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(09-08-2015, 06:52 PM)Blutarsky Wrote: Iran cant develop a nuclear weapon for 15yrs....how about never?
Yes. Lets talk about telling another sovereign nation what they can and can not do forever. It is not easy to do without being in a constant state of war or military conflict.
We are the most powerful country on Earth, but that does not mean we can just tell everyone else on the planet what to do.
We had built a coalition of countries to use sanctions to force Iran to negotiate. That coalition would not agree to never trade with Iran ever again. So we got the best deal wec could. It is harder than people think to just tell another sovereign nation that they have to follow our rules forever.
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(09-11-2015, 03:25 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Hilarious that you don't apply that same logic to businesses and private citizens in America. You don't have any problem at all with our large overreaching government bossing businesses and people around, so long as their doing so fits your political narrative.
Actually I am very consistent on how I apply the power of a sovereign nation.
I believe that a nation is sovereign over the people and businesses that are within its borders.
I believe that a nation is not sovereign over what other nations can do. In fact I believe that if a nation insists on permanently limiting the sovereignty of another nation then there will be constant conflict and eventually wars.
The only way we were able to get this deal was with a coalition of other sovereign countries on our side. But not all of those other countries are 100% friendly with the United States and/or Israel. They do not want Iran to get a nuclear weapon, but they also don't want that potentially lucrative economic market to be shut off forever. So we could not just insist on endless compliance.
And who are we to scoff at who deals with Iran when we hang from the Saudis' nutsack?
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(09-11-2015, 03:51 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: I believe that governments receive their power from the people and not the other way around, for starters.
I also believe that countries get their power from the people. That is why I always say that the labor in other countries will eventually organize either through unions of political parties to demand higher wages for all. Some people claim that the United States has to go back to paying third world wages in order to compete when in fact the rest of the world will slowly rise up to meet our wage scale.
(09-11-2015, 03:51 PM)jakefromstatefarm Wrote: Second, there is a large difference of a unified coalition like the UN telling nations that have questionable pasts and ties to terrorism what weapons they may build and the US on it's own telling another nation that they have to allow women to vote.
Yet, I'll bet you would say that the UN does not have the authority to punish countries if they violated the trade sanctions with Iran.
That is what made this deal tough. We only got it because we got other countries like Russia and China on our side. They were not going to agree to keep sanctions in place indefinitely.
