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+--- Thread: Picman Returning Kicks (/Thread-Picman-Returning-Kicks)
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RE: Picman Returning Kicks - bfine32 - 09-12-2016
(09-12-2016, 09:50 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: Coaches for putting him back there. And giving the green light to anyone returning kicks to bring it out of the endzone.
The league makes a change to improve safety and reduce collisions in the play responsible for the most injuries.. And we say screw that we want worse starting field position and our defensive captain to take massive brutal hits?
I thought after seeing Picman demolished at the 10 yard line everybody would be on board with this.
From what I understand kick returns should be based on protection. If the protection called (block left, right, center) and the kick goes to that side then return it; if not, fair catch or take a knee.
Also the reduction of collisions really doesn't effect the returner
I have no problem in the Bengals using every tool in their toolbox.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - NATI BENGALS - 09-12-2016
(09-12-2016, 10:39 PM)bfine32 Wrote: From what I understand kick returns should be based on protection. If the protection called (block left, right, center) and the kick goes to that side then return it; if not, fair catch or take a knee.
Also the reduction of collisions really doesn't effect the returner
I have no problem in the Bengals using every tool in their toolbox.
And one of those tools is taking a knee and getting the ball on the 25. It is a stuggle to get to the 20 so thinking we can get to the 25 seems delusional. How many times will we have to start with worse field position than a touchback in order for us to take advantage of a new rule?
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - GreenDragon - 09-12-2016
(09-12-2016, 01:28 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: You have to be kidding me with this. The guy who admittedly refuses to fair catch punts and just so happens to be our best CB returning kicks in the first game?
We stole a huge win in a trap game. But the coaches decision to let Picman run out kicks is mind boggling. When the kick has gone into the endzone the last few years guys are lucky to get it out to the 20. Well now the rule is you get the ball on the 25 for touchbacks.
I hope this is the last time this year i see Adam Jones run a kick out of the endzone and take a monster shot at the 10 yard line. When a simple knee gets you the 25 take it every time. This shouldnt even be a discussion.
OMG WTF. Take a knee and take the ball on the 25 any time you can. And for God's sake dont make our best DB go back there and let him get destroyed.
I was pretty sure Erickson made the team based on his kick return prowess.
Why Adam Jones was out there to return a kick was beyond me.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - treee - 09-12-2016
I agree with the general sentiment that seeing Jones out there at KR and PR should be more of a novelty when we are in desperate need of a potential electric play. That said, we definitely needed one early in the game yesterday.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - Nicomo Cosca - 09-12-2016
(09-12-2016, 11:17 PM)treee Wrote: I agree with the general sentiment that seeing Jones out there at KR and PR should be more of a novelty when we are in desperate need of a potential electric play. That said, we definitely needed one early in the game yesterday.
But they kept using him the whole game.
Iirc Erikson only had 1 return.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - EatonFan - 09-13-2016
(09-12-2016, 11:56 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: But they kept using him the whole game.
Iirc Erikson only had 1 return.
Actually he had 3. One PR. One KR. One fair catch on a punt.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - Jpoore - 09-13-2016
I think pacman is way better returning punts. Let erickson return kickoffs pacman return punts.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - Rattler - 09-13-2016
I wouldn't be surprised to see the NFL continue to phase out and/or tinker with as much special teams play as practicable.
We've already seen teams manipulate the new rule by having the kicker drop high hangers right at or just past the goal line,
a smart and effective approach to be sure, but the exact opposite of the rules intention.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - Essex Johnson - 09-13-2016
(09-12-2016, 10:46 PM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: And one of those tools is taking a knee and getting the ball on the 25. It is a stuggle to get to the 20 so thinking we can get to the 25 seems delusional. How many times will we have to start with worse field position than a touchback in order for us to take advantage of a new rule?
This is so funny, many wanted Tate gone so we can improve our kick return.. now he is gone, people are bitching that we should not use one of the best return men we have ever seen .
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - leonardfan40 - 09-13-2016
(09-13-2016, 07:49 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: This is so funny, many wanted Tate gone so we can improve our kick return.. now he is gone, people are bitching that we should not use one of the best return men we have ever seen .
Because he's not just a return man, he's a stud CB, captain, and vital member of the defense. Not worth losing all of that for a kick return. And erickson beat out Tate so he is an upgrade from what we had. Use him, and when you're given the opportunity for starting at the 25 don't risk it unless the odds of beating that position are obviously in your favor
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - Essex Johnson - 09-13-2016
(09-13-2016, 09:11 PM)leonardfan40 Wrote: Because he's not just a return man, he's a stud CB, captain, and vital member of the defense. Not worth losing all of that for a kick return. And erickson beat out Tate so he is an upgrade from what we had. Use him, and when you're given the opportunity for starting at the 25 don't risk it unless the odds of beating that position are obviously in your favor
That is contrary to what I have read over the last couple years, many people called for using Adam more and more, now we have the chance and after one game we are overreacting... Peterson is a stud CB also and he was used for a return man... I have seen AB from Steelers return punts,, hell I believe he has taken two to the house against us....
as for not risking it,, again how many times have i read the Bengals are too conservative, Marvin plays it to tight to the vest.. now we are bitching that he is too liberal...
come on, you can;t have your cake and eat it too
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - BigPapaKain - 09-13-2016
I don't give a shit whose returning kicks. My problem is the shitty blocking by the return team. It was pathetic.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - NATI BENGALS - 09-13-2016
(09-13-2016, 10:52 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: That is contrary to what I have read over the last couple years, many people called for using Adam more and more, now we have the chance and after one game we are overreacting... Peterson is a stud CB also and he was used for a return man... I have seen AB from Steelers return punts,, hell I believe he has taken two to the house against us....
as for not risking it,, again how many times have i read the Bengals are too conservative, Marvin plays it to tight to the vest.. now we are bitching that he is too liberal...
come on, you can;t have your cake and eat it too
The two highest scoring teams this weekend combined for two kickoff returns. Taking a touchback and the ball on the 25 didnt stop the Lions and stoolers from scoring more points than everybody else.
We use Picman sparingly on punt returns im fine with that. But guess what. Our CB depth took a hit when Leon left our ifirst round pick got hurt for the year. And another one of our CBs hasnt been able to stay healthy.
Sorry im not wanting to see Chykie Brown or CLH starting games because we had to have our shutdown CB run a kickoff out to the 10 yard line so a defensive linemen could damn near break him.
Our offense has produced in the past with Tate running kickoffs out to the 15. So maybe we will survive starting at the 25.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - 740Bengal - 09-14-2016
My buddy and I were discussing this Sunday evening, we think possibly father time is taking away Pac's kick returning explosiveness.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - Go Cards - 09-14-2016
Have said it before and will say again.
Jones is just an average kick returner yet a phenomenal punt returner.
Kick returning is more like a RB style, have to hit the lanes and keep running downhill while pursuit passes by.
Punt returning takes more of a juking side to side fearless psychopathic style that not many are good at. But Jones is perfect for this.
Do not think he adds enough extra to kickoff returns to justify injury risk but love seeing him on occasional punt returns.
Erickson does both well though and am fine seeing him receive lions share of the work on both.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - XenoMorph - 09-14-2016
He prefers to be called Adam Jones you know.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - 740Bengal - 09-14-2016
(09-14-2016, 01:48 PM)XenoMorph Wrote: He prefers to be called Adam Jones you know.
Pacman is more swaggy.. lol.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 09-14-2016
(09-12-2016, 01:28 AM)NATI BENGALS Wrote: You have to be kidding me with this. The guy who admittedly refuses to fair catch punts and just so happens to be our best CB returning kicks in the first game?
We stole a huge win in a trap game. But the coaches decision to let Picman run out kicks is mind boggling. When the kick has gone into the endzone the last few years guys are lucky to get it out to the 20. Well now the rule is you get the ball on the 25 for touchbacks.
I hope this is the last time this year i see Adam Jones run a kick out of the endzone and take a monster shot at the 10 yard line. When a simple knee gets you the 25 take it every time. This shouldnt even be a discussion.
OMG WTF. Take a knee and take the ball on the 25 any time you can. And for God's sake dont make our best DB go back there and let him get destroyed.
After the rule change i agree. Take the 25 or let Erickson or Boyd return the Kicks.
Adam on Punts on the other hand when he is fresh i am all for in a tough game. Depends on how desperate we are.
Still, you are right. Would be majorly stupid to lose our best Corner returning Kicks.
RE: Picman Returning Kicks - Daddy-O - 09-14-2016
To me the rule change was the main reason Brandon Tate was not retained. How many times did he actually get the ball back to the 25? Might as well just take a knee and start on offense without the risk of injury.
To your original post though, didn't really like to see Adam Jones running back kickoff to start a game. Doesn't make sense, other than just not exposing the new guy to that atmosphere out of the gate. I'm good with punts, just not kick returns - those are train collisions and AJ is too valuable.