Youth Football protest

[*bfine32*]

(09-21-2016, 10:58 PM)fredtoast Wrote: I just won this argument.

Anyone who things protocol is more important than actual words and deeds does not even understand the word "substance".


"It doesn't matter how much you insult your country as long as you stand during the National Anthem.  Derp."

After you get done congratulating yourself on your self-proclaimed victory; kindly point out where I said protocol is more important that actual words and deeds.

[Vas Deferens]

(09-22-2016, 12:10 AM)bfine32 Wrote: After you get done congratulating yourself on your self-proclaimed victory; kindly point out where I said protocol is more important than actual words and deeds.

In the spirit of kumbaya, I FTFY.  No need to thank me, I'm sure you'd do the same without incident. 

[fredtoast]

(09-22-2016, 12:10 AM)bfine32 Wrote: After you get done congratulating yourself on your self-proclaimed victory; kindly point out where I said protocol is more important that actual words and deeds.

You have made it very clear by the difference in the way you talk about Trump and Kaepernick.

[BmorePat87]

(09-21-2016, 05:11 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: I signed up to fight enemies foreign and domestic. 


I didnt say lock him up. Free speech is wonderful. That doesnt mean it is all good. Just because you exercise free speech doesnt mean you cant be a disrespectful shitbag.

(09-21-2016, 05:20 PM)bfine32 Wrote: I did; however, that should not be a factor in determining who is being disrespectful.

but, according to the oath I saw on the army's website, the first thing you're signing up to do is "support and defend the constitution". Whether or not you believe someone kneeling is disrespectful, you literally signed up to protect their ability to do that. 

[GMDino]

(09-22-2016, 09:17 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: but, according to the oath I saw on the army's website, the first thing you're signing up to do is "support and defend the constitution". Whether or not you believe someone kneeling is disrespectful, you literally signed up to protect their ability to do that. 

I had an unfortunate interaction with a friend of a friend on Facebook who insists that because he served he knows more about respect and is permitted to tell others how to be respectful.  It was kind of sad.

[*bfine32*]

(09-22-2016, 09:10 AM)fredtoast Wrote: You have made it very clear by the difference in the way you talk about Trump and Kaepernick.

I think the only thing that is clear is that you have made an arguement out of things that were not stated or even implied and then crowned yourself the victor in the arguement. Feel free to glow in your self-appointed moment; apparently, you need it.

[*bfine32*]

(09-22-2016, 09:17 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: but, according to the oath I saw on the army's website, the first thing you're signing up to do is "support and defend the constitution". Whether or not you believe someone kneeling is disrespectful, you literally signed up to protect their ability to do that. 

As I said: I did sign up to defend the Constitution and I have stated that I will defend CK's right to kneel. That does not negate my right to say this action shows disrespect to the Nation.

As to the kneeling; I have mentioned before it is more respectful, especially to the Military, than sitting; yet, it shows less respect for the Nation than standing and covering your heart and/or signing along.

I'm not sure where the disconnect is here. I assume most realize CK does not stand as a sign of disrespect to the Nation.

[GMDino]

This is amusing to me because the song has been our National Anthem for less time than women have had the right to vote.

And it was that well know progressive-who-started-the-country-toward-ruin Woodrow Wilson who even tied it to the military officially.

http://www.music.army.mil/music/nationalanthem/

Quote:"The Star Spangled Banner", was ordered played at military and naval occasions by President Woodrow Wilson in 1916, but was not designated the national anthem by an Act of Congress until 1931.

Much like adding "under God" to the pledge it is not steeped in any great tradition but people are fighting about respect and disrespect over a song that very few know all the words too or can even sing correctly.

[*PhilHos*]

Sorry to side track the thread a little, but do you guys know the story behind the Star Spangled Banner?

I think it's quite inspiring and I heard an audio "reenactment" of it on the radio once and it gave me chills.

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/the-story-behind-the-star-spangled-banner-149220970/?no-ist

Quote:On a rainy September 13, 1814, British warships sent a downpour of shells and rockets onto Fort McHenry in Baltimore Harbor, relentlessly pounding the American fort for 25 hours. The bombardment, known as the Battle of Baltimore, came only weeks after the British had attacked Washington, D.C., burning the Capitol, the Treasury and the President's house. It was another chapter in the ongoing War of 1812.

A week earlier, Francis Scott Key, a 35-year-old American lawyer, had boarded the flagship of the British fleet on the Chesapeake Bay in hopes of persuading the British to release a friend who had recently been arrested. Key's tactics were successful, but because he and his companions had gained knowledge of the impending attack on Baltimore, the British did not let them go. They allowed the Americans to return to their own vessel but continued guarding them. Under their scrutiny, Key watched on September 13 as the barrage of Fort McHenry began eight miles away.

"It seemed as though mother earth had opened and was vomiting shot and shell in a sheet of fire and brimstone," Key wrote later. But when darkness arrived, Key saw only red erupting in the night sky. Given the scale of the attack, he was certain the British would win. The hours passed slowly, but in the clearing smoke of "the dawn's early light" on September 14, he saw the American flag—not the British Union Jack—flying over the fort, announcing an American victory.

Key put his thoughts on paper while still on board the ship, setting his words to the tune of a popular English song. His brother-in-law, commander of a militia at Fort McHenry, read Key's work and had it distributed under the name "Defence of Fort M'Henry." The Baltimore Patriot newspaper soon printed it, and within weeks, Key's poem, now called "The Star-Spangled Banner," appeared in print across the country, immortalizing his words—and forever naming the flag it celebrated.

In case you were wondering, the tune Key used was called "To Anacreon in Heaven".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KcHg5ZOIgU

Now, carry on with all your bitchin'.

[BmorePat87]

(09-22-2016, 11:29 AM)bfine32 Wrote: As I said: I did sign up to defend the Constitution and I have stated that I will defend CK's right to kneel. That does not negate my right to say this action shows disrespect to the Nation.

As to the kneeling; I have mentioned before it is more respectful, especially to the Military, than sitting; yet, it shows less respect for the Nation than standing and covering your heart and/or signing along.

I'm not sure where the disconnect is here. I assume most realize CK does not stand as a sign of disrespect to the Nation.

The disconnect is that you're defending your argument into an exchange where it isn't being debated. I didn't say people can't and don't view it as disrespectful. I just pointed out that NATI literally did sign up to protect the constitution, even if that constitutionally protected speech is disrespectful to him. 

I'm sorry if CCing you on it caused some confusion (being sincere, not snarky here). I just assumed you'd appreciate the alert to see my response to him since you took the time to respond to me as well. 

[*bfine32*]

(09-22-2016, 01:32 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: The disconnect is that you're defending your argument into an exchange where it isn't being debated. I didn't say people can't and don't view it as disrespectful. I just pointed out that NATI literally did sign up to protect the constitution, even if that constitutionally protected speech is disrespectful to him. 

I'm sorry if CCing you on it caused some confusion (being sincere, not snarky here). I just assumed you'd appreciate the alert to see my response to him since you took the time to respond to me as well. 

Fair enough and when I was in the Military we had a saying to fellow Soldiers:

You are here to defend freedom; not practice it.

[BmorePat87]

(09-22-2016, 12:11 PM)PhilHos Wrote: Sorry to side track the thread a little, but do you guys know the story behind the Star Spangled Banner?

I think it's quite inspiring and I heard an audio "reenactment" of it on the radio once and it gave me chills.

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/the-story-behind-the-star-spangled-banner-149220970/?no-ist

In case you were wondering, the tune Key used was called "To Anacreon in Heaven".
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8KcHg5ZOIgU

Now, carry on with all your bitchin'.

Love the history at Fort McHenry. I went to school in the outskirts of the city, so we had a ton of works from the lead historian there. Being a history major, every class I had the chance to pick my topic, I'd write about the fort. For my WWI class, I wrote about how it was used as the largest prosthetics hospital during the war. For my Baltimore history class, I wrote about the fort during the Civil War (Pratt St riots and how it was a prison that houses pro South MD politicians). For a research class, I wrote about the Battle of Baltimore. For modern warfare, I wrote about the maritime defense of the city during the  War of 1812). For a local history class, I rewrote the volunteer handbook for the fort. 

Good stuff!

Also a good spot to bring a date.

[THE Bigzoman]

(09-16-2016, 11:36 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: https://gma.yahoo.com/texas-youth-football-team-continue-protesting-anthem-despite-024900841--abc-news-topstories.html

When kids are receiving threats for exercising their First Amendment right, maybe there is a legitimate reason for the protest in the first place.

I don't think children are smart enough to understand or critically evaluatete the issues they're "protesting"

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-28-2016, 11:56 PM)THE Bigzoman Wrote: I don't think children are smart enough to understand or critically evaluatete the issues they're "protesting"

Do you have kids?

[THE Bigzoman]

(09-29-2016, 01:50 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Do you have kids?

Do I need them to make this claim?

They're kids.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-29-2016, 02:05 AM)THE Bigzoman Wrote: Do I need them to make this claim?

They're kids.

LOL  

I'm just curious about your experience with kids. Because I don't believe you would make that claim if you had more experience with 11 year olds. Some of them are capable of understanding and some not so much. Just like the adults around this joint. And to answer your question, you don't need anything to make a claim. After all, a claim is nothing more than an opinion. 

[THE Bigzoman]

(09-29-2016, 05:26 AM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: LOL  

I'm just curious about your experience with kids. Because I don't believe you would make that claim if you had more experience with 11 year olds. Some of them are capable of understanding and some not so much. Just like the adults around this joint. And to answer your question, you don't need anything to make a claim. After all, a claim is nothing more than an opinion. 

There's exceptions to every rule, but they're exactly that. Exceptions.

Not sure if that's really saying much aside from the obvious.

[oncemoreuntothejimbreech]

(09-29-2016, 09:38 AM)THE Bigzoman Wrote: There's exceptions to every rule, but they're exactly that. Exceptions.

Not sure if that's really saying much aside from the obvious.

I'm not talking about exceptions. I'm talking about in my experience most 11 year olds are mature enough to understand what you claim they don't. 

The information available regarding child development for that age group supports my opinion based upon my experiences. My youngest child is 11 years old currently and studied civil rights in her 4th grade social studies class two years ago. So l believe the majority of sixth grade students are capable of understanding the topics of a fourth grade curriculum. What makes you believe otherwise?

[BFritz21]

Here's what bugs me about the whole deal:

Yes, there may be some unnecessary police violence against African Americans that needs to stop, but this site shows that cops are more likely to be killed by them than they are to be killed by cops:

[url=http://www.dailywire.com/news/7264/5-statistics-you-need-know-about-cops-killing-aaron-bandler#][/url]

Quote:Blacks are more likely to kill cops than be killed by cops. This is according to FBI data, which also found that 40 percent of cop killers are black. According to Mac Donald, the police officer is 18.5 times more likely to be killed by a black than a cop killing an unarmed black person.

Despite the facts, the anti-police rhetoric of Black Lives Matter and their leftist sympathizers have resulted in what Mac Donald calls the "Ferguson Effect," as murders have spiked by 17 percent among the 50 biggest cities in the U.S. as a result of cops being more reluctant to police neighborhoods out of fear of being labeled as racists. Additionally, there have been over twice as many cops victimized by fatal shootings in the first three months of 2016.
Anti-police rhetoric has deadly consequences.

 
So whenever a cop is killed by a black, is it ok for people to form mobs and protest in black neighborhoods and such?
Hypocrisy.  
What makes this even more hypocritical is the fact that blacks only make up 12% of the population, while whites make up 67% of the population, yet so many more cops are killed by blacks.
That's what I would love to point out to anyone protesting or anyone that is siding with those protesting.

[fredtoast]

(09-29-2016, 02:05 AM)THE Bigzoman Wrote: Do I need them to make this claim?

They're kids.

No, you don't have to have kids, but it helps.  Some people without kids understand, but you don't.