on to attempt to destroy Los Angeles County as well.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-12-2021, 12:32 PM)Belsnickel Wrote: So here's the issue. The problem with our criminal justice system is that it is not just the criminal justice system causing the problems. The social death enacted against criminals in this country, which results in difficulties getting a job, finding housing, and just general difficulty participating in society as someone that has served their time creates a perpetual cycle in which criminals continue to commit crimes because they see no other way to live. When that is combined with the systemic racism in the country that has created gross inequities as well as the perceived heavy-handedness of the system in general, it has caused many people to see the solution as being to lighten up on criminals. This is completely idiotic and ignores all of the actual issues that are at play creating the environment for criminal activity.

This is all, of course, a bit tangential to the systems put in place that attempt to streamline the criminal justice process that result in some of the issues we see in the first post. These policies are, and always have been, flawed. They stem from judicial systems being overburdened and underfunded, resulting in efforts to push cases through as efficiently as possible. That's how things like that often slip by in places where prosecutorial discretion isn't as loosey-goosey as what SSF is talking about.

Anyway, I don't have the solutions. I have just done some reading on the issues

Yes, the "art" of the plea bargain certainly produces some uneven outcomes.  I have no doubt that some innocent people took deals to avoid a possibly worse outcome and to just get the process over with.  However, I don't think that number is substantial.

I completely agree with your assessment of the post incarceration criminal experience.  But, I also understand why businesses are reluctant to hire ex-cons as well.  As you say, there is no easy solution.

[*Nately120*]

(07-14-2021, 12:28 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Yes, the "art" of the plea bargain certainly produces some uneven outcomes.  I have no doubt that some innocent people took deals to avoid a possibly worse outcome and to just get the process over with.  However, I don't think that number is substantial.

I completely agree with your assessment of the post incarceration criminal experience.  But, I also understand why businesses are reluctant to hire ex-cons as well.  As you say, there is no easy solution.

Substantial is a subjective term when it comes to people accepting plea deals while innocent.  Particularly with the reality of incarceration having such a negative long term impact on life, as we've outlined.  

Im sure it's mostly just a stereotype but I can picture myself or anyone stuck with a PD who has about 10 minutes of free time to convince me to take a plea no matter what. 

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-14-2021, 12:46 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Substantial is a subjective term when it comes to people accepting plea deals while innocent.  Particularly with the reality of incarceration having such a negative long term impact on life, as we've outlined.  

Im sure it's mostly just a stereotype but I can picture myself or anyone stuck with a PD who has about 10 minutes of free time to convince me to take a plea no matter what. 

I can tell you that the DA doesn't file charges unless the case is very provable.  While certainly not on the level of the Feds, the DA's office, under a competent DA, isn't going to file charges they don't feel very confident about proving beyond a reasonable doubt.  That's why I don't think the number is significant at all, and likely very small.  But I get what you're saying, if it's even one person, and you're that one person, then it really sucks.

[Wes Mantooth]

Here's an update on the Golf Course Shooting: https://www.ajc.com/news/golf-course-shooting-suspect-knew-2-of-the-victims-friend-says/RX6DV5SFABHSVHGGQAQIMXXUPY/

Synposis:  The suspect knew the victims that were bound and gagged in the truck through the drug trade.  It goes over some of the other details mentioned in the original article I shared at the beginning of the thread.

One other interesting new detail though...

Harvey represented Rhoden in 2016, when the then-Georgia State University freshman was charged with shooting a 19-year-old in the chest following an attempted drug transaction, authorities said at the time.

The Fulton County District Attorney’s Office, led then by Paul Howard, later declined to prosecute either party. It’s unclear why.

Out of curiousity, I decided to google "Paul Howard DA" just to check out what type of incompentent and wreckless person would not prosecute either party when one was shot in the chest, both had potential gun charges, and there was drugs involved.  

Imagine my suprise when the very first thing that came up is this:  https://www.ajc.com/news/atlanta-news/federal-grand-jury-investigating-former-da-paul-howard/6MPFKJUXGJHDRL5IBX7UBOCPQM/

A federal grand jury in Atlanta is investigating former Fulton County District Attorney Paul Howard and his use of a nonprofit to pad his salary with almost $200,000 in city of Atlanta funds, The Atlanta Journal-Constitution and Channel 2 Action News have learned.

The criminal probe is focused on a series of checks totaling $195,000 that were signed over to Howard by People Partnering for Progress from 2014 to 2019. PPP, a nonprofit Howard has run as CEO, made the payments from two $125,000 checks it received from the city — one in August 2014 and another in September 2016.

The good news is that this man was defeated last August and is no longer the DA.  The bad news?  The person who defeated him used to work for him.  Maybe she'll be better though, but I wouldn't count on it.

[Wes Mantooth]

I also just wanted to put a face to the story.  This wife no longer has a husband, and these two young kids are now without a father due to the actions of the DA's Office and others in power.



This should be a much bigger story, but it will be lost in the sea that is corruption and incompetence.  You'll see more in the news today about the George Floyd memorial getting struck by lightening then you will about the updates I just provided, or this family being destroyed because of the failures of the court system.

[*Nately120*]

(07-14-2021, 02:13 PM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: I also just wanted to put a face to the story.  This wife no longer has a husband, and these two young kids are now without a father due to the actions of the DA's Office and others in power.


This should be a much bigger story, but it will be lost in the sea that is corruption and incompetence.  You'll see more in the news today about the George Floyd memorial getting struck by lightening then you will about the updates I just provided, or this family being destroyed because of  the failures of the court system.

In theory there is plenty of time to talk about this family as well as George Floyd, but the cynic in me knows that differentiation is what drives the headlines.  Bad guy kills good person/people may just be something we've become numb to.

[Wes Mantooth]

Here's yet another example of what I'm taking about...

https://news.yahoo.com/arrest-made-murder-case-michelle-210338691.html

https://www.capitalgazette.com/news/crime/ac-cn-michelle-cumming-homicide-20210714-20210714-mhz6obqttvbvnnp2cgqgplm7jq-story.html

Michelle Cummings was killed by a stray bullet, while sitting on a hotel patio in Annapolis, Maryland.  She was there for her sons induction into the Naval Academy.  

The suspect was previously charged in Febuary with assault and firearm possession.  

Then again in April he was charged yet again with firearm posession and drug posession.  He clearly didn't learn his lesson from two months earlier.

In this case, the prosectution actually asked he be held without bond.  The court eleceted him to placed on house arrest instead.  Well, guess what happened?  He cut off his ankle monitor in May and apparently wasn't tracked down until this murder (Late June).

Lets take a look at some crimes commited by the suspect prior to 2021.  In 2016 he plead to illegal possession a handgun, which he was prohibited from.  In 2013 he was charged in two seperate cases, possession of a handgun in a vehicle, and conspiracy to commit robbery.

Look at how many felony gun charges we have here.  One after another, after another.  And the courts give him house arrest?  For a guy that gets arrested in Feb and then right then again in April, and with that criminal history?  It makes no sense.

Now we have a mother dead, and a family in mourning, during a time which should have been a celebration.  Imagine going from celebrating the son getting inducted into something as special as the Naval Academy (he also due to join the football team) to having bury your mother or your wife.  And for what?  Because the courts failed this community and specifically this family.

[Wes Mantooth]

I want to put a picture to this story as well. This is Michelle Cummings and her family in Annapolis.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

(07-15-2021, 09:56 AM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Here's yet another example of what I'm taking about...

https://news.yahoo.com/arrest-made-murder-case-michelle-210338691.html

https://www.capitalgazette.com/news/crime/ac-cn-michelle-cumming-homicide-20210714-20210714-mhz6obqttvbvnnp2cgqgplm7jq-story.html

Michelle Cummings was killed by a stray bullet, while sitting on a hotel patio in Annapolis, Maryland.  She was there for her sons induction into the Naval Academy.  

The suspect was charged in Febuary with assault and firearm possession.  

Then again in April he was charged yet again with firearm posession and drug posession.  He clearly didn't learn his lesson from two months earlier.

In this case, the prosectution actually asked he be held without bond.  The court eleceted him to placed on house arrest instead.  Well, guess what happened?  He cut off his ankle monitor in May and apparently wasn't tracked down until this murder (Late June).

Lets take a look at some crimes commited by the suspect prior to 2021.  In 2016 he plead to illegal possession a handgun, which he was prohibited from.  In 2013 he was charged in two seperate cases, possession of a handgun in a vehicle, and conspiracy to commit robbery.

Look at how many felony gun charges we have here.  One after another, after another.  And the courts give him house arrest?  For a guy that gets arrested in Feb and then right then again in April, and with that criminal history?  It makes no sense.

Now we have a mother dead, and a family in mourning, during a time which should have been a celebration.  Imagine going from celebrating the son getting inducted into something as special as the Naval Academy (he also due to join the football team) to having bury your mother or your wife.  And for what?  Because the courts failed this community and specifically this family.

But we're super concerned about gun violence, hence the need for "common sense gun control". 

The intellectual dishonesty would be amusing if it didn't have such horrible consequences.

[masonbengals fan]

(07-15-2021, 09:56 AM)Wes Mantooth Wrote: Here's yet another example of what I'm taking about...

https://news.yahoo.com/arrest-made-murder-case-michelle-210338691.html

https://www.capitalgazette.com/news/crime/ac-cn-michelle-cumming-homicide-20210714-20210714-mhz6obqttvbvnnp2cgqgplm7jq-story.html

Michelle Cummings was killed by a stray bullet, while sitting on a hotel patio in Annapolis, Maryland.  She was there for her sons induction into the Naval Academy.  

The suspect was charged in Febuary with assault and firearm possession.  

Then again in April he was charged yet again with firearm posession and drug posession.  He clearly didn't learn his lesson from two months earlier.

In this case, the prosectution actually asked he be held without bond.  The court eleceted him to placed on house arrest instead.  Well, guess what happened?  He cut off his ankle monitor in May and apparently wasn't tracked down until this murder (Late June).

Lets take a look at some crimes commited by the suspect prior to 2021.  In 2016 he plead to illegal possession a handgun, which he was prohibited from.  In 2013 he was charged in two seperate cases, possession of a handgun in a vehicle, and conspiracy to commit robbery.

Look at how many felony gun charges we have here.  One after another, after another.  And the courts give him house arrest?  For a guy that gets arrested in Feb and then right then again in April, and with that criminal history?  It makes no sense.

Now we have a mother dead, and a family in mourning, during a time which should have been a celebration.  Imagine going from celebrating the son getting inducted into something as special as the Naval Academy (he also due to join the football team) to having bury your mother or your wife.  And for what?  Because the courts failed this community and specifically this family.

 There's literally no legitimate excuse for that. None...