Trump tweets videos from Britain First...

[*bfine32*]

(11-29-2017, 11:39 PM)GMDino Wrote: While this is completely off topic I'll defend myself rather than ask anyone else to do it.

The sig came out of a discussion about Trump being an outsider and people wanting an outsider until they got one..  I made a comment in that thread that given the parameters for that anyone could be a outsider and among the people listed I said Manson as an extreme version of an outsider.

That one name evoked a ridiculous response that ignored the gist of the thread and why I said what I said.








So now we have an "outsider" who can't get anything done (art of the deal my arse) and hasn't shown a willingness to learn the job or even act presidential in any way at all.  Including his tweet storm today.  (Some of which he deleted.  I guess he thinks no one can see them after that?)

Oh, it's exactly on topic. There's absolutely no reason to defend yourself. I don't blame you; I blame those in charge that allow it to flourish. It would be like me blaming a child for eating too much candy.   

From jump I've viewed it to be in poor taste at best. It would be akin to someone posting a meme of Obama beside Bin Laden. Although I disagreed with Obama on many stances; I would never disrespect a a sitting President to that extreme.

I think your explanation of you merely made the comparison that they are outsiders pretty much solidifies the point that Michael and I have made.  

[hollodero]

Alright, I should never have used the word H. I could have said Jabba the Hut and the point I wanted to make would have come across just as good. However, I chose to use the trigger word.

Please do not get focused on that. I explained it was a mere figure of speech and no comparison at all and that it was never intended that way. Please also do not ban me.

[Dill]

(11-29-2017, 10:59 PM)michaelsean Wrote: Everyone primarily associates Hitler with genocide, anti-semitism and of course starting a war that killed over 100 million people. To primarily associate him with anything else would be non-sensical. “When I compared you to Hitler I was referring to vegetarianism”.

One can construct meaningless comparisons, certainly. But comparing a politician to Hitler on the basis of a shared hatred of free press, hypernationalism and vilification of immigrants is hardly so random and inconsequential as claiming they are both vegetarians.

Hitler was Hitler before the final solution, and before he started a war which killed maybe 60 million people. The people who voted him into power were not voting for genocide and another world war.

If we want to understand where dictators like Hitler come from, and world wars, then we need to look at more than genocide and anti-semitism.

Since a lone dictator can do little as one man, striving to understand what dictators look like before they win power, and at what attracts people to them, and what sort of people, I would file under "learning from history"--not nonsensical at all, if we don't want to repeat past disasters.

That is why it is not nonsensical to associate Hitler with anything but genocide and antisemitism.

[GMDino]

Folks we can all relax.

It just doesn't matter if the videos were "real".  See it's about showing how real the "threat" is even if it isn't using "real" examples!  What is wrong with you people?!?!  It's called "alternative facts".  It's not like they haven't told us from day one that they would be just lying to us.  They have been perfectly honest...about lying to us.



https://www.cnbc.com/2017/11/29/white-house-it-doesnt-matter-if-anti-muslim-videos-are-real-the-threat-is-real.html

Quote:White House: It doesn't matter if anti-Muslim videos are real because 'the threat is real'

• White House Press Secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders says it doesn't matter whether the anti-Muslim videos retweeted by President Trump are real or not.
• "Whether it's a real video, the threat is real," she says, adding that the president's "goal is to promote strong border security and strong national security."
• The tweets drew swift condemnation from around the globe, including from the government of American's closest ally, Britain.
  

Christina Wilkie | @christinawilkie


[/url]
White House: It doesn't matter if anti-Muslim videos are real because 'the threat is real'  13 Hours Ago | 01:13

White House Press Secretary Sarah Huckabee Sanders said Wednesday that it doesn't matter whether the anti-Muslim videos retweeted by President Donald Trump are real or not, because "the threat is real."

Trump shared three videos on Twitter early Wednesday from the deputy leader of an ultranationalist, far-right fringe group in Britain. The group, Britain First, claims to be fighting the "Islamization" of England, and the graphic videos purported to show Muslims committing violent crimes.

The videos were titled, "Muslim Destroys a Statue of Virgin Mary!", "Islamist mob pushes teenage boy off roof and beats him to death!", and "Muslim migrant beats up Dutch boy on crutches!"

Within minutes of Trump's retweets, numerous news outlets reported that a number of the videos' titles were false or misleading.

Sanders, however, told reporters that by focusing on "the nature of the video, you're focusing on the wrong thing."

Getty Images
White House Principal Deputy Press Secretary Sarah Sanders conducts a daily news briefing at the James Brady Press Briefing Room at the White House May 10, 2017 in Washington, DC.

"The threat is real, what the president is talking about, the need for national security and military spending, those are very real things, there's nothing fake about that," she said.

Sanders didn't elaborate on exactly what "the threat" was, but Trump has long portrayed Islam as a danger to the United States.

Early in his presidential campaign, Trump proposed banning all Muslims from traveling to the United States. Since assuming the presidency, his administration has been locked in a legal battle over its effort to institute a ban on travelers from various majority Muslim countries.

Sanders said Trump was helping to address the "threat" by "bringing it up."


Trump book gives an insider look at the 2016 presidential campaign and his rise to power  17 Hours Ago | 11:14
[url=https://www.cnbc.com/video/2017/11/29/trump-book-gives-an-insider-look-at-the-2016-presidential-campaign-and-his-rise-to-power.html]
"The threat is real, the threat needs to be addressed, the threat has to be talked about, and that's what president is doing in bringing it up," she said.

Trump's "goal is to promote strong border security and strong national security," and "whether it's a real video, the threat is real."

"That's what the president is taking about, that's what the president is focused on, dealing with those real threats and those are real no matter how you look at it," she insisted.

Trump's decision to retweet the propaganda videos drew searing condemnation from around the world on Wednesday, including from America's closest ally: The office of British Prime Minister Theresa May said: "It is wrong for the President to have done this."

So it doesn't matter if we compare Trump to Hitler or Manson or Mr. Rogers....it doesn't have to be a "real" compariosn.  We're just trying to bring attention to the dangers.  


Side note:  Y'all still real proud of voting for this guy, huh?  You got a lying, cheating, whining little ***** who has done nothing to help anyone yet...except maybe some of his buddies he gave jobs to.

Congrats!

Now the Democrats will have to come in and clean up ANOTHER mess that the GOP will use as proof that the Democrats don't care about the "little people".

[hollodero]

So the Dutch made it clear that the guy beating the boy on crutches was born and raised in the Netherlands.

Truth matters, they said. Sarah Huckabee disagrees on that one, obviously, starting her defense with the words "whether it's a real video..." - So, according to that, it would be perfectly ok to forge something like that for a greater goal. So this is now open, admitted propaganda.

Not that it would be just ok to post even a real video in an intent to agitate people. I'm certain some muslim somewhere did beat up someone, as do some not so fine people from every ethnicity or group. But adding that "whether it's real or not doesn't matter" attitude steps up the disgusting even more.

(PS Dino beat me to it by one minute... still, I let this comment undeleted)

[*michaelsean*]

(11-30-2017, 04:55 AM)Dill Wrote: One can construct meaningless comparisons, certainly. But comparing a politician to Hitler on the basis of a shared hatred of free press, hypernationalism and vilification of immigrants is hardly so random and inconsequential as claiming they are both vegetarians.

Hitler was Hitler before the final solution, and before he started a war which killed maybe 60 million people. The people who voted him into power were not voting for genocide and another world war.

If we want to understand where dictators like Hitler come from, and world wars, then we need to look at more than genocide and anti-semitism.

Since a lone dictator can do little as one man, striving to understand what dictators look like before they win power, and at what attracts people to them, and what sort of people, I would file under "learning from history"--not nonsensical at all, if we don't want to repeat past disasters.

That is why it is not nonsensical to associate Hitler with anything but genocide and antisemitism.

Primarily associated with. That’s the key phrase.

[GMDino]

(11-30-2017, 08:24 AM)hollodero Wrote: So the Dutch made it clear that the guy beating the boy on crutches was born and raised in the Netherlands.

Truth matters, they said. Sarah Huckabee disagrees on that one, obviously, starting her defense with the words "whether it's a real video..." - So, according to that, it would be perfectly ok to forge something like that for a greater goal. So this is now open, admitted propaganda.

Not that it would be just ok to post even a real video in an intent to agitate people. I'm certain some muslim somewhere did beat up someone, as do some not so fine people from every ethnicity or group. But adding that "whether it's real or not doesn't matter" attitude steps up the disgusting even more.

(PS Dino beat me to it by one minute... still, I let this comment undeleted)

What is sad is people are still trying to play the "both sides lie" card.

Not like this.

This is, as you say, nothing but pure propaganda.  

[hollodero]

GMDino Wrote: What is sad is people are still trying to play the "both sides lie" card.

Yes it is. False equivalencies used as rhetorical points to score points for the own team rather then having a fair evaluation. Which is something both sides do also, but I agree it's not balancing out. One side goes to way greater lengths.

And it's really sad because I cannot fight the feeling that people betray and suppress their own intelligence with that.
And for what? For effing Donald Trump. As much as I try to understand the US, this I can not grasp.

GMDino Wrote: Not like this.

This is, as you say, nothing but pure propaganda.  

And obviously there's no real need to at least mask that any longer. Not worth the effort, people take it in anyhow.
And that's really scary.

[GMDino]

I mean Trump insists on tweeting...and he can't even do THAT right.  Something that he does all the time.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/worldviews/wp/2017/11/30/donald-trump-blasted-theresa-may-on-twitter-unfortunately-he-got-the-wrong-woman/?utm_term=.3450462a1101

Quote:LONDON — Donald Trump got the wrong woman and Twitter users were there to screen-grab the evidence.


Trump’s tweet came at 1 a.m. GMT, when many Brits were fast asleep. It had been an unusual day in Britain, with President Trump retweeting several videos from far-right group Britain First.

Taking aim at Prime Minister Theresa May’s sharp rebuke of his actions, Trump wanted May to know he was unhappy. In Trump fashion, he took to Twitter to air his grievances but targeted the wrong @TheresaMay.

Unfortunately for Trump, the target of his tweet was not the prime minister of the United Kingdom as he had intended but in fact another woman named Theresa May Scrivener who had just six followers and a protected account. Trump’s schoolboy error was met with shock, amusement and left many Brits wondering: “Who the hell is Theresa May Scrivener?”

Many eagle-eyed Twitter users pounced on Trump’s mistake, taking screen-grabs of the presidential error and sharing them. The initial tweet reads: “Theresa @theresamay, don’t focus on me, focus on the destructive Radical Islamic Terrorism that is taking place within the United Kingdom. We are doing just fine!” Trump's tweet was soon deleted.
 
“The best part about this is that a random woman called Theresa May Scrivener, with 6 followers. just received a diplomatic correspondence by tweet from the US President,” tweeted Gerard Brady, who attached a screen-grab of Trump's error.
View image on Twitter

Quote:[/url]Gerard Brady@GerardBrady100

The best part about this is that a random woman called Theresa May Scrivener, with 6 followers. just received a diplomatic correspondence by tweet from the US President #Trump#TrumpTweets #specialrelationship
7:58 PM - Nov 29, 2017

Some 14 minutes later Trump tried again.  This time he mentioned the correct Twitter handle and targeted the actual prime minister of the United Kingdom. Trump kept the wording of his second attempt the same.

Quote:[url=https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump]Donald J. Trump

@realDonaldTrump

.@Theresa_May, don’t focus on me, focus on the destructive Radical Islamic Terrorism that is taking place within the United Kingdom. We are doing just fine!

It didn't take long for news of Trump's error to spread.  While many were amused at Trump’s misfiring, some spared a thought for Theresa May Scrivener.

Sad.

[Dill]

(11-30-2017, 08:34 AM)michaelsean Wrote: Primarily associated with. That’s the key phrase.

If we want to know where dictators come from, how they arise, who follows them and why, then what Hitler is "primarily associated" will not teach us much.  

So are we divided on the issue of whether analysis of historical examples can help us better understand the present? 

[Dill]

(11-30-2017, 12:25 AM)bfine32 Wrote: ...I've viewed it to be in poor taste at best. It would be akin to someone posting a meme of Obama beside Bin Laden. Although I disagreed with Obama on many stances; I would never disrespect a a sitting President to that extreme.

I must say I don't have a problem with someone posting a meme of Obama beside Osama--at least to the point where I would support administrative censure.

Seems to me Dino's memes slam the man, not the office.  This is in part because Trump himself has, by his own actions, demeaned the office, frequently embarrassing the nation. I think you are perhaps one of those conservatives who has noticed this.

PS the uncannily similar behavior evidenced by Trump and Manson in Dino's memes--what are we to make of that?

[*bfine32*]

(11-30-2017, 08:20 PM)Dill Wrote: I must say I don't have a problem with someone posting a meme of Obama beside Osama--at least to the point where I would support administrative censure.

Seems to me Dino's memes slam the man, not the office.  This is in part because Trump himself has, by his own actions, demeaned the office, frequently embarrassing the nation. I think you are perhaps one of those conservatives who has noticed this.

PS the uncannily similar behavior evidenced by Trump and Manson in Dino's memes--what are we to make of that?

Well we disagree here as I would have a problem with anyone comparing Obama to Bin Laden. The man is the office whether folks like it or not. 

I get that I have a different level of respect for the office of POTUS than many; of course he has embarrassed the office, but it doesn't lessen the office.

As to administrative censure; it seems we're pretty liberal in our approach.  

Folks do realize that unlike comments made here; that sig follows him to other forums on this board.