What do these players have in common?

[*SHRacerX*]

Tee Higgins
Joe Burrow
Jonah Williams
Tyler Boyd
Jessie Bates
WJIII
Mackenzie Alexander


For me, it is two things: They are producing and they aren't whining about anything.

These players are doing the complete opposite:

Carlos Dunlap
Geno Atkins
Darius Phillips
John Ross
AJ Green
Shawn Williams

I know having AJ Green on the bottom list will annoy some, but his attitude and behavior in the first 5 games of the season was awful, so sorry...not sorry.

Why are the players in the first list producing? Jessie Bates isn't just a Pro Bowler, but maybe an All-Pro. Jonah Williams is coming on strong. Higgins had a huge game, and Boyd has been very steady. I almost put Lawson in the first group but he didn't have much impact against the Colts, but at least he isn't pissing and moaning about it or playing time. These players are from all different position groups, so you can't say "it's the defense" or something like that. Dunlap was one of the best DEs (statistically) in the NFL the last 8 games of the season last year, but so what? Your season was already over? Since when is it acceptable to simply turn it on for half a season? He clearly hasn't found that light switch yet this year.

As much as I wanted to throat-punch ZT for his play-calling after getting up 21-0 and scream at Anarumo to get pressure on Rivers, these players in the second list represent a hell of a lot of the money this team has spent on payroll. I think it is time to put more ownness on them and let the coaches try to work around them as they will not be in the long term plans.

Lastly, I just heard the Dolphins, at 3-3 (one game out of first in AFC East), are starting Tua after the bye week. This, with Fitzpatrick playing extremely well. I have no idea if this is best for them in the long run, but I have to admire their focus on their franchise QB and not an aging (but pretty amazing) Fitzy. The Bengals might be trying to do the same thing. Why focus on a lazy, underperforming, complaining group of players that are not a part of the long term plans? Yes, I wanted to win this year also, but not at the expense of Burrow and the long term.

[Sled21]

AJ was clearly in his own head and frustrated about his lack of production. I think the Colts game fixed that.

[*bfine32*]

Hey, you didn't even give us a chance to guess

[*Wyche'sWarrior*]

The bottom group is all Marvin era players, the others are young and hungry?

[fredtoast]

(10-20-2020, 02:31 PM)Wyche Wrote: The bottom group is all Marvin era players, the others are young and hungry?

Boyd, Bates, and Jackson are all Marvin era players.


The Zac era players have 3 wins in 22 games.

[*ochocincos*]

(10-20-2020, 02:31 PM)Wyche Wrote: The bottom group is all Marvin era players, the others are young and hungry?

And being Marvin-era players, they are now playing for a HC who has been (much) worse than the one they are used to playing for.
They're essentially saying the problem isn't them, it's the coaching.

Think of it like any other company.
You go through a big organizational change and bring in some new leadership, who changes things up.
Some of the incumbents are there, but some new people are brought in too.
With the new model, performance has declined overall, including the incumbents.
The incumbents remember the days of old and felt they were more successful in that older model compared to this new model with this new leadership.
Is the problem the new leadership/model, the incumbents not able to adapt well to the new model, or a mix of both?

[lone bengal]

Can’t we just say Taylor isn’t a great coach and we have a bad roster with underperforming high paid vets. Hate that fans make it one way or the other. Saying things like these veterans know how to win that’s why they hate Taylor. With Shawn Williams, Atkins and Dunlap starting in Marvin’s last season the defense was historically bad. Both staffs wanted nothing to do with Ross.

[*SHRacerX*]

(10-20-2020, 01:39 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Hey, you didn't even give us a chance to guess

Sorry, brother...I should have hit "enter" a bunch of times to have more space for you to guess?

[*SHRacerX*]

(10-20-2020, 02:53 PM)ochocincos Wrote: And being Marvin-era players, they are now playing for a HC who has been (much) worse than the one they are used to playing for.
They're essentially saying the problem isn't them, it's the coaching.

Think of it like any other company.
You go through a big organizational change and bring in some new leadership, who changes things up.
Some of the incumbents are there, but some new people are brought in too.
With the new model, performance has declined overall, including the incumbents.
The incumbents remember the days of old and felt they were more successful in that older model compared to this new model with this new leadership.
Is the problem the new leadership/model, the incumbents not able to adapt well to the new model, or a mix of both?

Yep.  

[Bengalfan4life27c]

Tony Gonzales an all pro tightend went from Chiefs to Falcons had a nice end to his career. While head coach Todd Haley was unemployed by the time of Gonzales retirement.

[*bfine32*]

(10-20-2020, 04:18 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Sorry, brother...I should have hit "enter" a bunch of times to have more space for you to guess?

I was going to guess extra left pinky toe.....I was way off

[bonesaw]

Top half thinks Skyline is better and the bottom half thinks Goldstar is better

[WestCoastBengalsFan]

(10-20-2020, 07:18 PM)bonesaw Wrote: Top half thinks Skyline is better and the bottom half thinks Goldstar is better

Bottom half is dead wrong, not just about Goldstar but about a lot of things.

[*jason*]

Expect the bottom list of players to continue to grow regardless of production. The Bengals have one punk ass win this year; 3 total in the 22 months of Poo Dey. Joe Burrow's body language after the game said it all... Sigh... "I just wanna win.".

[*jason*]

(10-20-2020, 03:10 PM)lone bengal Wrote: Can’t we just say Taylor isn’t a great coach and we have a bad roster with underperforming high paid vets. Hate that fans make it one way or the other. Saying things like these veterans know how to win that’s why they hate Taylor. With Shawn Williams, Atkins and Dunlap starting in Marvin’s last season the defense was historically bad. Both staffs wanted nothing to do with Ross.

Kareem Hunt is about to remind you that the defense is still historically bad this Sunday. We had a nice lil reprieve facing a rookie back, and a banged up Lamar and company.

[*Nately120*]

It makes sense that the older players are a bit worried about ending their careers in the ZT era.

[*bengalfan74*]

(10-20-2020, 07:58 PM)Nately120 Wrote: It makes sense that the older players are a bit worried about ending their careers in the ZT era.

That's probably part of it ? They don't see any light at the end of the tunnel.

[Essex Johnson]

(10-20-2020, 01:34 PM)SHRacerX Wrote: Tee Higgins
Joe Burrow
Jonah Williams
Tyler Boyd
Jessie Bates
WJIII
Mackenzie Alexander


For me, it is two things:  They are producing and they aren't whining about anything.

These players are doing the complete opposite:

Carlos Dunlap
Geno Atkins
Darius Phillips
John Ross
AJ Green
Shawn Williams

I know having AJ Green on the bottom list will annoy some, but his attitude and behavior in the first 5 games of the season was awful, so sorry...not sorry.  

Why are the players in the first list producing?  Jessie Bates isn't just a Pro Bowler, but maybe an All-Pro.  Jonah Williams is coming on strong.  Higgins had a huge game, and Boyd has been very steady.  I almost put Lawson in the first group but he didn't have much impact against the Colts, but at least he isn't pissing and moaning about it or playing time.  These players are from all different position groups, so you can't say "it's the defense" or something like that.  Dunlap was one of the best DEs (statistically) in the NFL the last 8 games of the season last year, but so what?  Your season was already over?  Since when is it acceptable to simply turn it on for half a season?  He clearly hasn't found that light switch yet this year.  

As much as I wanted to throat-punch ZT for his play-calling after getting up 21-0 and scream at Anarumo to get pressure on Rivers, these players in the second list represent a hell of a lot of the money this team has spent on payroll.  I think it is time to put more ownness on them and let the coaches try to work around them as they will not be in the long term plans.  

Lastly, I just heard the Dolphins, at 3-3 (one game out of first in AFC East), are starting Tua after the bye week.  This, with Fitzpatrick playing extremely well.  I have no idea if this is best for them in the long run, but I have to admire their focus on their franchise QB and not an aging (but pretty amazing) Fitzy.  The Bengals might be trying to do the same thing.  Why focus on a lazy, underperforming, complaining group of players that are not a part of the long term plans?  Yes, I wanted to win this year also, but not at the expense of Burrow and the long term.

I believe week 4, Bates was complaining about defense..  i also make a difference between whining and making a statement...Atkins not in last week for more plays over what we had in was crazy.. i watched a play and our DT was not sure what to hell to do on pre snap.. hell i was whining

[Destro]

The top half will not sign a new contract

[Nicomo Cosca]

(10-20-2020, 09:59 PM)Destro Wrote: The top half will not sign a new contract

Boyd already did.