Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Printable Version +- Cincinnati Bengals Message Board / Forums - Home of Jungle Noise (http://thebengalsboard.com) +-- Forum: Cincinnati Bengals / NFL (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-Cincinnati-Bengals-NFL) +--- Forum: JUNGLE NOISE (http://thebengalsboard.com/Forum-JUNGLE-NOISE) +--- Thread: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson (/Thread-Michael-Jordan-is-Working-Out-With-Willie-Anderson) |
RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Shake n Blake - 06-14-2021 (06-13-2021, 03:05 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Uh, I think most of us want to see all our players improve... A lot to unpack here. 1. Yeah, we all want to see players get better. How likely is it though? I had a lot of similar arguments about Ogbuehi, Fisher, Bodine, etc. Usually if a guy stinks to high heaven for 2 years, he doesn't suddenly flip a switch and become a good player in year 3-4. That's all I'm saying. 2. We got Reiff on a 1 year deal. For all we know, we'll be needing a RT again next March. 3. I'm not "hating" anyone, just trying to be realistic. 4. Carman is a decent prospect, but dial it back a notch. (06-13-2021, 06:20 PM)SunsetBengal Wrote: So then what happens if the proverbial "light comes on"? As in he takes well to the coaching, improves his technique, and wins the job, outright? See #1 of my response to Nate. Yes, Jordan may end up starting, and I think that speaks more to our current depth than anything positive about MJ. Although it's possible he won't stink "quite" as badly under Pollack. (06-13-2021, 06:51 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Where did anyone say anything about him starting? So we're talking about Jordan's hidden potential coming out...on the bench? RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nicomo Cosca - 06-14-2021 (06-14-2021, 06:52 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: So we're talking about Jordan's hidden potential coming out...on the bench? Training camp. Preseason. Practice. All of which he could use to show the coaches he’s at least worthy of being a backup for right now. I think I speak for most that I don’t want to see him starting in real games as early as this year though. Let him develop in practice, and re-evaluate where he is down the road when it’s time to make a decision about Spain/XSF, and the other OG spot (hopefully Carman has RG locked down). If MJ is still not there move on and draft someone else. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Shake n Blake - 06-14-2021 (06-14-2021, 07:23 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Training camp. Preseason. Practice. All of which he could use to show the coaches he’s at least worthy of being a backup for right now. I think I speak for most that I don’t want to see him starting in real games as early as this year though. Let him develop in practice, and re-evaluate where he is down the road when it’s time to make a decision about Spain/XSF, and the other OG spot (hopefully Carman has RG locked down). If MJ is still not there move on and draft someone else. So maybe in year 4 or 5 he can be a decent starter? Maybe? If he shows out somehow? I think I can speak for most by saying that I don't think I'll be any more thrilled about Jordan starting in 2022 than I'd be in 2021. But hey, to each their own. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 06-14-2021 (06-14-2021, 06:52 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: A lot to unpack here. Understandable lol If Reiff plays well, again I think we extend him and with Adeniji and D'Ante Smith I think we have some good young guys to learn from him. Dude is a proven good OT in the NFL and has already been given props for his leadership running the OL room from Uzomah in his interview. Expecting much better play from the RT position this season and for years to come. Carman is better than a lot of people are saying, just saying. I will dial it back a notch for you guys even though I love what I see and I love the move to Guard and thought so before we ever drafted the man. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 06-14-2021 (06-14-2021, 07:23 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Training camp. Preseason. Practice. All of which he could use to show the coaches he’s at least worthy of being a backup for right now. I think I speak for most that I don’t want to see him starting in real games as early as this year though. Let him develop in practice, and re-evaluate where he is down the road when it’s time to make a decision about Spain/XSF, and the other OG spot (hopefully Carman has RG locked down). If MJ is still not there move on and draft someone else. Yeah. (06-14-2021, 08:03 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: So maybe in year 4 or 5 he can be a decent starter? Maybe? If he shows out somehow? I think I can speak for most by saying that I don't think I'll be any more thrilled about Jordan starting in 2022 than I'd be in 2021. But hey, to each their own. He is only 23 years old, give the guy a chance is all. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nicomo Cosca - 06-14-2021 (06-14-2021, 08:03 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: So maybe in year 4 or 5 he can be a decent starter? Maybe? If he shows out somehow? I think I can speak for most by saying that I don't think I'll be any more thrilled about Jordan starting in 2022 than I'd be in 2021. But hey, to each their own. Guy was clearly not ready, and had Jim Turner as his only NFL coach. Who knows what the future will be for him, but 23 is a bit early to be writing him off. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - samhain - 06-14-2021 I'm not overly comfortable with the continued effort to sell Jordan as a viable candidate for playing time on the o-lne. There is no way he should start over Spain or XSF. If Carman was anywhere near worth a second round selection, he should hold MJ off with ease. It sucks that he was all sad about Burrow's injury. It sucks that he feels responsible (he sort of is). That doesn't make him worthy of a starting job, or any real playing time. He's a demonstrably awful guard. I don't want ownership to continue trying to sell me demonstrably awful players when there are better options available. Dude should be red-shirted (for lack of a better term) for a year to build some strength. If MJ sees a large amount of playing time this season, we probably aren't in an ideal place roster-wise with the line. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nicomo Cosca - 06-14-2021 (06-14-2021, 08:49 PM)samhain Wrote: I'm not overly comfortable with the continued effort to sell Jordan as a viable candidate for playing time on the o-lne. There is no way he should start over Spain or XSF. If Carman was anywhere near worth a second round selection, he should hold MJ off with ease. It sucks that he was all sad about Burrow's injury. It sucks that he feels responsible (he sort of is). That doesn't make him worthy of a starting job, or any real playing time. He's a demonstrably awful guard. I don't want ownership to continue trying to sell me demonstrably awful players when there are better options available. Dude should be red-shirted (for lack of a better term) for a year to build some strength. And that seems to be exactly what most are suggesting. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 06-14-2021 (06-14-2021, 08:51 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: And that seems to be exactly what most are suggesting. No doubt. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - tms - 06-14-2021 I think this guy would be better off starting fresh with a new team. I don't see why we're keeping him around, tbh. Last year was horrific, he's plummeted on the depth chart, and Pollack's busy enough as is. As for working out with Big Willie, I guess that's good, but Willie is not one of our coaches. He was also brought in to work with Ced, and look how well that turned out. If anything it's a publicity stunt. Reminds me of Hakeem Olajuwon training all the lanky, raw, big-man projects from Africa back in the day. Always seemed like a good plan until the season began and you realized they were still the same players (i.e. not Hakeem). Give the kid a chance to begin anew somewhere else. Playing with the constant reminder of Burrow's ravaged knee cannot possibly be good for his future. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - rfaulk34 - 06-15-2021 (06-14-2021, 04:16 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: How so Rfaulk? Jackson Carman was arguably the best mauling, run blocking O-lineman in the Draft and I saw this way By what metric was he "arguably the best mauling, run blocking O-lineman in the draft"? There were 71 guys graded better than him, overall, and a quick count shows at least 10 of them were graded higher--names that i instantly recognized as being drafted and that's not including Sewell and Slater who weren't graded last year. I'm not sure why you keep name-dropping Synric but, let's be honest, you named about 15 guys you wanted in the 2nd round leading up to the draft. The injury was not the only reason evaluators thought he "dropped" to the 2nd round. He was widely viewed as a guy that had "starting potential" and could be an "adequate" guard in the NFL. Also, back injuries are never "over with" once surgery is done. Sewell has a much, much better chance of being great off the bat than Carman does. Speed rushers were not his "only weakness". There's a reason why it was a weakness and it's not going to just disappear because he moves inside. His change of direction and hand placement isn't going to magically get better because he has a little less space to work in. His player and situational awareness isn't going to just magically improve because he moves inside. Sewell is head and shoulders above Carman in awareness, agility and overall athletic ability and he shows stronger on tape. It's not really even close. Anything is possible. Pollack could be a huge boost for him but you've taken the guy and, without playing a single down in the NFL, skyrocketed him from being a potential starter to being a guy sniffing All Pro. I get the excitement but you're going off the rails in your predictions without anything more than a passage of time. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Frank Booth - 06-15-2021 (06-14-2021, 06:52 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: A lot to unpack here Please don’t say this ever again RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - TJ528 - 06-15-2021 (06-14-2021, 08:36 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Understandable lol Question is though Nate, does the Bengals learn from their mistakes of the past when it comes to a player being "past the age" of being good. We let Whit leave when he was 34 years old and hell Whits still killing it. Granted, had the Bengals signed Whit he'd probably be retired by now with some medical issues cause how often do things work out in that case for the Bengals. I'm hoping that Reiff kills it at RT this year because that only helps the team. However, I'm not going to hold my breath and hope for this front office to spent 10+M on a 34 yo offensive lineman for multiple season. It's a proven fact they don't believe in spending money on Guards and they don't believe players at that age can continue being productive. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nicomo Cosca - 06-15-2021 (06-15-2021, 10:55 AM)TJ528 Wrote: Question is though Nate, does the Bengals learn from their mistakes of the past when it comes to a player being "past the age" of being good. Whit was 36 when he left. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Shake n Blake - 06-15-2021 (06-14-2021, 08:39 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Yeah. (06-14-2021, 08:46 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Guy was clearly not ready, and had Jim Turner as his only NFL coach. Who knows what the future will be for him, but 23 is a bit early to be writing him off. Fair enough, guys. I'm not writing him off completely. Just saying that until we see some evidence on the field, my hopes are slim for him...and I certainly wouldn't be happy going into 2022 with him even competing at guard, unless I saw him play well in games this year. I'm not trusting any 2022 Hobson fluff pieces telling me how great Jordan has become RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - TJ528 - 06-15-2021 (06-15-2021, 11:17 AM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: Whit was 36 when he left. Nicomo, thank you for the correction. However, do you honestly think the Brown family would've given Whit a multi year contract extension for 10+M at the age of 34? I don't think that'd ever happen, which is why I don't believe it'd ever happen for Reiff either. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 06-16-2021 (06-15-2021, 02:36 AM)rfaulk34 Wrote: By what metric was he "arguably the best mauling, run blocking O-lineman in the draft"? There were 71 guys graded better than him, overall, and a quick count shows at least 10 of them were graded higher--names that i instantly recognized as being drafted and that's not including Sewell and Slater who weren't graded last year. Not fair to say 71 guys were graded better than Carman, how many OL were graded better than him is the question? I had him graded as a 2nd rounder before the Draft and that is right where we got him and even traded back and added picks. Carman is not going to face near as many speed rushers at Guard, fact. This was widely known as his main weakness before the Draft and most who studied up on him knew this and wanted him to move to Guard if we drafted him. Sewell is the bigger talent no question as he was the most talented OL in the entire Draft, but we all know how the draft goes. We don't know who will be the best OL out of this Draft. I think Carman will thrive at RG is all. We will see who is right. I predict both Carman and Sewell will struggle a bit early as all rookies pretty much do. But believe Carman has a chance to be a better rookie cause of the move inside. Just my opinion. If we were to throw Carman out to OT like most likely will happen to Sewell he would struggle more so IMO. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 06-16-2021 (06-15-2021, 10:55 AM)TJ528 Wrote: Question is though Nate, does the Bengals learn from their mistakes of the past when it comes to a player being "past the age" of being good. As Nicomo said, Whit was 36 when we let him go and yes we will have to learn from that mistake. It was pretty blatant when Whit went to the Rams and was All Pro. We will see if they learned from that... I think they will if Reiff plays well. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - Nate (formerly eliminate08) - 06-16-2021 (06-15-2021, 12:55 PM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Fair enough, guys. I'm not writing him off completely. Just saying that until we see some evidence on the field, my hopes are slim for him...and I certainly wouldn't be happy going into 2022 with him even competing at guard, unless I saw him play well in games this year. Yeah, I am not trusting the fluff either. But if Jordan plays well I will give him props, so far he has been pretty terrible and cannot get low. Pollack and Willie working with him should help though over Turner. RE: Michael Jordan is Working Out With Willie Anderson - rfaulk34 - 06-16-2021 (06-16-2021, 03:07 PM)Nate (formerly eliminate08) Wrote: Not fair to say 71 guys were graded better than Carman, how many OL were graded better than him is the question? Sorry. When i said "71 guys", that only included Center, Guard and Tackle. Not all were eligible to be drafted though, that's where the second number comes in. Guys that i recognized as being drafted. Yes, speed rushers were one of the things that was pointed out, but i was referencing where you said it was his only problem. I too think he's going to play better at guard, and help the Bengals, more than he would have at tackle. |