(07-26-2020, 10:17 PM)GMDino Wrote: I've always said leave the toys at home if you want to be peaceful.  Again, lots of folks march with guns and they get defended by the right because it is "their right" which I agree that it is even if I too find it moronic.  Also, didn't help the guy if he never got a shot off anyway.  

(07-26-2020, 10:01 PM)bfine32 Wrote: Because D Villa on twitter said so. 

(07-26-2020, 10:09 PM)GMDino Wrote: I dunno...guess you disagree with the police doing the investigation.

https://www.dallasnews.com/news/texas/2020/07/26/man-fatally-shot-at-protest-in-austin/






So a BLM protestor is legally carrying a gun and shot and killed.  Weird.  I thought people who carried like that we just exercising their 2A rights.  I guess not if they are "leftists".

(07-26-2020, 11:07 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: None of us know if this guy pointed his weapon or not, and if there’s any evidence he did we’ll find out eventually. Let the cops figure this one out. If he did, he’s the blame for his own death. If he didn’t, the driver will be going to jail.

This story does highlight a pretty interesting look at how people will justify or vilify pointing weapons at people based on if it’s someone walking on your neighborhood’s private street versus someone driving into a crowd of people.

(07-26-2020, 11:07 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: None of us know if this guy pointed his weapon or not, and if there’s any evidence he did we’ll find out eventually. Let the cops figure this one out. If he did, he’s the blame for his own death. If he didn’t, the driver will be going to jail.

Quote:This story does highlight a pretty interesting look at how people will justify or vilify pointing weapons at people based on if it’s someone walking on your neighborhood’s private street versus someone driving into a crowd of people.

(07-27-2020, 02:18 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I completely disagree.  Everyone has access to public areas, hence their presence in such an area could not logically be construed as a threat to others within it.  Private areas should only be accessible to those who own the area or otherwise have legitimate business within it.  Put simply, a loud angry crowd marching down the center of the public street on which my house is located may very well cause me alarm, but it would not, legally, give me cause to fear for my safety.  The exact same angry crowd marching down the center of the private street of my gated community would almost certainly give me cause me alarm and cause me to fear for my safety.  Its the same as someone being in your backyard or on the sidewalk in front of your home.  One is public and easily accessible and the other is the opposite of that.  Hence the level of alarm and fear for one's personal safety would absolutely not be the same from a legal, "reasonable person" standpoint.

(07-27-2020, 03:42 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: I understand the argument being used to defend the couple pointing guns at people, but that is not what I am contesting.

Rather, I find it interesting that people do not apply the same standard for the bigger threat (since we are examining all of these after the fact and know that one was more dangerous than the other), which was someone abruptly driving their car into a crowd of protestors. 

If the couple was justified in pointing their guns as protestors armed with ipads and microphones, the man pushing his gf in a wheelchair would then be justified in pointing their gun at the car that drove at him as it actually threatened him. I don't think either were justified (assuming the second one happened), but that's just me. 

(07-27-2020, 09:10 AM)GMDino Wrote: Seems when a couple aimed their guns at an "angry crowd" as they walked down the street it was a-okay simply because it was a private street.  But *if* someone aimed a gun at a man who may have been trying to run his car through a crowd he "played stupid games and won stupid prizes".

Quote:The 2A crowd better get on message here.  I'm starting to think they only want people they agree with to have guns and be able to use them.

Quote:And that comes from a guy who wants fewer guns pointed at strangers no matter who they are.

(07-27-2020, 10:46 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Do we know the man drive his car into a crowd or did the crowd surround his car?  There's plenty of videos of mobs surrounding peopl's cars and beating on them.  Simply search for mob surrounds car.





As we don't know the sequence of events are obviously speculating.

(07-27-2020, 10:46 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: No one said that, quit being intentionally inflammatory.

(07-27-2020, 10:46 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I see this argument from leftists on reddit and elsewhere all the time and it never ceases to amuse.  "Hey 2A people, this is tyranny, come on and rise up."  Let me clue you in, the vast majority of 2A enthusiasts aren't going to "rise up" to defend the very people who have been trying to take away their 2A rights for decades.  Or, to put it another way, "not your personal army".

(07-27-2020, 10:46 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I'd prefer no one point a gun at anyone, or rather never had the need to.  Sadly we will never live in such a world.  But you are the guy who wants to restrict 2A rights but want 2A enthusiasts to be on your side.  Intradesting to say the least.

(07-27-2020, 10:46 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Do we know the man drive his car into a crowd or did the crowd surround his car?  There's plenty of videos of mobs surrounding peopl's cars and beating on them.  Simply search for mob surrounds car.





As we don't know the sequence of events are obviously speculating.


No one said that, quit being intentionally inflammatory.



I see this argument from leftists on reddit and elsewhere all the time and it never ceases to amuse.  "Hey 2A people, this is tyranny, come on and rise up."  Let me clue you in, the vast majority of 2A enthusiasts aren't going to "rise up" to defend the very people who have been trying to take away their 2A rights for decades.  Or, to put it another way, "not your personal army".


I'd prefer no one point a gun at anyone, or rather never had the need to.  Sadly we will never live in such a world.  But you are the guy who wants to restrict 2A rights but want 2A enthusiasts to be on your side.  Intradesting to say the least.

(07-27-2020, 11:25 AM)GMDino Wrote: I can find video of people deliberately running over protestors too.  Yay.

Quote:Not that "exact" quote you are correct.  Just that if he didn't have a gun or allegedly point a gun he wouldn't have been shot.

Quote:So what I said was right:  The 2A "muh rights" folks only care about their own.  Very American.

Quote:To the bold we agree.  To the rest, nope.  I want consistency from the 2A side.  If carrying a gun is legal then don't victim shame the guy who got shot for carrying one.  If carrying a gun is for protection, well it didn't protect the guy who got shot.

Quote:I am a firm 2A supporter.  And if anyone has proof otherwise I'd love to see it.

(07-27-2020, 11:30 AM)BmorePat87 Wrote: Dino posted 2 videos last night. Both show the car driving into the crowd. You can also hear the car peel out and slam on its brakes as it does. 

(07-27-2020, 11:38 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Did it show what preceded it?  As in, was the guy escaping people throwing things at his car or hitting his car?  If it was as cut and dry as that I doubt the police would have questioned and released the shooter.

(07-27-2020, 11:38 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Or we care about helping people who haven't actively worked against us for years.

(07-27-2020, 11:47 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Which, to be fair, indicates that the real concern for the 2A community isn't a fight against tyranny. I mean, if your concern about the need for firearms is because of the need to fight against government oppression, then it shouldn't matter from which political direction that oppression comes. But, this isn't surprising to me when any leftist gun-rights groups have been shunned by other groups like Gun Owners of America. In addition to all of that, these past few months have caused many people left-of-center to re-evaluate positions on firearms. Those previously mentioned leftist gun groups have seen an uptick in interest. It's a missed opportunity to connect with more people to show the value of the 2A in modern society.

(07-27-2020, 11:47 AM)Belsnickel Wrote: Which, to be fair, indicates that the real concern for the 2A community isn't a fight against tyranny. I mean, if your concern about the need for firearms is because of the need to fight against government oppression, then it shouldn't matter from which political direction that oppression comes. But, this isn't surprising to me when any leftist gun-rights groups have been shunned by other groups like Gun Owners of America. In addition to all of that, these past few months have caused many people left-of-center to re-evaluate positions on firearms. Those previously mentioned leftist gun groups have seen an uptick in interest. It's a missed opportunity to connect with more people to show the value of the 2A in modern society.

(07-27-2020, 11:50 AM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I'd also add that many pro 2A people, and I know many, don't share the politics of those currently protesting, or at the very least believe they are far more extreme than they are comfortable with.  Hence the lack of those types at these protests.

(07-27-2020, 11:53 AM)GMDino Wrote: I know as many "liberals" that own guns as "conservatives".  I know many liberals who do not own guns who support the second amendment.  I know conservatives that own guns that aren't fighting tooth and nail against any and all "restrictions".

It's a wide spectrum that gets pushed into the two extremes fighting each other.