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Corporate welfare needs to stop - Printable Version +- Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise (http://thebengalsboard.com) +-- Forum: Off Topic Forums (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-Off-Topic-Forums) +--- Forum: Politics & Religion 2.0 (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-Politics-Religion-2-0) +---- Forum: P & R Archive (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-P-R-Archive) +---- Thread: Corporate welfare needs to stop (/Thread-Corporate-welfare-needs-to-stop) |
RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - Beaker - 06-12-2015 (06-12-2015, 06:36 PM)oncemoreuntothejimbreech Wrote: Are you really insulting my intelligence after what you wrote about true discussion and mudslinging? Nope. I am challenging you to up your game and not resort to the rhetoric. I am saying I know you are actually more intelligent than just parroting phrases. Some in here are likely not. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - oncemoreuntothejimbreech - 06-13-2015 (06-12-2015, 08:44 PM)Beaker Wrote: Nope. I am challenging you to up your game and not resort to the rhetoric. I am saying I know you are actually more intelligent than just parroting phrases. Some in here are likely not. It's not rhetoric if true and used correctly, which it was. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - Yojimbo - 06-13-2015 I had no idea Dwight D. Eisenhower was considered a talking head. I thought he was a President and a Supreme Allied Commander during WW2. What time is his show on? http://youtu.be/8y06NSBBRtY RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - Wyche'sWarrior - 06-13-2015 (06-13-2015, 03:58 AM)Yojimbo Wrote: I had no idea Dwight D. Eisenhower was considered a talking head. I thought he was a President and a Supreme Allied Commander during WW2. What time is his show on? Good luck getting folks to take the time away from partisan bickering to watch this..... RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - michaelsean - 06-16-2015 (06-13-2015, 03:58 AM)Yojimbo Wrote: I had no idea Dwight D. Eisenhower was considered a talking head. I thought he was a President and a Supreme Allied Commander during WW2. What time is his show on? He also said we need a giant armaments industry, but that quote seems to always get overlooked. As is anything else DDE said ever. One quote is all he gets. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - GMDino - 06-16-2015 (06-16-2015, 10:58 AM)michaelsean Wrote: He also said we need a giant armaments industry, but that quote seems to always get overlooked. As is anything else DDE said ever. One quote is all he gets. I can't find that one. But did he mean we needed to be able to produce quickly? Or we needed to keep producing? What I did find was this: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/12/16/ike-and-generals-how-eisenhower-stood-up-to-his-own-military.html Quote:Dwight Eisenhower loved the army, in which he served for almost all of his adult life. It continues on for a bit longer. But it seems DDE knew war was hell...and expensive. And he was intent on streaming and improving the US military...but not funding an industry. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - GMDino - 06-16-2015 One more quote from the link above: Quote:Eisenhower would periodically sigh to his staff secretary, General Andrew Goodpaster, “God help the nation when it has a president who doesn’t know as much about the military as I do.” RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - michaelsean - 06-16-2015 It's in the same speech. Quote: A vital element in keeping the peace is our military establishment. Our arms must be mighty, ready for instant action, so that no potential aggressor may be tempted to risk his own destruction. He warns on the heels of acknowledging its necessity. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - GMDino - 06-16-2015 (06-16-2015, 11:21 AM)michaelsean Wrote: It's in the same speech. Ok. But you can see the difference between a man who knew and understood the military advancing newer weapons while controlling spending vs the current climate of saying if you cut the defense budget you hate America. Thus funding the military industrial complex he also spoke of. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - michaelsean - 06-16-2015 (06-16-2015, 11:26 AM)GMDino Wrote: Ok. But you can see the difference between a man who knew and understood the military advancing newer weapons while controlling spending vs the current climate of saying if you cut the defense budget you hate America. Thus funding the military industrial complex he also spoke of. Well there are always extremes, but people try to make it like he was against an armaments industry when what he was saying, as you would say with anything of that magnitude, is be careful and responsible. The speech continues with warnings of influence, and I agree, I just think people use one line to misrepresent an entire thought process. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - Wyche'sWarrior - 06-16-2015 (06-16-2015, 11:26 AM)GMDino Wrote: Ok. But you can see the difference between a man who knew and understood the military advancing newer weapons while controlling spending vs the current climate of saying if you cut the defense budget you hate America. Thus funding the military industrial complex he also spoke of. Yes, I think this summed it quite well....... "Meeting with congressional leaders in late April, Ike was blunt: “I’m damn tired of Air Force sales programs,” he said. “In 1946, they argued that if we can have seventy [bomber] groups, we’ll guarantee security for ever and ever...Now the Air Force has come up with the “trick figure of 141 [bomber groups]. They sell it. Then you have to abide by it or you're treasonous.”" RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - GMDino - 06-16-2015 (06-16-2015, 11:33 AM)michaelsean Wrote: Well there are always extremes, but people try to make it like he was against an armaments industry when what he was saying, as you would say with anything of that magnitude, is be careful and responsible. The speech continues with warnings of influence, and I agree, I just think people use one line to misrepresent an entire thought process. Perhaps it gets oversimplified, but that is the gist of it: We need a military..we don't need an industry that is fed by the government to have it at its best. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - michaelsean - 06-16-2015 (06-16-2015, 11:42 AM)GMDino Wrote: Perhaps it gets oversimplified, but that is the gist of it: We need a military..we don't need an industry that is fed by the government to have it at its best. No he says we do need that industry. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - GMDino - 06-16-2015 (06-16-2015, 11:49 AM)michaelsean Wrote: No he says we do need that industry. Yes...but not one that can do whatever it wants. Thus his mention of Air Force Sales Program. We need a military and the ability to sustain it...not an industry fed by the government. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - michaelsean - 06-16-2015 (06-16-2015, 12:16 PM)GMDino Wrote: Yes...but not one that can do whatever it wants. Thus his mention of Air Force Sales Program. I don't know what you mean by industry fed by the government. He says we need the industry, and obviously it's the government that will be paying for it. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - fredtoast - 06-17-2015 (06-16-2015, 12:38 PM)michaelsean Wrote: I don't know what you mean by industry fed by the government. Go back and look at the OP. The United States just gave Vietnam $18 million of U S taxpayer money to purchase military weapons from a private U S company. But maybe this quote will make the game much clearer to you In terms of total money received, Israel is the largest cumulative recipient of military assistance from the United States between 2002 and 2011 Israel received $30 billion of US foreign aid, of which nearly 75% was used to purchase U.S. defense equipment from American companies. In 2007, the United States increased its military aid to Israel to an average of $3 billion per year for the following ten-year period (starting at $2.550 billion for 2008, growing by $150 million each year). [/font]The package started in October 2008, when regular aid to Israel's economy ended.[/color] Officials have insisted the aid is not tied, or meant to balance, simultaneous American plans to sell $20 billion worth of sophisticated arms to its Arab allies in the region, including Egypt and Saudi Arabia Basically our government takes our tax money and gives it to other countries to buy weapons from private U S companies, and we maximize profits by selling weapons TO BOTH SIDES AT THE SAME TIME RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - Wyche'sWarrior - 06-17-2015 (06-17-2015, 01:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Go back and look at the OP. The United States just gave Vietnam $18 million of U S taxpayer money to purchase military weapons from a private U S company. Ding! Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winnah!!!!! Get that man a cigar!!!!!!! RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - michaelsean - 06-17-2015 (06-17-2015, 01:26 PM)fredtoast Wrote: Go back and look at the OP. The United States just gave Vietnam $18 million of U S taxpayer money to purchase military weapons from a private U S company. This is a particular instance where we can disagree with what they are doing, but in the context of Eisenhower, who says we do need an armaments industry, who else is going to do the paying? Dino said "an industry fed by the government". RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - Bilbo Saggins - 06-18-2015 (06-12-2015, 02:48 PM)Beaker Wrote: I don't know you too well, but I know fred pretty good. Fred and I agree on some things, don't agree on many others, but generally have a healthy respect for one another. I know fred is a fairly intelligent poster. And I know fred looks deeper at many issues than most. In fact, he is one of the few who I do think loos at the info and draws his own conclusions. What I am asking him (and others) to do is SOUND as intelligent as you are in your posts. When you use rhetorical terms such as "weathy elite", "big corporations", "military industrial complex" and others, it make you sound like the idiots who just parrot back what they hear the talking heads say on the news magazine programs. Now I know fred will get what I am saying/asking. It remains to be seen if you do. The problem that I had with your criticism of certain terms was that they were terms commonly used to describe a particular world view. Implying that everyone who uses said terms "didn't think for themselves" seemed like you were slamming that particular train of thought rather than critiquing the use of hackneyed political phrases. It'd be different had you criticized all hackneyed terms that people throw around in order to enhance clarity of discussion but that wasn't how it came off at all. My apologies if I had somehow misinterpreted the angle that you were coming from. RE: Corporate welfare needs to stop - GMDino - 06-18-2015 (06-17-2015, 03:06 PM)michaelsean Wrote: This is a particular instance where we can disagree with what they are doing, but in the context of Eisenhower, who says we do need an armaments industry, who else is going to do the paying? Dino said "an industry fed by the government". Yes. Tax money goes to build weapons. Allow me to clarify. We now have an industry that is raping the government of our tax money and larger and larger levels for their own profit. We have exactly what DDE warned about. Money going to build things even the military leaders don't want...but that the INDUSTRY people lobby for in order to fill their own coffers. We have an INDUSTRY being fed by the government....not the government funding a the military. |