(01-12-2016, 01:33 AM)Fresno B Wrote: Only difference is McCarron actually brought us back and took the lead IN THE PLAYOFFS. We scored more in the 4th quarter more than we have in the past 4 playoff games combined.

(01-12-2016, 01:48 AM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Sounds about right for a back up don't you think And a top 7 quarterback

(01-12-2016, 01:24 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: My opinion of McCarron is that he's a very promising young backup. I think he could wind up starting for a few teams. In no way do I think he's better than Dalton though. Pocket awareness isn't there and his accuracy, arm and smarts aren't on Dalton's level. Of course, Dalton is a top 10 QB in this league. As for the playoff game, I think McCarron looked pretty awful through 3 quarters. Partly due to rainy conditions, but you can't let the rain cause 3 fumbles and a pick. He did pull it together in the 4th, and his defense gave him the opportunity to still be in it at that point.

(01-12-2016, 02:51 AM)TheLeonardLeap Wrote: That's what would terrify me if McCarron ever had to start 16 games. The Bengals have a good OL. It might not be the best OL ever, but it's certainly in the top fourth of the league.

Reading the defense can be taught more or less. Going through your reads/keeping your eyes downfield can be taught for most.... but pocket awareness? It seems to be more of something someone either has or doesn't.

15 sacks in just shy of 5 games behind the same OL that Dalton only got sacked 21 times last year in 16, and 20 times in 12 and a bit more games this year. McCarron in 16 games projects to take 48-49 sacks behind a top fourth OL. That's not good, even less so for a QB who's rather thin at 6'3, 210lbs.

Hopefully we never have to find out what'd happen in 16 games, but if I were McCarron, reading zone defenses and speeding up getting the ball out of his hands is what I would be working the entire offseason on. Maybe call up the guy who worked with Dalton?

(01-12-2016, 03:01 AM)BigSeph Wrote: Dalton is traditionally behind one guy in the NFL when it comes to getting the ball out of his hands - Tom Brady.

Now, if Andrew Luck was Tom Brady's backup, you would say that Andrew Luck has no pocket awareness.  Yet that isn't traditionally an opinion that is voiced around the NFL.

McCarron's time to getting the ball out would be faster if he had more experience.  This would make the OL look better.  Andy came into the NFL with an unusual ability to make a decision with the ball and get it out of his hands.  It took Brady years to get there, Andy came in with that skill already rivaling the best in the NFL.

McCarron's issue is hesitation.  He's unsure of where to go with the ball and what the defense is doing right now.  He's started 4 games.  It will improve.

I don't know that it will ever improve enough to be competitive with Andy's throw times.  Andy is just that good at it.

Andy's quick time to throw masks OL deficiencies.  McCarron's hesitation and middle of the pack time to throw exaggerates OL deficiencies.

I wouldn't call the issue "pocket awareness."  I would call it being green and unsure of where to go with the ball when it's snapped.

(01-10-2016, 01:51 PM)BengalChris Wrote: With Burfict, Jones, Hill and Marvin Lewis getting the spot light from last night's meltdown it's hard to think about anyone else.

However, AJ McCarron, despite some mistakes and fumbles early played a decent second half and moved the ball. He also had some nice pinpoint passes to put us ahead. He didn't panic or fold or chuck it up in desperation. For a guy in his 4th start I think he handled himself pretty well. He's going to be an asset for the Bengals.

Just thought he deserved some credit for what he did right and helping them get into a position to win.

(01-12-2016, 03:21 AM)Utts Wrote: He played lousy for most of the game, and had a decent 4th Quarter. Whether or not he could start in this league remains to be seen, but he's us reason to think maybe he can.

(01-12-2016, 03:27 AM)treee Wrote: He has shown that he has potential. 

(01-11-2016, 06:47 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: So what is your point really.. are you trying to say AJM is a better QB than Dalton ?? I am not getting your point really . 


My point is pretty simple.. AJM did a serviceable job as Daltons replacement but he is what he is.. the backup.. Dalton is a superior QB.. could AJM develop to Dalton;s level maybe.. will he with the Bengals.. probably not.


So let me ask you a simple question:   Do you believe Andy Dalton is a better QB right not to lead the Bengals  or would you want AJM to lead the Bengals next year ?  Yes or No is all im asking for.. not what ifs, what could be etc.

(01-11-2016, 06:54 PM)muskiesfan Wrote: For all the shit Dalton takes, his elite receiver gets away with a ton. I love Green, hands down my favorite player on the team. However, he hasn't stepped up in the playoffs either and that can't all be put on Dalton. That's not an excuse and that's not trying to boost Dalton. That's simply saying our elite player needs to step up and be elite when it counts as well.

(01-11-2016, 06:53 PM)Bengalholic Wrote: In fairness, AJ is the only Bengals QB in the 7 Lewis era playoff games to actually have a late game lead. Whatever you think of him, it's not like any Bengals QB has lit up in the playoffs in recent years...including Palmer, Kitna and Dalton. 

I've also noticed a weird trend since Andy went down. Some of the people that were hardcore Andy fans...who used to chastise anyone who offered criticism of Andy and would always tell others to 'support their QB'...are now the same ones doing some serious criticizing of AJ, bordering on the irrational. What happened to supporting the QB? Does that only apply when it's 'your guy'?

I've always been an Andy supporter, although my confidence in him has been up and down at times. He had an outstanding year, and it was awesome to see. When he went down, I thought AJ stepped up and performed admirably for a guy seeing his first NFL action. I just don't get some of the over the top criticism and negativity towards him.

(01-12-2016, 02:06 PM)gobobro Wrote: I think AJ has shown to be the best backup of the Marvin Lewis era. I don't know if that translates to the growth that makes him a starter. Some guys keep growing year after year. Some guys plateau early. I just don't know. I will tell you the things I think he needs to work on:

1. He has to shorten that release of his. He has a slow wind up that was the reason for that fumble.

2. He needs to speed up his pre-snap work. He takes a long time getting to the point of snapping the ball, and that's caused a few delay of games. His mind isn't fast yet enough pre or post snap. He has to get faster... You can't get to the point of learning to audible to better plays if you're struggling to get the called play executed in time.

3. He needs to learn to anticipate. A very college thing for quarterbacks is to wait until a guy is open to decide to throw to him. You just can't always do that in the NFL, especially with the slow release. Dalton has always had the ability to read, react, and throw balls before a guy even makes his break. AJM needs to learn to do that... He left a lot of plays on the field in his starts.



If I'm AJM (and Dalton), I'm seeing Tom House several times during the off season. The progress is stunning with Andy, and needs to continue throughout his career. If AJM wants to get to a starting spot in the NFL, he needs to seek out the kind of help the other good quarterbacks look for...


He's a heck of a kid, and I think he can make strides. At this point, I wouldn't bet a penny that he will or won't make that leap to starter. He's projecting fine, though.

(01-11-2016, 10:08 PM)Essex Johnson Wrote: Here is the major problem with your post.. you go after Dalton for AJM performance.. why do you have a hard on against Dalton.. Praise AJM I have no problem with that... but why bring Dalton into it.. the problem is that the people that praised AJM at same time throw Dalton under the bus and he did not even play in the damn game.. give me a break.

I am also glad you are such a great study on a QB after 4 games.. I am guessing you would have had Bruce or Kearns in the Hall of Fame for baseball  after a month or two performances when they started... 

The other problem is you are talking apples to oranges.. this has zero to do with Andy's first 4 games (which by the way was a straight up rookie with less weapons than we have today for sure ) vs. AJM that has been with the team for two years now.... big difference.. Also we don;t have a Starting QB that just completed 4 games.. we have a backup that just completed 4 games.

What we have at starting Qb is a 5 TIME PLAYOFF LEAD QB.. that is rated in top 5 to 7 in the NFL... why in the world would you trade him... but I figured out why you would trade him.. 

I will take Dalton's level right now over AJM all day.. Remember what potential means " you have not done shit yet"... after just 4 games that is pretty much where AJM stands on the big NFL picture.. I like AJM but this Dalton bashing after a MVP season just shows how bad you hate Dalton

(01-12-2016, 01:24 AM)Shake n Blake Wrote: Best post in the thread. 100% agree with all of this, especially the bolded. I like McCarron. I just don't like the different set of standards.

The fact that the Bengals D limited the Steelers to 15 points through 3.9 quarters is the only reason the game was close. The offense was abysmal through 3 quarters and McCarron's numbers (68.3 rating, 3 fumbles, 1 INT) were very Dalton-like, probably worse actually. Dalton has the exact same game and the narrative would be totally different. We all know this. Instead of all the talk about Hill's fumble and the penalties at the end, people would be blaming Dalton's turnovers and how he should've led the offense to more points against a piss poor secondary. No mention would be made of rainy conditions (that would be deemed an excuse). 

My opinion of McCarron is that he's a very promising young backup. I think he could wind up starting for a few teams. In no way do I think he's better than Dalton though. Pocket awareness isn't there and his accuracy, arm and smarts aren't on Dalton's level. Of course, Dalton is a top 10 QB in this league. As for the playoff game, I think McCarron looked pretty awful through 3 quarters. Partly due to rainy conditions, but you can't let the rain cause 3 fumbles and a pick. He did pull it together in the 4th, and his defense gave him the opportunity to still be in it at that point. 

I guess I'd give him a D+ for his performance on Saturday. It seems McCarron fans are giving him more of a B-. If Dalton had the same performance - at any point - it would've been an emphatic F. Any positive McCarron has is exaggerated and any negative is downplayed. It's the exact opposite of how these same people treat Dalton.