Why are the riots different this time?

[*PhilHos*]

(09-01-2020, 06:11 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Can't blame the media for what comes out of Trumps mouth.

No, I can't, nor do I.  But I can blame the media for their dishonest and/or biased reporting and making false claims about Trump (not saying all claims made about DJT are false, FYI)

[*PhilHos*]

(09-01-2020, 06:57 PM)Benton Wrote: Not agreeing or disagreeing, just adding that social media has a lot to do with this, especially the flat out misinformation. Both sides use it to turn people into martyrs, or to misrepresent things.

It's why I didn't specify which media was the problem. I think ALL the media is the problem (or at least the vast majority): main stream news media, social media, online media, print media, cable news, etc.

[GMDino]

(09-02-2020, 12:52 PM)PhilHos Wrote: It's why I didn't specify which media was the problem. I think ALL the media is the problem (or at least the vast majority): main stream news media, social media, online media, print media, cable news, etc.

The only part the I disagree with is lumping social media in with "the media".  To me, at least, "the media" is television/radio/newspapers when it comes to "news".  Yes I can get links to stories and news from FB and Twitter but I feel too often the false news on social media gets thrown in with the real media and the real media gets accused of doing what social media is really doing.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-02-2020, 01:00 PM)GMDino Wrote: The only part the I disagree with is lumping social media in with "the media".  To me, at least, "the media" is television/radio/newspapers when it comes to "news".  Yes I can get links to stories and news from FB and Twitter but I feel too often the false news on social media gets thrown in with the real media and the real media gets accused of doing what social media is really doing.

I will admit that social media is far, far, far, FAR, FAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAR worse when it comes to "fake news" but the fact that the other media is still kinda bad nowadays is a BIG problem.

[fredtoast]

(09-02-2020, 12:51 PM)PhilHos Wrote: No, I can't, nor do I.  But I can blame the media for their dishonest and/or biased reporting and making false claims about Trump (not saying all claims made about DJT are false, FYI)

Doesn't sound like you include FoxNews or Breitbart in your definition of "media".


And, again, the problems I listed were all based on direct comments by Trump.  So the "media" has nothing to do with them.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-02-2020, 01:57 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Doesn't sound like you include FoxNews or Breitbart in your definition of "media".

Why? 'Cause I didn't single them out? I didn't single out CNN or MSNBC either and they're just as bad as Fox News and all the rest.

(09-02-2020, 01:57 PM)fredtoast Wrote: And, again, the problems I listed were all based on direct comments by Trump.  So the "media" has nothing to do with them.

Maybe, maybe not, but, most, if not all those comments have contributed virtually nothing to the riots, let alone making the riots worse than the ones in pre-Trump.

[fredtoast]

(09-02-2020, 04:22 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Maybe, maybe not, but, most, if not all those comments have contributed virtually nothing to the riots, let alone making the riots worse than the ones in pre-Trump.

Yes they have. Your attempts to blame media and social media make no sense because they were exactly the same in 2014 whem Michael Brown was shot.

 You seriously don't think having a President who accepts the Confederat flag at his rallies and tweets videos of his supporters yelling "White power" don't make things worse.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-02-2020, 04:27 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Yes they have. Your attempts to blame media and social media make no sense because they were exactly the same in 2014 whem Michael Brown was shot.

Makes more sense than blaming white nationalists for the riots being worse.

[fredtoast]

(09-02-2020, 04:31 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Makes more sense than blaming white nationalists for the riots being worse.

You don't think having a white nationalist as President makes any difference?

You do know the riots are against racial injustice, don't you.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-02-2020, 04:27 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You seriously don't think having a President who accepts the Confederat flag at his rallies and tweets videos of his supporters yelling "White power" don't make things worse.

Didn't he take down that video when it was pointed out to him that someone yelled, "White power"?

In any event, I think having a media that tries to blame a president for killing a man when said man and his wife drank fish pool cleaner simply because Trump was hopeful that hydroxochloroquine (sp?) could help stop COVID makes things a lot worse than Trump posting a video then taking it down 3 hours later.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-02-2020, 04:33 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You don't think having a white nationalist as President makes any difference?

It would if we had a white nationalist as President.

(09-02-2020, 04:33 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You do know the riots are against racial injustice, don't you.

No, the PROTESTS are against racial injustice. The riots are an excuse for shitty people to do shitty things. The fact that you would equate the violent riots with the peaceful protests makes you a racist, at least according to the media, anyway.

[fredtoast]

(09-02-2020, 04:34 PM)PhilHos Wrote: In any event, I think having a media that tries to blame a president for killing a man when said man and his wife drank fish pool cleaner simply because Trump was hopeful that hydroxochloroquine (sp?) could help stop COVID makes things a lot worse than Trump posting a video then taking it down 3 hours later.

You think the riots are over hydroxochloroquine?

[*PhilHos*]

(09-02-2020, 04:37 PM)fredtoast Wrote: You think the riots are over hydroxochloroquine?

Really, fred? 

[HUUUUUUUUUGE SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGH]

No, fred, the point that I'm CLEARLY making is that the media with their fake news and misreporting is what is making the riots worse. The hydroxochloroquine thing was just one of many examples of the media's fake news.

Any other bullshit questions?

[GMDino]

(09-02-2020, 04:31 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Makes more sense than blaming white nationalists for the riots being worse.

This leads me into a question:

Let's say you are an officer in a town with protests.  You are trying to make sure they STAY peaceful and/or catch the people who are vandalizing and looting.

So curfew comes and you and your fellow officers are trying to clear the streets while watching for trouble when a guy (or group of guys) come up to you, AR swung over their shoulder (legally, of course) and they tell you they are there to "help" you with the rioters.

You don't know who they are.  You don't know where they came from.  You don't know what kind of training they might have had.

As an officer do you say "Thanks but having more strangers on the street with weapons might add to the trouble either by riling up the protesters that are already here or by being aggressive toward others even if they are not rioters/looters.  We are trained to handle this so we'd rather not have MORE people to worry about."  Or do you welcome them, offer snacks and water and thank them for helping you?

Because as an outsider looking in having that second group enter the fray only makes things more volatile and increase the risk of violence rather than helping.

That doesn't excuse the rioting already going on.  That means it has created another layer of potential trouble.  One that is openly encouraged by the POTUS who treats them as "patriots".

Maybe an officer (I know we have at least one) has a different view on it.

[fredtoast]

(09-02-2020, 04:36 PM)PhilHos Wrote: It would if we had a white nationalist as a President.

He clearly supports the belief that even when minorities are born and raised in the United States they are not legitimately from the United States and that they should go back to "the country they came from". That is the very basis of White Nationalism. America is for white people only.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-02-2020, 04:41 PM)GMDino Wrote: This leads me into a question:

Let's say you are an officer in a town with protests.  You are trying to make sure they STAY peaceful and/or catch the people who are vandalizing and looting.

So curfew comes and you and your fellow officers are trying to clear the streets while watching for trouble when a guy (or group of guys) come up to you, AR swung over their shoulder (legally, of course) and they tell you they are there to "help" you with the rioters.

You don't know who they are.  You don't know where they came from.  You don't know what kind of training they might have had.

As an officer do you say "Thanks but having more strangers on the street with weapons might add to the trouble either by riling up the protesters that are already here or by being aggressive toward others even if they are not rioters/looters.  We are trained to handle this so we'd rather not have MORE people to worry about."  Or do you welcome them, offer snacks and water and thank them for helping you?

Because as an outsider looking in having that second group enter the fray only makes things more volatile and increase the risk of violence rather than helping.

That doesn't excuse the rioting already going on.  That means it has created another layer of potential trouble.  One that is openly encouraged by the POTUS who treats them as "patriots".

Maybe an officer (I know we have at least one) has a different view on it.

Don't confuse my blaming the media as the primary factor in the difference with them being the ONLY factor. Trump has not helped things; neither have pretty much any politician in America. But, I think the main factor is the media.

[fredtoast]

(09-02-2020, 04:40 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Really, fred? 

[HUUUUUUUUUGE SIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIGH]

No, fred, the point that I'm CLEARLY making is that the media with their fake news and misreporting is what is making the riots worse. The hydroxochloroquine thing was just one of many examples of the media's fake news.

Any other bullshit questions?

How does hydroxo have anything to do with the riots?

[GMDino]

(09-02-2020, 04:44 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Don't confuse my blaming the media as the primary factor in the difference with them being the ONLY factor. Trump has not helped things; neither have pretty much any politician in America. But, I think the main factor is the media.

Sorry it wasn't really about what you have said as much as it lead me into something I was about to post anyway.

Remember "the media" shows what is happening...they don't make it happen.

Investigative reporters investigate and report.

Reporters report.


News readers read the news.


Commentators commentate on the news.


Viewers/Readers take in all of that and must understand where the information came from and then decide what to do with it.

[*PhilHos*]

(09-02-2020, 04:41 PM)fredtoast Wrote: He clearly supports the belief that even when minorities are born and raised in the United States they are not legitimately from the United States and that they should go back to "the country they came from". That is the very basis of White Nationalism. America is for white people only.

Or maybe he stupidly thought all of the "Squad" were citizens that were born in America. But, why worry about facts and the truth when you can just make up shit? 

[fredtoast]

(09-02-2020, 04:47 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Or maybe he stupidly thought all of the "Squad" were citizens that were born in America. But, why worry about facts and the truth when you can just make up shit? 

That could be the problem.  I don't know why he said it.  But the "why" does not matter.  The fact is that White Nationalists love him for saying it, an it scared the shit out of minorities.

Can't believe you are trying to defend Trump by saying he s too stupid to know what he is talking about.  if his stupidity cuased him to say it then he is still the problem.