Protesters topple Confederate statue in NC

[Millhouse]

I have said I am fully in favor in tearing down statues of Confederates on non-historical grounds with no history tied to that spot. For example, I am 1000% against tearing down the statue of Robert E. Lee sitting atop his horse Traveler at Gettysburg on the spot where he met his troops coming back from the failed Picket's Charge that ended the battle. But if it is a statue of Lee in city park of Arkansas for example, so be it, because there is no historical ties to that spot.

But I am against tearing down statues like these protesters did. If it is to be torn down, it should be decided by the city council and local governments, if not by the Governor if he/she so desires. Not by a mob though. All this will do is hurt their cause for wanting these city or city park statues to come down, and inflame folks that were borderline on it to oppose them in the future if they try it again.


http://www.wcpo.com/news/national/protesters-take-down-confederate-statue-in-durham

Quote:As the racial unrest stirred by a neo-Nazi rally in Virginia on Saturday continued throughout the nation on Monday, a group of demonstrators took down a statue of a Confederate soldier outside a courthouse in Durham, North Carolina.

According to the News Observer, nearly 100 demonstrators, describing themselves as anti-fascists, used a ladder to tie a rope around the statue. The crowd used the rope to pull the statue to the ground.

Video of the incident shows the crowd kicking the statue, as others in the crowd cheered on.

The statue has stood outside the courthouse since 1924.

According to a Facebook event page, the protest was organized by the Workers World Party Durham Branch. The protest was organized to demand the removal of all Confederate symbols.

The News Observer reported that members of the Durham County Sheriff’s Office were on hand, but did not get involved. Instead, deputies videotaped the incident.

“Charlottesville and racist monuments across the country are the result of centuries of white supremacy,” Alissa Ellis, a member of Workers World Party Durham branch, told the News Observer. “But we cannot ignore the fact that the current Trump administration has emboldened more Nazis, KKK, and white supremacists to target, brutalize, and kill our communities,”

The protest in Durham was one of many taking place across the country Monday evening. One of the largest rallies against white supremacy was in New York City, outside of President Donald Trump residence. Trump is expected to spend the night in his New York apartment.

[GMDino]

I agree. Saw this on the news. There is no place for the destruction of property.  Go through the legal means. 

This..just makes them look bad...and it IS bad.

[RoyleRedlegs]

Simpsons did it.

[StLucieBengal]

What a joke.

This is reason 5,689 why no one respects leftists.

[BmorePat87]

The statues need to go, but doing it this route amounts to vandalism. The small l libertarian in me says "well, at least the city doesn't have to pay to have it removed now".

[Dill]

(08-15-2017, 12:16 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: What a joke.  

This is reason 5,689 why no one respects leftists.

Someone must respect "leftists" if they control the country and MSM, right?

[Millhouse]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2017/08/15/gettysburg-park-officials-confederate-monuments-here-stay/570779001/

Gettysburg National Park said they will not remove any Confederate statue or monument within the park. And rightfully so, because this is where history actually happened. This isnt some city park or a courthouse, but where a battle actually took place. And all of the monuments/statues there are on the location of what they represent. I truly hope people will recognize the difference of statues/monuments where battles took place, where someone is buried, or somewhere of historical significance as opposed to city parks & courthouses that lack that similar connection to a historical event that occurred there.

[GMDino]

(08-16-2017, 02:25 PM)Millhouse Wrote: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2017/08/15/gettysburg-park-officials-confederate-monuments-here-stay/570779001/

Gettysburg National Park said they will not remove any Confederate statue or monument within the park. And rightfully so, because this is where history actually happened. This isnt some city park or a courthouse, but where a battle actually took place. And all of the monuments/statues there are on the location of what they represent. I truly hope people will recognize the difference of statues/monuments where battles took place, where someone is buried, or somewhere of historical significance as opposed to city parks & courthouses that lack that.

Good for them.  That is the equivalent of a museum in my eyes.

[hollodero]

(08-15-2017, 12:16 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: What a joke.  

This is reason 5,689 why no one respects leftists.

This is a perfect example for the mental knots of people playing team me and team other side.

Nazis, supremacists, people who drive cars in a group of people... they aren't my team, this isn't the right, dumb leftists implying otherwise.

But on the other hand, one person from the left equals all people from the left. Suddenly there's no nuance.

Add in this strange "no one" rhetorics used by Trump and his followers now. "Everybody" knows, "nobody" knew... - All so cheap rhetorical tricks. The tricks bother me less than the cheapness of it. At least be a bit more sophisticated.

[SunsetBengal]

(08-16-2017, 02:25 PM)Millhouse Wrote: https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation-now/2017/08/15/gettysburg-park-officials-confederate-monuments-here-stay/570779001/

Gettysburg National Park said they will not remove any Confederate statue or monument within the park. And rightfully so, because this is where history actually happened. This isnt some city park or a courthouse, but where a battle actually took place. And all of the monuments/statues there are on the location of what they represent. I truly hope people will recognize the difference of statues/monuments where battles took place, where someone is buried, or somewhere of historical significance as opposed to city parks & courthouses that lack that similar connection to a historical event that occurred there.

I can completely agree that places like those bolded are no place for those sort of "reminders".  In a city park is essentially saying "Look here, bothas and sistas, this is our town and always will be.  Know your role".  In front of a courthouse?  C;mon, what black citizen actually thinks they can have a legitimate shot at a fair trial, with that sort of nostalgia staring them in the face, as they enter the building?

While it is long past time for those statues to go, going about it with a mob mentality is completely unacceptable.  4 were arrested in connection with the crimes, this woman getting the most and biggest of the charges.

http://abc11.com/politics/protester-who-pulled-down-durham-statue-arrested/2309889/

But, in historical spots?  Absolutely they should be preserved.

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

http://www.cbc.ca/radio/day6/episode-224-isis-war-on-history-nazi-royals-mcdonalds-in-decline-and-more-1.2990417/10-historical-sites-destroyed-by-isis-and-why-they-matter-1.2990449

(That said, I agree courthouses and the like have no business having the statues, unless it's a historical courthouse where a battle happened or something.)

[treee]

(08-15-2017, 12:16 AM)StLucieBengal Wrote: What a joke.

This is reason 5,689 why no one respects leftists.

The above quoted post is example 5,689 of meaningless partisan drivel.

[GMDino]

So a rouge group pulls down (illegally) a statue and everyone here agrees it was wrong, and they were wrong, and needs to be done the right way even if we agree that the statues don't belong there.

General agreement and no "...but look what the other side does..." arguments.

Yet some people still trying to justify Nazis in other threads because...uh...lefties!!!  Amazing.

[SunsetBengal]

(08-17-2017, 07:55 AM)GMDino Wrote: So a rouge group pulls down (illegally) a statue and everyone here agrees it was wrong, and they were wrong, and needs to be done the right way even if we agree that the statues don't belong there.

General agreement and no "...but look what the other side does..." arguments.

Yet some people still trying to justify Nazis in other threads because...uh...lefties!!!  Amazing.

Speaking of, did you see the story about the people in Atlanta?  They defaced and attempted to tear down the peace statue, thinking it was a confederate memorial.

Gotta love mob mentality.  Give us a statue, any statue, they all look the same, anyway! 

[Belsnickel]

(08-17-2017, 08:41 AM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Speaking of, did you see the story about the people in Atlanta?  They defaced and attempted to tear down the peace statue, thinking it was a confederate memorial.

Gotta love mob mentality.  Give us a statue, any statue, they all look the same, anyway! 

It's all idolatry.

[THE Bigzoman]

"These things shouldn't be in public. If you want to see history, put em in a museum.

Proceeds to destroy said thing.



Ooooookayyu

[*TheLeonardLeap*]

On the topic of erasing history where it belongs... this seemed as good of a thread as any for this.

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Six-Flags-Over-Texas-Removes-Confederate-Flags-From-Park-441026123.html

It wasn't even the Confederate battle flag that gets flown off some Uncle-Brother's truck. It was this:

...along with the French, Spanish, Mexican, and Republic of Texas, and American flags. The 6 different flags representing the 6 different countries Texas had been part of in it's history, and where the Six Flags name came from. Now the 5 non-American ones are being replaced by 5 more American Flags.

[Belsnickel]

(08-19-2017, 11:13 PM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: On the topic of erasing history where it belongs... this seemed as good of a thread as any for this.

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Six-Flags-Over-Texas-Removes-Confederate-Flags-From-Park-441026123.html

It wasn't even the Confederate battle flag that gets flown off some Uncle-Brother's truck. It was this:

...along with the French, Spanish, Mexican, and Republic of Texas, and American flags. The 6 different flags representing the 6 different countries Texas had been part of in it's history, and where the Six Flags name came from. Now the 5 non-American ones are being replaced by 5 more American Flags.

That's interesting. I'd be curious to know how much push they got to do this, and how much push back they will get for doing it.

I will say, though, that even though they flew the Stars and Bars and not the Southern Cross, it's still the symbol of something that is considered to be a traitorous cause to the United States, a cause that went to war to maintain the institution of slavery.

[SunsetBengal]

..

[GMDino]

(08-20-2017, 07:46 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: That's interesting. I'd be curious to know how much push they got to do this, and how much push back they will get for doing it.

I will say, though, that even though they flew the Stars and Bars and not the Southern Cross, it's still the symbol of something that is considered to be a traitorous cause to the United States, a cause that went to war to maintain the institution of slavery.

Indeed.

http://www.historynet.com/embattled-banner-the-convoluted-history-of-the-confederate-flag.htm

I do like how people say that's not what it represents...when the guy who created it said it did though.