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+--- Thread: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics (/Thread-Election-Challenges-Protests-Conspiracy-Theories-and-Moral-Panics)
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 12-15-2020
(12-15-2020, 05:23 PM)GMDino Wrote: It's not "petty" to point out that you think Trump and his buddies being in cahoots with the Russians is a silly idea but you can say you
Inaccurate characterization of my statement. I would hope it's not deliberate. I have been referring to the claims that the GOP is in Putin's pocket, e.g. Moscow Mitch etc. When you don't even attack the argument I'm actually making you expose how weak your position is.
Quote:It's simply the same thing you are accusing "the left" of doing while speaking on "consistency".
Also incorrect, as I supplied proof.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Sociopathicsteelerfan - 12-15-2020
(12-15-2020, 05:20 PM)hollodero Wrote: Now for me, that is not quite true. Trump's uber-friendly politics towards Putin and his oligarchs were just one of many signs. There was Manafort giving private briefings, there is the whole suspicious Deutsche Bank issue, of course there was a massive influence campaign in favor of Trump in 2016, there were Trump tower meetings, there was Roger Stone's connection to Wikileaks, there was Trump lieing to the people on Putin's behalf, and the Russian foreign minister getting a secret meeting in the WH, handing out classified information included, there was a concealed Trump tower Moscow deal, there was Eric Prince backchanneling, Flynn and Sessions kind of backchanneling and lieing about it, Felix Sater backchanneling (or whatever that was), Russian infiltration of the NRA (Maria Butina, countering this Chinese spy admirably), there is a whole lot of issues (and there is more to mention than I did).
I didn't say there was more, I said it was all some needed. In any event my position on this was about the assertions that the GOP as a whole are in Putin's pocket, which is absurd.
Quote:And the Chinese? They placed someone on Swalwell's team and he was not aware for some time. Apparently Hunter did business with them. I don't see much more on this side of the story, and it seems to be way less at this point. When Biden starts believing Xi over his own intelligence, I will start to see the argument made.
Eh, who knows how much happened with Swallwell. He passed on an opportunity to say he did not sleep with the woman, nor was he the only person she got close to. Of course, this does not mean that the Dems are in Xi's pocket either.
As for Trump, he doesn't believe anything he doesn't like, this is not restricted to Putin, our intelligence or anything else.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - hollodero - 12-15-2020
(12-15-2020, 05:41 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: I didn't say there was more, I said it was all some needed. In any event my position on this was about the assertions that the GOP as a whole are in Putin's pocket, which is absurd.
Yeah, it probably is. I find it less absurd to claim they were, and still are, in Trump's pocket (including indirect effects stemming from that), but I know we differ on that subject.
And I don't know if it is all some needed. There just objectively was more and I guess for most that might have played into it.
(12-15-2020, 05:41 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: Eh, who knows how much happened with Swallwell. He passed on an opportunity to say he did not sleep with the woman, nor was he the only person she got close to. Of course, this does not mean that the Dems are in Xi's pocket either.
Yeah, right, who knows how much happened. That there might be way more and that this whole thing might draw way wider circles is indeed mere speculation on your part, and I have to agree with the assertion that your line demonstrates the exact same approach you (imho not 100% fairly, see list above) critizise the left for taking when it comes to Trump & Russia.
(12-15-2020, 05:41 PM)Sociopathicsteelerfan Wrote: As for Trump, he doesn't believe anything he doesn't like, this is not restricted to Putin, our intelligence or anything else.
Yeah, that imho is true, but I cannot place all the Russia oddities solely on that trope of his.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - BmorePat87 - 12-15-2020
I keep seeing it posted, and I go down the rabbit hole, but another flaw with the crazy delusion that fake electors will work is that the presiding officer does not settle disputes. They enforce rules and can reject objections for not meeting requirements established by the rules (like Al Gore rejecting objections of Florida's electors because it did not have support fro the Senate as any objection needs support from both chambers).
Objections are not settled by the joint session, rather the chambers go back and hold simple majority votes on whether or not to accept an objection. The House would fail to accept all objects and Pence cannot override that.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Au165 - 12-15-2020
In other legal news....
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/trump-organization-financial-documents-b1774618.html
It does appear that New York may be standing there waiting on January 20th with charges for atleast some members of the Trump family.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Nately120 - 12-16-2020
(12-15-2020, 06:08 PM)BmorePat87 Wrote: The House would fail to accept all objects and Pence cannot override that.
It is amusing that we are supposed to believe the VP can decide who the president is a mere 4 years after Joe Biden declared that Trump won the presidency. Biden should have just saved us some time and been like "And the winner of the 2016 presidency is....me! It's actually me, everyone voted for me, go figure!"
Because that's how elections work.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - BmorePat87 - 12-16-2020
(12-16-2020, 12:39 AM)Nately120 Wrote: It is amusing that we are supposed to believe the VP can decide who the president is a mere 4 years after Joe Biden declared that Trump won the presidency. Biden should have just saved us some time and been like "And the winner of the 2016 presidency is....me! It's actually me, everyone voted for me, go figure!"
Because that's how elections work.
Right? If this scenario were possible, the sitting VP would always just reject electors for anyone but their own party.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - GMDino - 12-16-2020
Trump failed (surprise) because he was unorganized and thought he was smarter than everyone else (surprise).
But we did see that there too many people who were more than willing to ignore the will of the people to support one man because he is in their party, and that there ARE ways for them to try and subvert the system.
That should never be forgotten.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Tiger Teeth - 12-16-2020
(12-15-2020, 12:43 PM)Nately120 Wrote: Can't we just take the reddest state in the USA and give it to Trump and the people who want to live under his family rule? I'm getting serious about this. It just seems like the only way out of this.
I nominate this to the Admins as Post Of The Year material. Well played sir.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Au165 - 12-17-2020
Trump is currently considering pardoning the chief financial officer of the Trump Organization. Now I wonder why someone would do such a thing? Something interesting to think about is a pardon only applies to past crimes. If Trump were to pardon the CFO as a favor to keep him from cooperating in an investigation, that would be a conspiracy to obstruct justice and ongoing meaning it would be a crime occurring after the said pardon.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Arturo Bandini - 12-17-2020
(12-17-2020, 09:49 AM)Au165 Wrote: Trump is currently considering pardoning the chief financial officer of the Trump Organization. Now I wonder why someone would do such a thing? Something interesting to think about is a pardon only applies to past crimes. If Trump were to pardon the CFO as a favor to keep him from cooperating in an investigation, that would be a conspiracy to obstruct justice and ongoing meaning it would be a crime occurring after the said pardon.
That's very kind of him to pardon honest people who did nothing wrong.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Big Boss - 12-17-2020
Might just be CNN stirring the pot, but if this is true they absolutely must film it.
https://twitter.com/donwinslow/status/1339392966457131010
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Au165 - 12-17-2020
(12-17-2020, 11:10 AM)Big Boss Wrote: Might just be CNN stirring the pot, but if this is true they absolutely must film it.
https://twitter.com/donwinslow/status/1339392966457131010
I think it's wishful thinking at this point, although I have thought he sways back and forth between believing his lies to be true and knowing they aren't so who knows for sure. In the end, I think they sell him on having his "moment" of boarding marine one and flying off.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - BmorePat87 - 12-17-2020
(12-17-2020, 11:10 AM)Big Boss Wrote: Might just be CNN stirring the pot, but if this is true they absolutely must film it.
https://twitter.com/donwinslow/status/1339392966457131010
I like the idea that he was going to take Air Force 1 to Florida during the inauguration to hold a competing rally, because it meant Biden could immediately call it back to DC at 12:01 and leave Trump in Florida.
Like, imagine him at 12:01 demanding it not take off and them saying "you're not the President"
I think he's going to struggle hard with not being President anymore.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - GMDino - 12-17-2020
When you look at all the other transfers of power in recent history it's such a stark contrast to see Trump throwing temper tantrums and not welcoming his successor into the WH. He is every bit the small, whiny baby most of said he was.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Nately120 - 12-17-2020
(12-17-2020, 09:44 PM)GMDino Wrote: When you look at all the other transfers of power in recent history it's such a stark contrast to see Trump throwing temper tantrums and not welcoming his successor into the WH. He is every bit the small, whiny baby most of said he was.
People wanted to see something different, I guess. I suppose everyone wins because Trump supporters get to watch a grown man do what they suddenly consider to be awesome/manly/reasonable and people who can't stand Trump get to feel validated in seeing him act every bit the egotistical maniac he is.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - GMDino - 12-17-2020
(12-17-2020, 10:22 PM)Nately120 Wrote: People wanted to see something different, I guess. I suppose everyone wins because Trump supporters get to watch a grown man do what they suddenly consider to be awesome/manly/reasonable and people who can't stand Trump get to feel validated in seeing him act every bit the egotistical maniac he is.
I have no doubt that those who supported him even if they didn't vote for him or who claimed they didn't "like" the way to acted will never turn around and see him for what he is.
I do kind of enjoy that though. Show how they consider "consistency" more important than the truth.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - GMDino - 12-17-2020
This is perfectly normal.
I'm sure.
Here's Michael Flynn on Newsmax saying that Trump could order "military capabilities" to swing states and "rerun an election in each of those states."
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) December 18, 2020
"People out there talk about martial law like it's something that we've never done. Martial law has been instituted 64 times." pic.twitter.com/KNmiAGGiPF
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - Nately120 - 12-18-2020
(12-17-2020, 10:58 PM)GMDino Wrote: This is perfectly normal.
I'm sure.
Here's Michael Flynn on Newsmax saying that Trump could order "military capabilities" to swing states and "rerun an election in each of those states."
— Aaron Rupar (@atrupar) December 18, 2020
"People out there talk about martial law like it's something that we've never done. Martial law has been instituted 64 times." pic.twitter.com/KNmiAGGiPF
I'm going to go out on a limb and assume Flynn doesn't consider Ohio and Florida swing states anymore now that they're Trump strongholds.
RE: Election Challenges, Protests, Conspiracy Theories, and Moral Panics - BmorePat87 - 12-18-2020
Incoming Senator Tommy Tuberville, who revealed a few weeks back that he doesn’t even know what the 3 branches of government are or why we fought in WWII, named Trump the best President in his lifetime .
Better than Eisenhower, JFK, LBJ, Reagan, or anyone else since 1954.
Speaking of the greatest president of the last 65 years, Trump has been quiet on the hack and soaring covid deaths. What has he done recently?