(10-13-2019, 08:48 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I agree that a talented QB can potentially change the trajectory of an organization...but the organization has to be willing to do what it takes to make that QB successful. When you say "you can work on other pieces" - well, how long will that take with a franchise that still isn't willing to be buyers in the free agent market, who have not had great success with their last few drafts and who's current roster is littered with problems? 

Say we take a Tua, Hebert or whoever. How much of an impact will he make if the o-line is still shit, they can't run consistently, can't tackle, get pressure, make proper adjustments, have more subpar drafts, continue to sign lower-tier FA's???

Again, I'm all for replacing Andy, but replacing the QB - on this particular team - is just one piece of a very big, problem filled puzzle, no matter how good he is. Like I said, if they replace Andy and don't do the other things that are desperately needed...then we will be nothing more than a team with a talented QB surrounded by a lot of other problems.

I would love to see them not only replace Andy, but be extremely serious and aggressive about fixing this roster. I was hopeful we would see a step in that direction this offseason with the new HC and staff, but it was more of the same...with Hart, Miller, Webb and Wynn being the crown jewels of the offseason. 

I guess what I'm saying is that the front office needs to get off their complacent asses and get serious about building a winner. No more interviews about how they want to win, no more letters to fans about how they are trying to win...just go out and do what it takes to make this franchise successful and quit settling for "occasionally good" as the goal.

(10-13-2019, 10:11 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: I posted stats a couple weeks back about how bad they've been against the run over the last 3 plus years. 

It's just hard to watch at this point...getting ran all over again and again.

(10-13-2019, 08:52 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: LB and Oline kind of run neck in neck for the biggest problem. 

Lemme tell you though. As usual with this team, probably, theee biggest problem has been injuries (plus a retirement). 

Put Jonah at LT. Put Glenn at RT. Put Boling at LG. Put AJ in the starting lineup. Are we looking at a 0-6 team? I doubt it. 

A better, higher scoring offense keeps the D off the field more and scores more points. Shootouts may be necessary but at least the pieces are there to pull it off, e.g., Atlanta last year.

(10-13-2019, 08:48 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: Say we take a Tua, Hebert or whoever. How much of an impact will he make if the o-line is still shit, they can't run consistently, can't tackle, get pressure, make proper adjustments, have more subpar drafts, continue to sign lower-tier FA's???

Again, I'm all for replacing Andy, but replacing the QB - on this particular team - is just one piece of a very big, problem filled puzzle, no matter how good he is. Like I said, if they replace Andy and don't do the other things that are desperately needed...then we will be nothing more than a team with a talented QB surrounded by a lot of other problems.

(10-13-2019, 10:24 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: See, this is what i've been spewing about for the last couple weeks (maybe longer--it's in a reply somewhere on here). A good QB can move and avoid the rush better than Dalton which gives him a chance to complete more passes or run for more yards. Completing those passes or running, turns into more opportunities for first downs which does 2 things; gives a better chance at scoring points and keeps the defense off the field longer. 

A QB can mask a teams deficiencies on both sides of the ball simultaneously. He can also give you a chance when the defense is crapping all over themselves by being able to put more points on the board, keeping the team in the game. The Bengals currently have enough talented skill position players to help a good QB out. Even moreso with AJ back in the lineup. 
All that said, a shiny new athletic QB can't carry a team for his career without help, see; Carson Palmer. Other areas still need to be addressed in order to make the team a true SB contender. 
A new QB is more like stitches to close a wound. 

P.S. As an example, Deshaun Watson gets sacked more than Dalton (i have a post about that around here somewhere too--most sacked QBs), but he's able to still avoid more often than not and extend drives, helping his team win games. He does it with his feet as well as his arm. Today's dual threat QB is not like yesterday's dual threat QB. He's not a guy that can barely pass but is a good runner, ala, Vick, he's a guy that can hurt you running AND passing equally. 
Right now, Andy Dalton is the guy that keeps ripping those stitches out. 

(10-13-2019, 10:27 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I harp on pocket presence but I don't know that a lot of people get it. Brady's lineman give up pressure too, but he sense it and moves up 2 feet in the pocket and the DE has no angle to sack him.

Dalton may be the worst QB in the NFL at moving around the pocket to avoid the blitz. He just doesn't have it. So he gets sacked when a guy like Brady or Roethlisberger wouldn't.

It's teachable to some extent...but not at this point in his career.

(10-13-2019, 10:31 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: But according to many here Brady has never even been breathed on, let alone pressured or sacked!

You’re telling me that’s not true??

(10-13-2019, 10:31 PM)Nicomo Cosca Wrote: But according to many here Brady has never even been breathed on, let alone pressured or sacked!

You’re telling me that’s not true??

(10-13-2019, 10:27 PM)THE PISTONS Wrote: I harp on pocket presence but I don't know that a lot of people get it. Brady's lineman give up pressure too, but he sense it and moves up 2 feet in the pocket and the DE has no angle to sack him.

Dalton may be the worst QB in the NFL at moving around the pocket to avoid the blitz. He just doesn't have it. So he gets sacked when a guy like Brady or Roethlisberger wouldn't.

It's teachable to some extent...but not at this point in his career.

(10-13-2019, 10:07 PM)Jakeypoo Wrote: They gave up 200 + yards on the ground for the third time this season . You're not going to win many games doing that. 
Andy isn't the answer (especially at his price) but my God we need to stop  the run. It's like ground hog day every Sunday since 2017 no LB core and No offensive line.

(10-13-2019, 10:39 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: That has to be it. As many times as Ben was sacked the first half of his career, he avoided so many more. He was known for extending plays when the line broke down and he's not some smallish, athletic guy that is RBish (like Lamar). 

That's all it takes, a guy that can move just enough to give himself a chance to complete a pass. 

(10-13-2019, 10:39 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: That has to be it. As many times as Ben was sacked the first half of his career, he avoided so many more. He was known for extending plays when the line broke down and he's not some smallish, athletic guy that is RBish (like Lamar). 

That's all it takes, a guy that can move just enough to give himself a chance to complete a pass. 

(10-13-2019, 10:44 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: LB is the huge problem on defense, both in run and pass. 

(10-13-2019, 10:49 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Meanwhile, in Los Angeles, a Pittsburgh third string quarterback is ripping the Chargers a new arsehole 21 - 0 at halftime by mixing short passes with gashing runs by James Conner and Benny Snell.  Conner has 39 yards rushing and 66 yards catching passes out of the backfield.  That’s what Giovani Bernard used to do.

(10-13-2019, 10:45 PM)Synric Wrote: Drew Brees is the master when in the pocket he never moves 2 inches when 1 would do...

(10-13-2019, 10:39 PM)rfaulk34 Wrote: That has to be it. As many times as Ben was sacked the first half of his career, he avoided so many more. He was known for extending plays when the line broke down and he's not some smallish, athletic guy that is RBish (like Lamar). 

That's all it takes, a guy that can move just enough to give himself a chance to complete a pass.

(10-13-2019, 10:49 PM)Fan_in_Kettering Wrote: Meanwhile, in Los Angeles, a Pittsburgh third string quarterback is ripping the Chargers a new arsehole 21 - 0 at halftime by mixing short passes with gashing runs by James Conner and Benny Snell.  Conner has 39 yards rushing and 66 yards catching passes out of the backfield.  That’s what Giovani Bernard used to do.