(08-10-2021, 10:01 PM)Big_Ern Wrote: It took like 4 seconds though. Not sure Joe will have that kind of time. Would have to be a bootleg 

Preseason and the ball looked late. During the season, Burrow probably has that out in no more than 3 seconds and Chase catches it before he needs to toe-tap. 

(08-10-2021, 08:23 PM)PDub80 Wrote: I just don't get keeping the foot on the gas of the negativity train.

like you and Dalton?

(08-09-2021, 05:14 PM)jj22 Wrote: Aside from the Sewell/Chase debate.

More bad press on a top pick.

https://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2021/08/09/should-the-jamarr-chase-expectations-be-tempered/


This after Hobsin mentioned the struggles.

Will we have another Burrow/Herbert situation on our hands this season with Chase/Waddle (who has had a great camp)? Even if wideout was the right pick, is the bad press coming from all camps even the home page an alarming sign?

It's still early to panic, but admittedly this has been a rough start for our top 2 picks, and the reviews haven't been what we all would have hoped.

Wideout was the wrong pick given the state of the line. 

That said, dude has played 0 snaps in an NFL game. I wouldn't write him off yet. He was one of the top college receivers the last several years. That doesn't mean he's going to be a top NFL receiver coming out of camp, it's not realistic to put that kind of expectation on him. Give him 3-5 years and dude will probly be there. But Day -4? That's a stretch.

Would Chase look better if Burrow was sharper on his passes? For most of camp,Burrow has struggled.I saw a pass to Chase where Awuzie was defending,and Chase had a step on him but it was slightly underthrown,resulting in an incompletion,as Awuzie batted it down.But I have confidence that Chase and Burrow will get on track before opening day.

(08-10-2021, 11:07 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: like you and Dalton?

10 year vet QB who underachieved with loaded rosters, filled his pants in prime time as well as playoff games, and is no longer on the Bengals vs rookie WR who had a year off and has had 1 week of padded practice?

Yeah... lot's of parallels to be seen there. 

(08-10-2021, 11:37 PM)ezekiel23 Wrote: Would Chase look better if Burrow was sharper on his passes? For most of camp,Burrow has struggled.I saw a pass to Chase where Awuzie was defending,and Chase had a step on him but it was slightly underthrown,resulting in an incompletion,as Awuzie batted it down.But I have confidence that Chase and Burrow will get on track before opening day.

I do think that’s part of it. The deep ball (for wtv reason) is still just not there for Burrow yet. I heard James Rapien say there’s been a couple times where Chase beat his man (one of them was on Tony Brown but still) and Burrow just flat out missed him. Joe will get it sorted out at some point though. It was never an issue for him in college, and he has stated he’s going to make it an emphasis to improve that part of his game.

(08-10-2021, 02:16 PM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: How many of those weapons are utilized if Brady isn’t protected by the best oline in the league???  Yea they had weapons and I agree especially with the way offenses are today u need weapons but I’ll never concede u need weapons before protection upfront.  Especially when u already have good weapons and a terrible offensive line.  There’s a reason people say u build inside out.  With burrow already destroyed how we are in this offensive line issue again is baffling to me.  Brady has never needed weapons hes needed protection cuz he’s never been mobile... it wasn’t until Brady’s game dipped did he start asking and needing more weapons but Brady has always had and needed good protection upfront always...first and foremost.  Now Brady needs good protection and weapons.  Also it’s not like we didn’t have weapons before chase we had two young thousand yard capable wide receivers an elite franchise qb and a top running back.  Sure we could use another receiver but more than an elite offensive lineman hahahahaha naw y’all are high and to be here is bitter sweet cuz those of us who wanted a offensive lineman knew this day was coming where we are back to desperate for more olineman help

It's such a tired argument, but I will give it one (probably not last) try:

Drafting Chase did not prevent the Bengals from drafting an elite offensive line prospect.  That is what they see in Carman, and they were able to slide and get two additional 4th rounders (one of which seems to be pushing him for playing time already) to further help fill out the roster.

Carman's performance thus far seems largely attached to a lack of conditioning.  I get why the coaches might be disgruntled there, but I remember that Carman wasn't able to show at the Clemson Pro Day because he had put off surgery to correct a herniated disc in his back and played through it the last four games of the season to try and win another title. 

I'm sure he was given a clean bill of health early enough to get in shape, but maybe he had some remaining fatigue from his senior year.  Whatever the issue, I have faith that it will be corrected and Carman will be performing on our line for a long time to come. 

It is easy to forget that they also signed Riley Reiff, a former first rounder and a solid tackle prospect.  Not to mention the re-signing of Spain, who helped stabilize the line last year and played at three different positions.  

I also believe the Bengals are waiting to see what shakes free on cut day (or maybe a trade to the Saints, who just lost their kicker for Seibert?) to further enhance the offensive line.  

The two are NOT mutually exclusive.  Drafting Chase wasn't ignoring the offensive line.  

(08-10-2021, 11:15 AM)SadFaceBengal15 Wrote: Lol fair enough but my point is that when u take a guy fifth overall I understand losing the occasional battle here and there but hearing that he’s Had a lot of drops to hear he’s not winning jump balls and to hear he can’t consistently create separation is not what ur supposed to hear about ur 5th overall pick.

We remember AJ Green's rookie year, correct?  Let's compare the two seasons and see where #5 overall fares vs #4 overall.  

(08-10-2021, 11:50 PM)PDub80 Wrote: 10 year vet QB who underachieved with loaded rosters, filled his pants in prime time as well as playoff games, and is no longer on the Bengals vs rookie WR who had a year off and has had 1 week of padded practice?

Yeah... lot's of parallels to be seen there. 

Lol at loaded rosters.... He had one maybe 1 year when it was fully healthy.

(08-11-2021, 09:27 AM)XenoMorph Wrote: Lol at loaded rosters.... He had one maybe 1 year when it was fully healthy.

You should go back and revisit those rosters.

I debunked this in another thread. AD had a top 10 (or higher) to a top 12 NFL roster from 2013-2015. That is 3 seasons with a very very talented group on both offense and defense.

You could argue that 2012 and 2016 were certainly top 15 in the NFL. While that's not quite "loaded" you have to also remember...

They had a pretty talented coaching group as well, which consisted of a long tenured and respected HC along with some of the best position coaches and coordinators (ON BOTH SIDES OF THE BALL) in the NFL.

Go back through and look at those rosters. Seriously, revisit them and look at those guys all in their prime.

The line was quite good, the WR groups excellent. 2 1st round TEs, and the RBs very good. And the defensive rosters were outstanding. They had the best D line in the NFL for some of those seasons. Hell, John Clayton did a special covering the Bengals roster and pointed out that the Bengals 2nd string DL would start for most of the league. Those rosters were EXCELLENT.

(08-11-2021, 09:56 AM)Frank Booth Wrote: The dude still has Dalton as his profile pic

Very unhealthy relationship pdub has with the old qb

lol, I still have a #14 Dalton Bengals shirt as well.

I don't occupy my mind with petty, inconsequential things such as my Bengals Board profile pic and what that means in my subconscious. I changed it quite a while ago and don't even think about it.

Keep that AD love going, though. The AD love hasn't aged well.

Ja'Marr Chase earned "Player of the Day" at camp yesterday.

I agree with Xenomorph. Only 1 of those years the team was fully healthy for the playoff game anyway ( the chargers game ) But I think we can all agree Dalton had his limitations. But 5 straight playoff years is nothing to shake a stick at either.

As far as Chase I'm excited he's on the team and what's done is done as far as the picks. But when we could of taken an OL at 5 or even traded back a few spots and got more picks in 1 and got an OL that could've started today (barring injury) then instead we wait until the 2nd when ppl are saying we can still get a starter in 2 and that guy is atleast having some struggles. It really raises the bar for Chase to live up to the hype and quickly. Maybe that not fair and Chase and even Carman deserve time to adjust and become either elite or valuable starters. But the problem is we have more time for Chase to adjust than Carman. We can't go into the season trying to throw 45 times a game while our QB gets hit like crazy again.

I would feel alot better about the situation if Zac Taylor and his coaching staff were a little quicker about making adjustments to the playcalling throughout the season instead of just going with the status quo until the wheels fall off.

I'm sure Chase will be fine, but his use of the statement "Rome wasn't built in a day" is actually more indicative of a draft bust since the point of that statement is that Rome wasn't built in a day, but it burned in one. You can build something great and amazing slowly over time and you'd be amazed as how quickly things can spiral into ruin.

I don't think he's going to spiral into quick ruin, but that statement was an amusingly odd one to pick if he wants to show that his career of greatness is still on the right path.

(08-11-2021, 12:02 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I agree with Xenomorph. Only 1 of those years the team was fully healthy for the playoff game anyway ( the chargers game ) But I think we can all agree Dalton had his limitations. But 5 straight playoff years is nothing to shake a stick at either.

agreed. 2013 and 2015 were the only times they were actually loaded


2013 was a complete choke job, and 2015 we had a back up qb. Still choked that too

(08-11-2021, 12:02 PM)NUGDUKWE Wrote: I agree with Xenomorph. Only 1 of those years the team was fully healthy for the playoff game anyway ( the chargers game ) But I think we can all agree Dalton had his limitations. But 5 straight playoff years is nothing to shake a stick at either.

As far as Chase I'm excited he's on the team and what's done is done as far as the picks. But when we could of taken an OL at 5 or even traded back a few spots and got more picks in 1 and got an OL that could've started today (barring injury) then instead we wait until the 2nd when ppl are saying we can still get a starter in 2 and that guy is atleast having some struggles. It really raises the bar for Chase to live up to the hype and quickly. Maybe that not fair and Chase and even Carman deserve time to adjust and become either elite or valuable starters. But the problem is we have more time for Chase to adjust than Carman. We can't go into the season trying to throw 45 times a game while our QB gets hit like crazy again.

I would feel alot better about the situation if Zac Taylor and his coaching staff were a little quicker about making adjustments to the playcalling throughout the season instead of just going with the status quo until the wheels fall off.

I haven't even heard anything about Carman struggling, he was just put lower on the depth chart initially cause he came in a bit 
overweight is what I have been hearing and last I heard he was back to starting again at RG. We don't know if Sewell would be 
struggling right now in TC at Guard either as that is also where he would have to start except when Reiff or Jonah rest.

If XSF beats out Carman at RG so be it, XSF was our best Guard last season according to PFF. When we had Spain and XSF out 
there last season we were much better in the interior and it helped the entire OL. It isn't the end of the world if Carman doesn't
start game 1, we just need to have the best 5 out there and our depth improved which is our biggest weakness.

But yeah, Taylor shouldn't have us throwing the ball 50+ times, that is BS even if we are down. Run the ball, what is nice is I 
have been hearing the Wide Zone concept Pollack has been implementing has been doing good run blocking which is great news.

The doomposting from some of you lot is exhausting. Can we please wait to see him in a few games before we dump on him?

(08-11-2021, 12:55 PM)Frank Booth Wrote: agreed. 2013 and 2015 were the only times they were actually loaded


2013 was a complete choke job, and 2015 we had a back up qb. Still choked that too

Yeah I kind of excluded 2015 since Dalton didn't play but they were pretty healthy/loaded for that game as well. I don't like conspiracy theories except I do go down that rabbit hole a little bit when it comes to the NFL/slash Bengals. I do think its funny that on any given play on any given sunday they can give you 5 different camera angles on a play but in a primetime playoff game they can't get another angle to see if Jeremy Hill's knee is down. 

But yeah they choked after that.

(08-11-2021, 09:19 AM)SHRacerX Wrote: It's such a tired argument, but I will give it one (probably not last) try:

Drafting Chase did not prevent the Bengals from drafting an elite offensive line prospect.  That is what they see in Carman, and they were able to slide and get two additional 4th rounders (one of which seems to be pushing him for playing time already) to further help fill out the roster.

Carman's performance thus far seems largely attached to a lack of conditioning.  I get why the coaches might be disgruntled there, but I remember that Carman wasn't able to show at the Clemson Pro Day because he had put off surgery to correct a herniated disc in his back and played through it the last four games of the season to try and win another title. 

I'm sure he was given a clean bill of health early enough to get in shape, but maybe he had some remaining fatigue from his senior year.  Whatever the issue, I have faith that it will be corrected and Carman will be performing on our line for a long time to come. 

It is easy to forget that they also signed Riley Reiff, a former first rounder and a solid tackle prospect.  Not to mention the re-signing of Spain, who helped stabilize the line last year and played at three different positions.  

I also believe the Bengals are waiting to see what shakes free on cut day (or maybe a trade to the Saints, who just lost their kicker for Seibert?) to further enhance the offensive line.  

The two are NOT mutually exclusive.  Drafting Chase wasn't ignoring the offensive line.  

I look at the bengals track history of evaluating offensive lineman and I worry when they go against the grain and grab a guy like Carman in the second when he’s got a 4th round grade. Couple that with out of shape for whatever reason maybe a injury is still reason to stay away the bengals were and are not in a position to grab a guy and develop him over time this oline needs help desperately now... and drafting chase first and then Carman in the second doesn’t help the oline at all right now. Yes bringing in Reiff was helpful but mainly cuz he replaced a back up tackle who was starting here. Reiff is on the wrong side of 30 hasn’t played at a high level for a year or so not saying he’s bad cuz sadly he’s the best tackle we have but Riley Reiff isn’t worrying a single defensive end that looks at us on the schedule. I like the resigning of Spain and I’m hopeful that he’s as good as he says he’s gonna be this year but regardless he still comes from that horrific oline last year. Everyone of our olineman comes with a big question mark. I don’t want familiar faces on the oline other than Jonah we need new good veteran blood and this line has question marks up n down the line still after an offseason to make it better for your dead franchise qb. The bengals have done a horrible job this offseason attacking the offensive line and now u have a 4th rounder challenging Carman for snaps.....at the back up position. Not starting snaps but back up snaps...yippie. Now if there was good news coming out of camp about Carman then a 4th rounder pressing him for snaps could be a good thing however Carman has looked terrible which is why the 4th rounder who’s had a few good reps here n there is challenging him. It’s pretty dubious across the board man. God bless burrow this year good lord

(08-11-2021, 02:09 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: I haven't even heard anything about Carman struggling, he was just put lower on the depth chart initially cause he came in a bit 
overweight is what I have been hearing and last I heard he was back to starting again at RG. We don't know if Sewell would be 
struggling right now in TC at Guard either as that is also where he would have to start except when Reiff or Jonah rest.

If XSF beats out Carman at RG so be it, XSF was our best Guard last season according to PFF. When we had Spain and XSF out 
there last season we were much better in the interior and it helped the entire OL. It isn't the end of the world if Carman doesn't
start game 1, we just need to have the best 5 out there and our depth improved which is our biggest weakness.

But yeah, Taylor shouldn't have us throwing the ball 50+ times, that is BS even if we are down. Run the ball, what is nice is I 
have been hearing the Wide Zone concept Pollack has been implementing has been doing good run blocking which is great news.

Yeah I've been kind of struggling to find camp updates. I was assuming he was struggling because he wasn't with the 1s and then they had him take some reps with the 1s and then moved him back. I saw today he was taken reps with the 3s. 
But regardless of that I was just trying to explain why myself and maybe others were concerned. But I'm fine if other players step up and start at guard. For myself I was trying to have limited expectations for this team this year but with seeing the talent on offense I was really starting to get excited. Then the slow start to camp was more than a little concerning. But everything seems to be heading in the right direction.
Also I'm really liking the talent/chemistry we seem to have going on the defensive side of the ball. So I've drank the Kool-aid. I don't know that were a playoff team but I'm hoping were in the running late in the season.

(08-09-2021, 06:37 PM)George Cantstandya Wrote: Way too early to tell. Keep in mind he didn't even play last year so getting back up to speed might take some time.   But I will say this.  It seems there are some here that are kind of wishing Chase isn't great and Carman is a bust just so they can say, "I told you so."

These people don't exist. Stop it.

Yes, there are people who are probably dying to say I told you so, but not to the point where they're hoping for a miserable season just to rub it in some dude's faces on a friggin message board.