A sense of community

[Belsnickel]

Is that what we're missing?

I started thinking about this after a discussion on reddit in the r/VAGuns sub. Someone made the comment that "it is always better to buy online." When I asked about it, the answer was cost related, which I understand the motivation. But I argued that supporting a local business, keeping the money in the community, was more important to me. I also asked what they would do when they put all of their local FFLs out of business, but that point isn't as important to this thread.

I feel like this trend we have seen that is pushing brick and mortar businesses out of business is also what we see with a more divided America. I know there have been discussions about this before, that this lack of community caused the animosity that we see growing in this country, the otherizing of those that don't agree with you. We've become so impersonal in our society, today. I'm not saying I am any better than most. I do a lot of ordering from Amazon. I am making an effort to change my habits, though, and keep those purchases to those that aren't available from a local seller.

Just some thoughts I had because of that conversation and how it relates to the way we view folks opposite us in the political spectrum these days. When we don't interact with other people, it makes it easier to see them as "less than."

[GMDino]

(05-01-2019, 08:41 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Is that what we're missing?

I started thinking about this after a discussion on reddit in the r/VAGuns sub. Someone made the comment that "it is always better to buy online." When I asked about it, the answer was cost related, which I understand the motivation. But I argued that supporting a local business, keeping the money in the community, was more important to me. I also asked what they would do when they put all of their local FFLs out of business, but that point isn't as important to this thread.

I feel like this trend we have seen that is pushing brick and mortar businesses out of business is also what we see with a more divided America. I know there have been discussions about this before, that this lack of community caused the animosity that we see growing in this country, the otherizing of those that don't agree with you. We've become so impersonal in our society, today. I'm not saying I am any better than most. I do a lot of ordering from Amazon. I am making an effort to change my habits, though, and keep those purchases to those that aren't available from a local seller.

Just some thoughts I had because of that conversation and how it relates to the way we view folks opposite us in the political spectrum these days. When we don't interact with other people, it makes it easier to see them as "less than."

I've gone on rants about this.

In addition to your good point that people do not think in the terms of a "neighborhood" anymore we don't have that "thing" that touches all our lives.

We do not have a true sense of "us" in this country.  We are splintered in virtually every aspect of our lives.  From politics, to religion to which shows we watch on television.  

The hardest thing to do is to try and even see the other person's view.  But that has always been the case.  It's my belief that these differences are just amplified to the nth degree because we see them more.  "Year of the Shark" thinking.  When the majority of the news and public figures only speak in absolutes and "the biggest" The greatest" "like never before" it feeds the ones who don't remember or who don't want to think.

Lack of thinking/research/questioning is a cause and result of the problem.

[*michaelsean*]

I've disengaged a lot from national politics. It started even before Trump. I joined the neighborhood facebook page, which for me is like chairing some community board. I do like walking my dog around the neighborhood and saying hi to whomever I see, but you'd be surprised at the number of people who don't say anything or even nod in return. It's not the majority or anything, but it's still really odd.

I buy all my books on Kindle. It's just better.

[Belsnickel]

(05-01-2019, 09:44 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I've disengaged a lot from national politics. It started even before Trump. I joined the neighborhood facebook page, which for me is like chairing some community board. I do like walking my dog around the neighborhood and saying hi to whomever I see, but you'd be surprised at the number of people who don't say anything or even nod in return. It's not the majority or anything, but it's still really odd.

Since moving into my neighborhood, none of my immediate neighbors have said anything to me. They are all of a similar age to me. The folks down the street, though, have been more "neighborly." Honestly, what I talk about on here is all the national politics I can stomach, anymore. I focus a lot on state and local, but national level stuff is just disgusting.

(05-01-2019, 09:44 AM)michaelsean Wrote: I buy all my books on Kindle. It's just better.

Paper is best, you heathen!

[*bfine32*]

I live on a cul-de-sac and each year our street combines for a 4th of July Fireworks display. It's nothing planned, we just know the street is impassable. I thinking about passing out fliers this year to make it something more planned: ie cookout, ect..But I fear losing what we currently have as no one on the street is more than "waiving Hi' friendly on the street

[Benton]

Good topic, and you may be onto something.

A couple years ago I got to listen. To a speech by state justice bill Cunningham (father of "air horn " rep. Joe cunningham). He was soeaking to a veterans group. The nutshell was, he was talking a out how his generation had been raised by the guys who came back from WWii (he was a Vietnam veteran). Those guys gave the kids some direction, either for the kids whose dad's didn't make it home or just in the way you should be a part of your community. Bill said we dont have that any more, for a number of reasons, and I tend to agree. And I think we're a lot worse off as kids are growing g up without direction or a sense of community.

[Belsnickel]

(05-01-2019, 12:24 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I live on a cul-de-sac and each year our street combines for a 4th of July Fireworks display. It's nothing planned, we just know the street is impassable. I thinking about passing out fliers this year to make it something more planned: ie cookout, ect..But I fear losing what we currently have as no one on the street is more than "waiving Hi' friendly on the street

I'm on a cul-de-sac as well, and that's about where things are, here. Though I don't think a fireworks display will be a thing since even sparklers are illegal in this city. Though I know there are some common interests among the neighborhood, including many of us working for the university and/or being graduates from here. Being the new one to the neighborhood I feel weird inserting myself into all of that.

[fredtoast]

(05-01-2019, 02:56 PM)Belsnickel Wrote:  Being the new one to the neighborhood I feel weird inserting myself into all of that.

Have some sort of event to invite all your neighbors over.  Even if you never speak to them again it is important to at least learn faces and have your neighbors recognize who you are.

One time I moved into a new neighborhood and after a couple of months my car would not start because of a dead battery.  I went to my neighbors house to see if he could give me a jump.  He did not recognize me as his neighbor and did not trust me enough to come over and give me a jump.  I don't really blame him.  It was after dark and he did not know who I was. 

[fredtoast]

As to the OP I have said this same thing before. Before the internet and social media people were forced to interact with the people who lived around them instead of the people who agree with their beliefs. I am sure neighbors disagreed with each other, but it is hard to get nasty with a person who you share local concerns with or who has helped you catch your runaway dog or something like that.

[*bfine32*]

(05-01-2019, 03:23 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Have some sort of event to invite all your neighbors over.  Even if you never speak to them again it is important to at least learn faces and have your neighbors recognize who you are.

One time I moved into a new neighborhood and after a couple of months my car would not start because of a dead battery.  I went to my neighbors house to see if he could give me a jump.  He did not recognize me as his neighbor and did not trust me enough to come over and give me a jump.  I don't really blame him.  It was after dark and he did not know who I was. 

I've invited the neighbors over to cut/edge my lawn, trim bushes, and clear out my fence roll. 

[*michaelsean*]

(05-01-2019, 06:15 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I've invited the neighbors over to cut/edge my lawn, trim bushes, and clear out my fence roll. 

Did you offer them an apple core? You have to offer them an apple core. Or wait they have to give you an apple core so you’ll let them. I got nothing.

[*Nately120*]

My life is better now, but I've lived in areas where being nice to people is an invitation to be stolen from/taken advantage of. I've spent too much of my life around people who go directly for those who are nice to them and it doesn't shake off easily.

[Sociopathicsteelerfan]

I've had this conversation with friends many times. I was born in '74 (stated for time frame purposes). Based on television alone I had a huge connection with people who grew up before me or at the same time. We all watched Love Boat, Magnum PI or Fantasy Island. I grew up watching Happy Days and Gilligan's Island. I saw the Patty Duke Show, Mr. Ed and the Andy Griffith Show. I knew who Ed Sullivan was, why Orson Welles became famous etc. I could go on in the same way about music but you get the point. I have way more in common with a person born in the 40's-60's than I do with a person born in the mid to late nineties.

My sister has a senior position at a major clothing retailer and they obviously employ a lot of younger people. They legitimately don't know a damn thing about anything that happened before the year 2000. I suppose the myriad options for entertainment have something to do with it, but there's certainly a complete disconnect from what came before for the vast majority of them and it extends outside the realm of entertainment.

[Dill]

(05-01-2019, 01:08 PM)Benton Wrote: Good topic, and you may be onto something.

A couple years ago I got to listen. To a speech by state justice bill Cunningham (father of "air horn " rep. Joe cunningham). He was soeaking to a veterans group. The nutshell was, he was talking a out how his generation had been raised by the guys who came back from WWii (he was a Vietnam veteran). Those guys gave the kids some direction, either for the kids whose dad's didn't make it home or just in the way you should be a part of your community. Bill said we dont have that any more, for a number of reasons, and I tend to agree. And I think we're a lot worse off as kids are growing g up without direction or a sense of community.

(05-02-2019, 05:38 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I've had this conversation with friends many times.  I was born in '74 (stated for time frame purposes).  Based on television alone I had a huge connection with people who grew up before me or at the same time.  We all watched Love Boat, Magnum PI or Fantasy Island.  I grew up watching Happy Days and Gilligan's Island.  I saw the Patty Duke Show, Mr. Ed and the Andy Griffith Show.  I knew who Ed Sullivan was, why Orson Welles became famous etc.  I could go on in the same way about music but you get the point.  I have way more in common with a person born in the 40's-60's than I do with a person born in the mid to late nineties.

My sister has a senior position at a major clothing retailer and they obviously employ a lot of younger people.  They legitimately don't know a damn thing about anything that happened before the year 2000.  I suppose the myriad options for entertainment have something to do with it, but there's certainly a complete disconnect from what came before for the vast majority of them and it extends outside the realm of entertainment.

Two comments on these posts:

First, Benton's brought back some memories.  When I was a kid in 50s and 60s, most of the older men I know, my uncles and my father's friends, church members, teachers, etc. were veterans of WWII and Korea.  I remember spending a weekend at an irrigation shack on the Yellowstone with a friend of my fathers, who gave me a .50 cal. cartridge, which I put on my dresser as a conversation piece. Not that I needed direction, but my father thought it would be good for me to spend time with the guy.  He put me to work on local ranches as well. When I was 14 I spent a summer in Texas working on an uncle's farm, so I would understand more about farming etc. Teaching youth was the responsibility of parents, but everyone in the community could pitch in. There was a difference between adults and children.

Second, SSF raises an interesting point.  I was a freshman in HS in 1965, 20 years AFTER the end of WWII. Everyone I knew back then knew why WWII had been fought and who our adversaries were (though some sometimes mixed Germans with Soviets). Teachers and other elders, of course, but also everyone my age. After 1985, I started meeting young people who could not tell me whom the US had been fighting in Vietnam, or why.  Now I meet young people who are not sure why the US is in AFghanistan (though they have all heard of 9/11) or why there was a war in Iraq. Many have not heard of the Korean War. They know Vietnam was fought in the Jungle, and very little about WWII.  They recognize Hitler, but don't always know the U.S. fought Japan.  They think its ok to know those things--if you are interested.  Just as some people like fishing or collecting old records.  No reason to push that info on everyone, though.  

SSF remembers Ed Sullivan, Gilligan's Island, and Andy Griffith, all off the air before he was born. Now many young people not only don't remember shows from the 90s, but the tv/cable offerings are so diverse, they don't even share current programs the way people did back in the 60s and 70s.  I used to think the exceptions should be enormously popular movies like the Star Trek series and Star Wars, but now I meet some who have heard of these movies but have not seen them, though they may recognize Spock and Darth as pop cultural icons. No more stories in common.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(05-03-2019, 03:05 PM)Dill Wrote: Two comments on these posts:

First, Benton's brought back some memories.  When I was a kid in 50s and 60s, most of the older men I know, my uncles and my father's friends, church members, teachers, etc. were veterans of WWII and Korea.  I remember spending a weekend at an irrigation shack on the Yellowstone with a friend of my fathers, who gave me a .50 cal. cartridge, which I put on my dresser as a conversation piece. Not that I needed direction, but my father thought it would be good for me to spend time with the guy.  He put me to work on local ranches as well. When I was 14 I spent a summer in Texas working on an uncle's farm, so I would understand more about farming etc. Teaching youth was the responsibility of parents, but everyone in the community could pitch in. There was a difference between adults and children.

Second, SSF raises an interesting point.  I was a freshman in HS in 1965, 20 years AFTER the end of WWII. Everyone I knew back then knew why WWII had been fought and who our adversaries were (though some sometimes mixed Germans with Soviets). Teachers and other elders, of course, but also everyone my age. After 1985, I started meeting young people who could not tell me whom the US had been fighting in Vietnam, or why.  Now I meet young people who are not sure why the US is in AFghanistan (though they have all heard of 9/11) or why there was a war in Iraq. Many have not heard of the Korean War. They know Vietnam was fought in the Jungle, and very little about WWII.  They recognize Hitler, but don't always know the U.S. fought Japan.  They think its ok to know those things--if you are interested.  Just as some people like fishing or collecting old records.  No reason to push that info on everyone, though.  

SSF remembers Ed Sullivan, Gilligan's Island, and Andy Griffith, all off the air before he was born. Now many young people not only don't remember shows from the 90s, but the tv/cable offerings are so diverse, they don't even share current programs the way people did back in the 60s and 70s.  I used to think the exceptions should be enormously popular movies like the Star Trek series and Star Wars, but now I meet some who have heard of these movies but have not seen them, though they may recognize Spock and Darth as pop cultural icons. No more stories in common.

They have instagram, Facebook, Snapchat, Netflix, etc to connect them. They are instantly connected to each other's in ways we never were. You're not connected to them to know what connects them.

Hell, I was in Iraq and I still don't know why we were there except to say the reasons I was given were lies.