So, QAnon....

[samhain]

I've been paying passing attention to the QAnon movement for may be a little over a year. Back in the day, I used to have a good laugh listening to Art Bell and later George Noory on the 3rd shift-friendly early am hour airwaves. The'd talk about everything from aliens to demonic possession and even some gubmint-related conspiracy material every night on my drive home. It was entertaining, but I always felt a bit sorry for the guests or callers, as they were absolutely invested in the totally laughable material that the hosts discussed nightly. Bringing anything on the program as anything other than a joke would likely get you laughed out of any dinner conversation.

So now we have QAnon. This time, it's a secret squirrel operative spilling secrets in cryptic tweets with far-right narratives built in. Pizzagate is probably the best-known example of their buffoonery. Another, which came into existence during early Covid panic involves human-animal hybrid children being marketed by liberal Satanic cults in underground facilities. Allegedly, Trump and the right were using Covid as a cover to free these unfortunate souls from their captors/creators.

So, I guess I'm just trying to see how board members feel about this and why it came to be a thing that adults literally swear oaths to. I don't see a lot of people in P&R that I think are overly susceptible to this stuff, but Jungle Noise is a different story, likely chocked with these believers. Why are we so easily manipulated by anything that even remotely reassures our political leanings? Why, without any substantial evidence of these theories bearing out does the movement grow rather than contract and disappear? Are people so unsatisfied with actual reality that they want someone to create a new one?

[treee]

Well aside from the charged terminology 'conspiracy theory' (conspiring happens all the time), part of the draw of some of the crazier conspiracy theories is that they make people feel more in control and intelligent. They 'get it' (ie understand the hidden reality of things) and the rest of the sheep don't.

[samhain]

(07-17-2020, 11:20 PM)treee Wrote: Well aside from the charged terminology 'conspiracy theory' (conspiring happens all the time), part of the draw of some of the crazier conspiracy theories is that they make people feel more in control and intelligent. They 'get it' (ie understand the hidden reality of things) and the rest of the sheep don't.

Yeah, I see the word sheeple tossed around frequently.  It's corny as hell.  Makes me think of a car commercial from the 90's.  

[Belsnickel]

(07-17-2020, 11:20 PM)treee Wrote: Well aside from the charged terminology 'conspiracy theory' (conspiring happens all the time), part of the draw of some of the crazier conspiracy theories is that they make people feel more in control and intelligent. They 'get it' (ie understand the hidden reality of things) and the rest of the sheep don't.

Yeah, psychologically speaking these movements getting traction makes a ton of sense. I remember this sort of thing being discussed in a social psych class and how it helps to alleviate dissonance. When people have a hard time making sense of the world it can be uncomfortable, i.e. dissonance. Things like Q and other "conspiracy theories" help people reconcile that dissonance.

As for the overall OP and getting into how it all fits into general society and our political theater, well, it's an unfortunate truth of a democracy. The First Amendment protects this dumbassery and allows those engaged in it to vote. Not a ton we can do about it.

[fredtoast]

Shady is supposed to be a college professor and he claimed to believe the Q story.

Just saw that the leader of the NYPD union just gave an interview on Fox with a Q-anon symbol behind him.

It is not funny when people like that start believing.

[samhain]

(07-18-2020, 10:17 AM)fredtoast Wrote: Shady is supposed to be a college professor and he claimed to believe the Q story.

Just saw that the leader of the NYPD union just gave an interview on Fox with a Q-anon symbol behind him.

It is not funny when people like that start believing.

The Union guy claimed that the coffee mug wasn't his and nor was the office.  I suppose I take him at his word.  As for college professors, believe it or not, I once had a straight up Holocaust denier teaching a European history class I went to.  To be fair, this was at a Community College, and he wasn't a doc in the true sense of the word (yet).  He did not appear to be a fan of Jews and he wasn't really good at hiding it.

I think Mike Flynn endorsing it bothers me the most.  I know he's a Trump critter to the core, but an actual military general believing this stuff is, uh, something, I guess.  

I refuse to lock into the idea, but I almost feel like it's a big joke being played on these people.  A sort of Psy-op for lack of a better term.  Think like a high-level troll-job gone completely wrong.  

QAnon is scary, but the scariest part might be what it says about groupthink in general.  If people will believe this shit and swear an oath in it's name, then what won't they believe?  Is there anything? Any non-judicial group wanting me to swear an oath is going to throw a big red flag in my head.  Could you make them think that they need to exterminate Jews and liberals to stop Satan from completely taking over the nation?  I don't think it's a stretch, and with membership in these groups growing, people that don't line up with what Q accepts as "woke" better start paying attention.

[NATI BENGALS]

^
Don’t look now. But a certain political party, ya know the one responsible for putting a science denying conman in power that has us in the real life shitshow we are in now, are voting these Q morons into power.

[samhain]

(07-18-2020, 02:43 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: ^
Don’t look now. But a certain political party, ya know the one responsible for putting a science denying conman in power that has us in the real life shitshow we are in now, are voting these Q morons into power.

I've seen a case of that in Oregon.  This isn't even Idiocracy anymore, it's worse.  

[BmorePat87]

We went over conspiracy theories in class when we discussed fake news and sourcing things you find online.

A few weeks later when we went all online, a kid sent me a message and asked about this one conspiracy theory video that had gotten big on youtube around April. I went through and explained the origins and how it has been discredited and debunked. He replied "thanks for your opinion. You should watch it if you get a chance".

dagger in the heart...

[SunsetBengal]

(07-18-2020, 09:35 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: We went over conspiracy theories in class when we discussed fake news and sourcing things you find online.

A few weeks later when we went all online, a kid sent me a message and asked about this one conspiracy theory video that had gotten big on youtube around April. I went through and explained the origins and how it has been discredited and debunked. He replied "thanks for your opinion. You should watch it if you get a chance".

dagger in the heart...

If a student was able to decipher your political side, and call you out on it like that.  Perhaps you should not be teaching?  When I grew up, I couldn't tell what my educator's political leanings were.  Isn't that the way it's supposed to be?

[BmorePat87]

(07-18-2020, 09:59 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: If a student was able to decipher your political side, and call you out on it like that.  Perhaps you should not be teaching?  When I grew up, I couldn't tell what my educator's political leanings were.  Isn't that the way it's supposed to be?

lol, what?


He asked about a conspiracy theory. I pointed to factual inaccuracies and how law enforcement debunked it. I'm not sure how that is showing a political side, but I guess this a pathetic attempt at a cheap shot on my character. 

[SunsetBengal]

(07-18-2020, 10:05 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: lol, what?


He asked about a conspiracy theory. I pointed to factual inaccuracies and how law enforcement debunked it. I'm not sure how that is showing a political side, but I guess this a pathetic attempt at a cheap shot on my character. 

Not a cheap shot at anything about you.  I generally respect most of your opinions.  Lately, your's have taken a hard turn.  Perhaps this student that you mentioned, noticed it too?

[BmorePat87]

(07-18-2020, 10:11 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: Not a cheap shot at anything about you.  I generally respect most of your opinions.  Lately, your's have taken a hard turn.  Perhaps this student that you mentioned, noticed it too?

Perhaps you can explain how pointing out factual inaccuracies and the authorities debunking a conspiracy theory is me and my opinions "taking a hard turn"?

That would potentially help to explain how your response was in no way meant as an attack on my character. 

[CJD]

As a wise man once said:

Quote:A person is smart. People are dumb, panicky dangerous animals and you know it. Fifteen hundred years ago everybody knew the Earth was the center of the universe. Five hundred years ago, everybody knew the Earth was flat, and fifteen minutes ago, you knew that humans were alone on this planet. Imagine what you'll know tomorrow.

When people gather anonymously, the stupidest, most bold people often draw the most attention. The sad part of that quote is that, since that movie came out, Flat Earthers have re-emerged.

[*jason*]

(07-18-2020, 09:59 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: If a student was able to decipher your political side, and call you out on it like that.  Perhaps you should not be teaching?  When I grew up, I couldn't tell what my educator's political leanings were.  Isn't that the way it's supposed to be?

When you and I grew up there was also an accepted subjective truth... Everyone got their news from the same sources, and there was no internet.

[SunsetBengal]

(07-18-2020, 10:34 PM)jason Wrote: When you and I grew up there was also an accepted subjective truth... Everyone got their news from the same sources, and there was no internet.

You are correct about an accepted truth, as well as the fact that there was no internet.  However, I am a believer that educators should stick to subject matter when teaching class.  Teaching from a particular point of view is more like indoctrination, rather than education.

My wife is a Masters educated teacher.  She abandoned classroom teaching, as she was uncomfortable with the political climate of the administration, as well as the attitude of the parents she had to interact with, teaching in the city.  Now, she is a Social Worker, dealing with families of many similar children that she used to educate.  The difference is that now she feels enabled to actually help those kids, where as a classroom teacher, her hands were tied.  

[samhain]

(07-18-2020, 10:33 PM)Crazyjdawg Wrote: As a wise man once said:

When people gather anonymously, the stupidest, most bold people often draw the most attention. The sad part of that quote is that, since that movie came out, Flat Earthers have re-emerged.

It's strange, but to me it seems like things like flat-earth theory start out as jokes.  Eventually, however, certain people begin to join the "team" that aren't quite stable or are just plain dumb, and it becomes less funny.  

All of this shit used to be really entertaining to me personally.  I watched Alex Jones go on about Bohemian Grove and political cabals on public access in the early aughts.  He was funny and seemed too absurd to be taken seriously.  Now "repesctable" people that have kids and real jobs look to him as a source of information.  He's talked to the friggin' POTUS for Christ's sake.  

I went on a business trip to Dallas last year with a manager from work that I always respected and loved working for.  He's no simpleton at all.  I made a joke about chemtrails as we watched planes taking off at DFW before we left and he proceeded to launch into a 45 minute diatribe about what chemtrails are, who's behind them, and why.  I laughed my ass off and made snide remarks until I realized he was dead serious.  It made me genuinely sad.

[samhain]

(07-18-2020, 10:55 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: You are correct about an accepted truth, as well as the fact that there was no internet.  However, I am a believer that educators should stick to subject matter when teaching class.  Teaching from a particular point of view is more like indoctrination, rather than education.

My wife is a Masters educated teacher.  She abandoned classroom teaching, as she was uncomfortable with the political climate of the administration, as well as the attitude of the parents she had to interact with, teaching in the city.  Now, she is a Social Worker, dealing with families of many similar children that she used to educate.  The difference is that now she feels enabled to actually help those kids, where as a classroom teacher, her hands were tied.  

I think people are all about objectivity and "keeping politics out" unless the politics inserted just happen to be their own.  It's a futile discussion.  I don't give a single shit about the politics of my employer as long as the check clears every other Friday.  My interests politically are my own and my employer's are theirs.  The relationship is a financial one and that's it.  

[NATI BENGALS]

(07-18-2020, 09:59 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: If a student was able to decipher your political side, and call you out on it like that.  Perhaps you should not be teaching?  When I grew up, I couldn't tell what my educator's political leanings were.  Isn't that the way it's supposed to be?

See here is the thing. We actually need more people teaching who know how to fact find and teach students how to seek the truth.

Perhaps you should go back to school, being able to call bullshit on an internet conspiracy theory video sadly is a needed life skill now days and being able to do so doesn’t indicate your “political side.”

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(07-18-2020, 09:59 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: If a student was able to decipher your political side, and call you out on it like that.  Perhaps you should not be teaching?  When I grew up, I couldn't tell what my educator's political leanings were.  Isn't that the way it's supposed to be?

WTF?